Yaum ul Quds !!

[Mosamania]

Bottom line is that Arabs actively destroyed Ottomen empire.

However Arabs cannot be blamed for Ottoman destruction. They were sick, and they were going to die soon anyway.


Where Palistinians made mistake is to not sense the change in world especially during and after WWII.


During WWII, Peli leader Mufti Azam became Hitler / Nazi's toady. He was given some kind of ministry in the sham court of Hitler.

Once the WWII was over, Palis sided with Commie Soviets.

This was a series of blunders by Palistinian leaders including Mufti Azam and then Arafat to pick the wrong super power.

In both cases first the Nazis and then Commies were defeated and what they say! If you side with losers you will be a loser.

Jordanian king begged Palistinians not to do terror attacks on Israel. But they didn't listen. When Israeli army came knocking, these so called Fidayeen ran like rats.

Another cruel thing that Fidayeen and Arabs nationalists never understood that hijacking airlines is a dumbest thing to do.

The whole world peed on them when they saw Palestinians hijacking planes.

Terror without correct political alliance is loose loose proposition. But Palestinians and Arab nationalists continued doing so as if there was no end.


Saudis btw started out right. They were forward looking, they picked the right super power, and they controlled themselves until 1980s.

However unfortunately the educated Saudi youth succumbed to the mirage of pan-Islamism and thus ended up siding with terror.


The bottom line is that WWI actions were not the only mistake made by Arabs.

There were blunder after blunder after blunder that resulted in the current mess.


peace.

I guess if you wanted to live to your name you would have mentioned that the 1948 war the soviets were the ones helping Israel through Czechoslovakia. And the British were with Arabs at the time......

And when you say "Bottom line Arabs actively destroyed the Ottomans" you are generalizing ALL Arabs. A true Historian would never do the mistake of Generalization.

 

[FaujHistorian]

....then you would have known that in 2002 the tables have turned around. And now it is no longer us who are denying peace. So "calling for Israel's destruction" rhetoric wont work here.
....

2002 plan is mainly pushed by pro-US Saudi Royals. And it is a good plan.

Many Arab nationalists, Hamas and other Islamists + Hizbullah keep shooting them in their feet.

Hope that PLO lead gov continues using peaceful non-violent means and I assure you there will be success in the end.

Peace.

 

[DADU]

Indo-Pakistani War of 1971 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

" The PAF played a more limited part in the operations, and were reinforced by F-104s from Jordan, Mirages from an unidentified Middle Eastern ally (probably Libya) and by F-86s from Saudi Arabia. Their arrival helped camouflage the extent of Pakistan's losses. Libyan F-5s were reportedly deployed to Sargodha, perhaps as a potential training unit to prepare Pakistani pilots for an influx of more F-5s from Saudi Arabia"

I am sorry I do not mean to do "Minnah" in anyway I am simply replying to him.

Wikipedia is wiki trash (you can change whatever you want there)
I never use references from Wikipedia if I put them on but from books and other sites.

What you mentioned so far is nothing short of
“Apples arriving at the city gates when the war is over”

I mean with all logical senses please enlighten me to the fact that how a small country like Israel can defeat 4-5 Arab countries with numerous support from other Arab states in a few days and weeks????

Yes I know USA and USSR arms deliveries, but C’mon 5 Arab countries with all their men and weapons can’t defeat a small Jewish state????

Look at that situation and compare to India which is 10x larger than Pakistan but never defeated us in open combat except 71 (situation was different)

This is laughable but is a reality
peace

 

[Mosamania]

2002 plan is mainly pushed by pro-US Saudi Royals. And it is a good plan.

Many Arab nationalists, Hamas and other Islamists + Hizbullah keep shooting them in their feet.

Hope that PLO lead gov continues using peaceful non-violent means and I assure you there will be success in the end.

Peace.

The main reason the plan was set forward was because Israel would be 100% the one to shoot it in its feet and that they did. And now plan 2 for the already foreseen failure of plan 1 is to go straight to the UN to ask for a state. And in September history will diverge into two. I wonder which one of these two will it diverge into.

 

[Mosamania]

Wikipedia is wiki trash (you can change whatever you want there)
I never use references from Wikipedia if I put them on but from books and other sites.

What you mentioned so far is nothing short of
“Apples arriving at the city gates when the war is over”

I mean with all logical senses please enlighten me to the fact that how a small country like Israel can defeat 4-5 Arab countries with numerous support from other Arab states in a few days and weeks????

Yes I know USA and USSR arms deliveries, but C’mon 5 Arab countries with all their men and weapons can’t defeat a small Jewish state????

Look at that situation and compare to India which is 10x larger than Pakistan but never defeated us in open combat except 71 (situation was different)

This is laughable but is a reality
peace

Your war only lasted 13 days... They were on their way and I think other Pakistani members here agree with me on this.

And what do you suggest the Arab countries to do then?? Make a Million man march with soldier armed with rifles and the ones who can't get it are armed with swords and sticks into Palestine??

But then again I am debating with someone who only read cover stories and made assumptions accordingly.

 

[Drawn_Sword_of_God]

you guys are right, saudi arabia also gave pakistan 50 000 barrels of oil when pakistan was under sanctions

 

[Mosamania]

you guys are right, saudi arabia also gave pakistan 50 000 barrels of oil when pakistan was under sanctions

I am really really sorry if this sounded like "Minnah" I really hate this act but I had to debate with him on somethingز

 

[Drawn_Sword_of_God]

Wikipedia is wiki trash (you can change whatever you want there)
I never use references from Wikipedia if I put them on but from books and other sites.

What you mentioned so far is nothing short of
“Apples arriving at the city gates when the war is over”

I mean with all logical senses please enlighten me to the fact that how a small country like Israel can defeat 4-5 Arab countries with numerous support from other Arab states in a few days and weeks????

Yes I know USA and USSR arms deliveries, but C’mon 5 Arab countries with all their men and weapons can’t defeat a small Jewish state????

Look at that situation and compare to India which is 10x larger than Pakistan but never defeated us in open combat except 71 (situation was different)

This is laughable but is a reality
peace

71 wasn't a defeat it was a betrayal and backstab

---------- Post added at 09:25 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:23 AM ----------

I am really really sorry if this sounded like "Minnah" I really hate this act but I had to debate with him on something?

what do u mean???

 

[Mosamania]

71 wasn't a defeat it was a betrayal and backstab

---------- Post added at 09:25 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:23 AM ----------



what do u mean???

"Minnah" is the act of showing what one gave to the other to humiliate them. I hate to bring such topics up because I am afraid that I will commit such a thing even if through misunderstanding since God cursed those who do Minnah.

 

[DADU]

Now I am convinced you are not a Pakistani, or at least a main stream Pakistani.

BURGER BOY you sound pretty brave behind a computer.

You are an Israeli stooge pretending to be a Pakistani or Anti Pakistan Shia.

Bayghayrut mein aur Ghayratmund mein bara farq hai BURGER BOY.

I had the same problem as you earlier on.

It happens

Relax and calm down

The burger boy you are mentioning will forget all values, engage in un-Islamic activity, drugs, sex, rock an roll will become part of his life and leave behind his family/ friends.

Then they will go off and have a beard and become martyr for Islam.

Hopefully some 1 will approach you and show you the right way to respecting others.

And lastly I don’t eat burgers bobby.

Your war only lasted 13 days... They were on their way and I think other Pakistani members here agree with me on this.

And what do you suggest the Arab countries to do then?? Make a Million man march with soldier armed with rifles and the ones who can't get it are armed with swords and sticks into Palestine??

But then again I am debating with someone who only read cover stories and made assumptions accordingly.

November 21 1971 till December 16 1971 official Pakistan record of start of 3rd indo pak war
13 days LOL if so then it was still longer than 6 days (same situation aggressor attacked 1st )

Well they could have won if they really had a desire to win even with sticks and stones the Russians fought to the last in Stalingrad why couldn’t the Arabs???????

So in that context I admire Israel as both pak and Israel were facing odds of 5 to 1 and both showed exemplary courage in the face of overwhelmingly forces and also defeating many of them in battle.

Cover stories or not anything is better than wiki trash
peace

 

[Mosamania]

November 21 1971 till December 16 1971 official Pakistan record of start of 3rd indo pak war
13 days LOL if so then it was still longer than 6 days (same situation aggressor attacked 1st )

Well they could have won if they really had a desire to win even with sticks and stones the Russians fought to the last in Stalingrad why couldn’t the Arabs???????

So in that context I admire Israel as both pak and Israel were facing odds of 5 to 1 and both showed exemplary courage in the face of overwhelmingly forces and also defeating many of them in battle.

Cover stories or not anything is better than wiki trash
peace

And I do not understand which do you call the aggressor of the two?? And you wanted a war where 200,000 people will lose their lives in? No general in his right mind would send endless amount of soldiers to a battle hoping to deplete the enemy's ammunition with bodies.

And don't act like you know everything that happened in the 6 day war. Or the wars after that for that matter.

 

[DADU]

And I do not understand which do you call the aggressor of the two?? And you wanted a war where 200,000 people will lose their lives in? No general in his right mind would send endless amount of soldiers to a battle hoping to deplete the enemy's ammunition with bodies.

And don't act like you know everything that happened in the 6 day war. Or the wars after that for that matter.

Who told you we wanted a war where 200,000 people will die????? You mean East Pakistan??????? That was an internal matter to send soldiers to capture or kill anti state elements but unfortunately due to a lot of mistakes civilians also died …

Pak government has learned that lesson but you Arabs haven’t
Killing peaceful people who are protesting against your oppressive ruthless regimes in Syria, Libya, Yemen and Bahrain.

I meant Israel attacked Arabs in 67 and India attacked pak in 71 you probably never studied world history before maybe they don’t teach anything other than Arab history in Saudi schools.
All your equipment is western and you hire trainers and instructors because your own army doesn’t know how to use them!!

No general in his right mind would send endless amount of soldiers to a battle hoping to deplete the enemy's ammunition with bodies.

Russians (ww1 – ww2) , Chinese against Japanese, British (Somme 1916) Japanese against Americans in pacific ww2 and even Arabs (Iranians too)in recent Iran –Iraq war and subsequent gulf wars.

And don’t act like you know everything about Pakistani affairs and its issues. You are an Arab so it’s not surprizing your knowledge might be limited to the issues surrounding Arab league.

Saudi Arabia is good only for the Saudi Arabians; the king is generous showering billions of dollars on Saudi economy, schools institutions to keep Arabs such as your self-locked away and being made to worship him all day.

Your cities are being built by workers from India, Pakistan, and Bangladesh, your buildings designed by western architects while you just sit and eat. I mean apart from oil what do the Arabs have to offer to the world???????

I honestly have nothing against the Arabs but don’t bring us in your affairs and hide behind Islamic ummah when we all know the racist attitudes of many Arabs and their insistence as guardians of the holy places??

My blood boils whenever I hear a Pakistani or a non-Arab Muslim get beheaded in Saudi Arabia.

Do you Arabs think you are superior to non-arab Muslims who gave you the right to end life?????

PEACE

 

[Mosamania]

Who told you we wanted a war where 200,000 people will die????? You mean East Pakistan??????? That was an internal matter to send soldiers to capture or kill anti state elements but unfortunately due to a lot of mistakes civilians also died …

Pak government has learned that lesson but you Arabs haven’t
Killing peaceful people who are protesting against your oppressive ruthless regimes in Syria, Libya, Yemen and Bahrain.

I meant Israel attacked Arabs in 67 and India attacked pak in 71 you probably never studied world history before maybe they don’t teach anything other than Arab history in Saudi schools.
All your equipment is western and you hire trainers and instructors because your own army doesn’t know how to use them!!



Russians (ww1 – ww2) , Chinese against Japanese, British (Somme 1916) Japanese against Americans in pacific ww2 and even Arabs (Iranians too)in recent Iran –Iraq war and subsequent gulf wars.

And don’t act like you know everything about Pakistani affairs and its issues. You are an Arab so it’s not surprizing your knowledge might be limited to the issues surrounding Arab league.

Saudi Arabia is good only for the Saudi Arabians; the king is generous showering billions of dollars on Saudi economy, schools institutions to keep Arabs such as your self-locked away and being made to worship him all day.

Your cities are being built by workers from India, Pakistan, and Bangladesh, your buildings designed by western architects while you just sit and eat. I mean apart from oil what do the Arabs have to offer to the world???????

I honestly have nothing against the Arabs but don’t bring us in your affairs and hide behind Islamic ummah when we all know the racist attitudes of many Arabs and their insistence as guardians of the holy places??

My blood boils whenever I hear a Pakistani or a non-Arab Muslim get beheaded in Saudi Arabia.

Do you Arabs think you are superior to non-arab Muslims who gave you the right to end life?????

PEACE

200,000 people died in the defense of Stalingrad......that was what I meant....And everyone here knows I never attack Pakistan or Pakistani at all....The same thing does not apply to some people who keep repeating the same things over and over and over again.

And lol PressTV. Akh I wish our media would bring news about Iran but alas. We respect them but the feeling is not mutual. And again double lol about "dangling the corpse from a helicopter".

 

[TARIQ BN ZIYAAD]

you guys are right, saudi arabia also gave pakistan 50 000 barrels of oil when pakistan was under sanctions

Assalam alaikum

jazak Allah bhai, hum yeh nahi boltay lekin hum agr lar nahi saktay ya kuch nahi ker saktay lekin humdardi k sirf bol hi bol dain la.
just imagine when we had earthquake and somebody comes in and start saying u pakistanies derseved it coz u did so in the past

TARIQ

 

[Mosamania]

Assalam alaikum

jazak Allah bhai, hum yeh nahi boltay lekin hum agr lar nahi saktay ya kuch nahi ker saktay lekin humdardi k sirf bol hi bol dain la.
just imagine when we had earthquake and somebody comes in and start saying u pakistanies derseved it coz u did so in the past

TARIQ

Tariq you have been in Saudi Arabia do we hang corpses from helicopters???