Xinjiang Province: News & Discussions

[xunzi]

The fact of the matter is that there will always be radical groups whenever a nation state rules various peoples of differing ethnic and religious origin. Indonesia had fought wars in suppressing terrorist organizations such as JI (Jeremiyyah Islamiyah) as well as separatist groups from Irian Jaya, and even in Aceh (Sumatra), and with an inclusive policy, the country has been progressive. In fact, there is a lot China can learn from Indonesia.

As for India, well India is literally the thesis of a heterogeneous nation state. It's 1.2+ billion population is composed of people with different religious backgrounds, ethnic and racial backgrounds, so it has to have policies to understand the religious and ethnic sensitivities. Despite some issues of corruption and infringement, which i believe can be fixed with proper policies, India is a thriving democracy (the world's largest), and a growing economic player.

The point i'm foraying to you is that China can learn from a paradigm shift of authoritarian rule to a more inclusive 'enligthened' policies that are conducive for the Han majority as well as the ethnic minorities in the People's Republic.

There is nothing we can learn from Indonesia. Indonesia is a muslim state. Muslim and muslim click, you know? I am sure that if we become an Islam state, these Uighurs will LOVE us to dead. LOL But speaking objectively, it is time the Islamists need to look themselves in the mirror and ask if they can live peacefully and accept other religion and people that are different and don't follow their faith.

We have given preferential treatment to ethnic minorities. Can we do more? certainly! But let be honest here, very few minority of Uighurs are extremist. Most are okay happily living in the Greater China in which prosperity and opportunity will exist for them if they have the merit.

 

[Targon]

As I mentioned before talks of some Chinese friends here is similar to what we had in the process of Kurdish issue, "We will exterminate them, our iron hand, cHiNa StRoNg, behold before the mighty Chinese army"

These are nothing but empty talk, no, you're not gonna exterminate any sh.t, we are in 21th century, not middle ages, its no longer possible to do such things without having heavy consequences.

All you gonna do is use violence as far as limit allows, such as killing protestors, unjust arrests, tortures, which will not solve your problems, you can't simply shut mouths of millions of people, soon or later you will understand your way does nothing but harm, you will try to gain them back by giftly rights, or you will just let them go.

 

[Aepsilons]

The fact is first they cannot find work because they cannot speak Chinese then even if they learn Chinese they see signs saying hiring hans so what do you expect from them? They will remain in their traditional ways because they have no other option.

Correct. The only way to solve the problem is for the government (central) to implement policies that encourage Uighyur inclusion into the general society.

Alienation does nothing. In fact, China can learn from Russia's policies in Chechnya. After years of war, pouring economic development in Chechnya has helped in reduce ethnic tensions there. Same for Indonesia's formerly restive region in Irian Jaya.

There is nothing we can learn from Indonesia. Indonesia is a muslim state. Muslim and muslim click, you know? I am sure that if we become an Islam state, these Uighurs will LOVE us to dead. LOL But speaking objectively, it is time the Islamists need to look themselves in the mirror and ask if they can live peacefully and accept other religion and people that are different and don't follow their faith.

We have given preferential treatment to ethnic minorities. Can we do more? certainly! But let be honest here, very few minority of Uighurs are extremist. Most are okay happily living in the Greater China in which prosperity and opportunity will exist for them if they have the merit.

Indonesia's is a secular republic. And there are many areas in Indonesia with large Christian, Buddhist and Hindu observers. There is a large Christian population in Celebes, also in Irian Jaya, there is a large Hindu presence in Bali and surrounding islands. Indonesia is a model for many countries: 1) it will encourage inclusion and collaboration between all of its citizens iregardless of religious and ethnic background 2) the country will deal with deadly terrorist groups through military campaigns, but also will win the hearts and minds of the people through community building initiatives.

 

[KingMamba]

Correct. The only way to solve the problem is for the government (central) to implement policies that encourage Uighyur inclusion into the general society.

Alienation does nothing. In fact, China can learn from Russia's policies in Chechnya. After years of war, pouring economic development in Chechnya has helped in reduce ethnic tensions there. Same for Indonesia's formerly restive region in Irian Jaya.

Exactly and Russians had to face an insurgency that had much much much more public support in Chechnya, they militarily defeated them and then let them have autonomy and gave them opportunities to live respectfully and today Chechnya is quiet. ETIM is like an aberration compared to the Chechen insurgency which even defeated the Russians at one point.

 

[xunzi]

The fact is first they cannot find work because they cannot speak Chinese then even if they learn Chinese they see signs saying hiring hans so what do you expect from them? They will remain in their traditional ways because they have no other option.

When we teach the Uighurs the national language, they say we try to oppress their language and culture despite the fact majorities of Chinese are bilingual, speak dialect and national language. When we give preferential treatment for school and upper level school, they say we do to brainwash their kids. When jobs are posted, they expect to get the job without satisfying the requirement. How can you deal with unreasonable people? How the European dealing with Gypsies? Can you help me find some solution to that question? Let not pretend like there are not other Uighurs who can successfully work in China. There are many Uighurs who live and does work for the government. If those people can do it, why can't these other Uighurs do the same? You see, our culture will not tolerate lazy people, entitled people who believe they deserve because they are exclusive. Sometime you need to look yourselves in the mirror and find the answer.

 

[Aepsilons]

Exactly and Russians had to face an insurgency that had much much much more public support in Chechnya, they militarily defeated them and then let them have autonomy and gave them opportunities to live respectfully and today Chechnya is quiet. ETIM is like an aberration compared to the Chechen insurgency which even defeated the Russians at one point.

Precisely. It is an example of how Christian-majority, Slav Russian Federation can deal with ethnic and religious minorities. I mean there are even Mongols in Russia who are patriotic , serving in the Russian Federation Armed Forces. There's a lot China can learn in terms of nation building and policies regarding ethnic minorities.

 

[SAMEET]

Exactly and Russians had to face an insurgency that had much much much more public support in Chechnya, they militarily defeated them and then let them have autonomy and gave them opportunities to live respectfully and today Chechnya is quiet. ETIM is like an aberration compared to the Chechen insurgency which even defeated the Russians at one point.

and why Chechnya is not free because of the status they didnt earn since starting thats why kremlin impose stiff contrl on it !

 

[Aepsilons]

When we teach the Uighurs the national language, they say we try to oppress their language and culture despite the fact majorities of Chinese are bilingual, speak dialect and national language. When we give preferential treatment for school and upper level school, they say we do to brainwash their kids. When jobs are posted, they expect to get the job without satisfying the requirement. How can you deal with unreasonable people? How the European dealing with Gypsies? Can you help me find some solution to that question? Let not pretend like there are not other Uighurs who can successfully work in China. There are many Uighurs who live and does work for the government. If those people can do it, why can't these other Uighurs do the same? You see, our culture will not tolerate lazy people, entitled people who believe they deserve because they are exclusive. Sometime you need to look yourselves in the mirror and find the answer.

I don't think it is fair for you to compare Uighyur people with gypsies. There is a profound dichotomy between the former and latter.

 

[xunzi]

Indonesia's is a secular republic. And there are many areas in Indonesia with large Christian, Buddhist and Hindu observers. There is a large Christian population in Celebes, also in Irian Jaya, there is a large Hindu presence in Bali and surrounding islands. Indonesia is a model for many countries: 1) it will encourage inclusion and collaboration between all of its citizens iregardless of religious and ethnic background 2) the country will deal with deadly terrorist groups through military campaigns, but also will win the hearts and minds of the people through community building initiatives.

Indonesia is a Muslim state. Go ask the Indonesian friend.

 

[SAMEET]

I don't think it is fair for you to compare Uighyur people with gypsies. There is a profound dichotomy between the former and latter.

and why so are gypsy low esteemed people they are better then people of community in which religious supremist terrorist exist !

 

[KingMamba]

Precisely. It is an example of how Christian-majority, Slav Russian Federation can deal with ethnic and religious minorities. I mean there are even Mongols in Russia who are patriotic , serving in the Russian Federation Armed Forces. There's a lot China can learn in terms of nation building and policies regarding ethnic minorities.

Actually Russia is a horrible example of how religious minorities should be treated but the situation was similar so I brought them up.

 

[xunzi]

I don't think it is fair for you to compare Uighyur people with gypsies. There is a profound dichotomy between the former and latter.

Close your eyes and look at the problem. You will see what I'm saying is truth or not.

 

[Jlaw]

I would propose a more liberal policy that's more inclusive for China's minorities. The fact is that the Uighyurs are in China and they have been living in Xinjiang for hundreds of years , and a historical basis for their interaction with China through the silk road, connecting the West vis a vis the Middle East and Central Asia to the resources of the Orient. There is nothing wrong with having ethnic minorities and inclusive economic, political policies are the key. Take for example Russia, India, and Indonesia; these three countries have a significant land mass, large populations and many ethnic minorities that make up the national milieu, and thriving whilst at it.

Don't be a joker. We gave them affirmative action and they don't want to take advantage of it, not much more we can do. I see religion as a brainwashing tool to turn some Uighurs into extremist. blaming on poverty does not work as at one time almost all Chinese were poor but you don't see us bombing and knifing innocent people.

Religion is to blame.

 

[KingMamba]

and why Chechnya is not free because of the status they didnt earn since starting thats why kremlin impose stiff contrl on it !

Kremlin has stiff control on all the republics in the Federation but they do allow locals a large amount of self rule as long as they do not trouble the center.

 

[atatwolf]

This thread shows that you do not really know them. Uighers were always Sufis if today they are salafists it is because the CCP failed to integrate them properly, you do not force people to integrate you give then reason to do so thenselves.

Chinese are not capable of that kind of reason. They are fascist from nature. That is why in my first response I said. Independence is only way for peace. More strict control will make the situation even worse and accelate the brake up of East-Turkistan and Tibet.