Widespread criticism over rationale for new law to ‘protect’ Islam

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

I stand corrected. Liberals are also making big noise against this bill along with shias. Also some political rivals are also playing politics. I was just discussing about shias as our of all the critics of this bill, they are the main party as far as this bill in concerned. Anyways, your point is duly noted.

It is unfortunate than some leaders of some sects cannot see the benefit to their own communities in this bill.

You will start to get resistance from TLP types as well, who do not want a control on their irresponsible preaching.

 

[Fawad alam]

Do you even know what a 'hate crime' is defined as?

I think you understand what i was trying to say but still trying to become ignorant.

No body is above the law, if our parliament approves any law we all must follow.

 

[El Sidd]

Philosophy, Sir.

Waah jee...

Any shakk?

Most people commenting here about thrown into dark ages are kattar liberals?

 

[HAIDER]

Truly disappointing, this country is being dragged into the dark ages.

This is started due to PMLq under microscope and trying to topple PTI in Punjab. These Chaudry brothers are proven snakes , which Imran Khan totally failed to understand. Plus Punjab interior minister Raja Basharat old PMLn and PMLq crony ..recently join PTI.

Federal govt orders formal investigations, action against 'sugar cartel'

Chaudhry’s of Gujrat laundered money: NAB

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

It is unfortunate than some leaders of some sects cannot see the benefit to their own communities in this bill.

You will start to get resistance from TLP types as well, who do not want a control on their irresponsible preaching.

I oppose laws like this (Blasphemy laws) on principle - almost all the sects support the existing blasphemy laws. That doesn't make those laws any less draconian or open to abuse, and abuse is going to be the result of these recent laws as well, especially if they do not have built in protections for the accused and punishment for those making false allegations.

No body is above the law, if our parliament approves any law we all must follow.

A law must be obeyed once it is passed in the jurisdiction where the law is applicable, but that does not mean it cannot be opposed before its passage and it can be opposed and campaigns launched for its repeal after its passage.

People like you and me can learn to ignore such stuff, in fact we are already ignoring. But what about masses in our country? You know how much blood has shed in our country because of these sectarian issues and blasphemy and all? Not everyone can / will learn to ignore and ignoring is not a solution.

Tell me one thing, what do you think is easier? Teaching 80% of population to learn to ignore or rest of 20% to shut their mouths in public?

For a country and society to evolve and advance, the majority of people in said society and country MUST learn to stop violating the law and engaging in violence.

Pandering to those who have shed blood and engaged in violence is not a solution to this problem - it only emboldens and justifies that kind of behavior.

We aren't going for global censorship

We just want to have laws inside the country so that hate speech doesn't prevail in the country

How is that wrong?

It's not hate speech, it's criticism of historical figures. I see nothing wrong with that.

What I do see as hate speech are the disparaging and abusive comments against Shia or other sects and faiths I have seen on this forum time and again.

 

[truthfollower]

others found deeply offensive.

other side need to learn some tolerance and grow up

all sects.

how many sects are there? and whats the % in Pakistan?

 

[313ghazi]

other side need to learn some tolerance and grow up

how many sects are there? and whats the % in Pakistan?

How many Gods do you have? It's still hinduism right? Religious differences within Islam are minimal and often based on very high level concepts. The differences can range from a 5 minute difference in prayer times to whether you can pray for the deceased or not etc. It is not major. Any rifts are political.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

However, coming from a predominantly Shia family myself, I will state that I disagree with criticism certain Shia engage in with respect to the Sahaba or Hazrat Ayesha. Those are major religious figures and I think that all sects should be respectful of such figures (whether they agree or disagree with their actions) just as we would expect non-Muslims to respect the Prophet Mohammed.

But at the same time, research and discussions on the actions of religious figures, even if critical, should be allowed so long as it is done respectfully.

 

[truthfollower]

This is started due to PMLq under microscope and trying to topple PTI in Punjab. These Chaudry brothers are proven snakes , which Imran Khan totally failed to understand. Plus Punjab interior minister Raja Basharat old PMLn and PMLq crony ..recently join PTI.

they ended musharaf and now will end PTI too dont trust them

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

FYI - this is a political issue since it involves the passage of laws impacting people and therefore discussion around said laws is necessary.

 

[HAIDER]

they ended musharaf and now will end PTI too dont trust them

wonder why the most corrupt Nawaz refused to accept these brothers back to his party. And PTI amaze me when they chose this guy speaker of Punjab assembly. They did , what these brothers famous for ...This time they played very nasty religious card to protect there kursi and asset.

 

[truthfollower]

wonder why the most corrupt Nawaz refused to accept these brothers back to his party. And PTI amaze me when they chose this guy speaker of Punjab assembly. They did , what these brothers famous for ...This time they played very nasty religious card to protect there kursi and asset.

at 3:32:10
look at this these snake chaudries never allowed a minister to remove their favorite guy from post and even after orders from minister he remained on the post and here PTI gave this snake Chaudry a speaker assembly post

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

TLP should have been banned the moment it was formed, don't know why we let these kind of elements to flourish. That lal masjid mullah is also roaming free, my blood starts boiling whenever I see that a-hole. He's increasing his following every passing day. Then we have likes of Molvi diesel who also has thousands of brain dead zombie followers.

I don't know why we drag these situations out longer than expected, like some drawn out soap opera which everyone wants to endm

I know for a fact Mauvia is a very controversial figure for us Shias, I will never call him and his SoB son Hazrat, hang me if you want.

I agree with you. You shouldn't have to compromise on that.

Muawiya bin Abu Sufyan was a controversial figure for Sunnis as well, but he was still Sahabi. After he usurped Khilafat from Hazrat Ali, he was actually wajib ul qatl. Interesting to note that even though Abu Sufyan pushed him to be close to the Prophet Muhammad saws, he never became a close companion as many other famous ones. Prophet Muhammad saws knew all the future fitan which will inflict the Ummah.

However we leave final judgement up to Allah swt as He is the final judge.

As for Yazid, he was not Sahabah, so he is fair game. Actually many famous Sunni ulema even sent La'nat on him like Shias. I think we are all in agreement that he was a tyrant.

Can you bring Evidence of Ali RA imammat and Ahle bayt 's acceptance of Leadership from the Quran ? forget that, just show me if Quran even mention Ali , Fatima , Hasan and Hussain or anyone's of your Gayab and Zahir Imam's name from the Quran ? let me make it easier for you, show me where did Prophet Muhammad Pbuh unequivocally said among the thousands of his companions that after me Ali RA must be your leader ? His last Sermon was best time to make this right ? Do you think Muhammad PBUH was unaware of that his death is near and after him there will be leadership issues ? and you think he left this untouched ? do you really think that According to Shia believing in Imam's is one of the core believe and yet not a single word about that in Quran ? Rest of the 5 Articles of Faith are mentioned quite directly in Quran along with the 5 Pillars why not Imammat if that was such a life and death Issue ?
Oh and before you call me a Ahly Byte hater , Prophet's wives are also his family , his daughters not just Fatima RA are also his Family , to extended degree Umar , Abu Bakr and Uthman RA to all are his extended family members so why its hard for Shia to use their names with Respect ? why they are so hell bent of turning Islam into a Nepotism that Imammat starts with Ali, then stays in his family ? only Ali's Family is the worthy one ? then why i am being unfairly born into not Ali's family ? You know why Islam pride itself over other religions, because all Muslims ( except for Anbiya ) are equals , they only become greater to one another because of their taqwa and devotion to Allah, not Taqqiya ..

Dear brother, please do not promote this kind of rhetoric against our Shia Brothers and sisters. This is not the place to discuss this

Allah swt accept all of our good deeds and forgive our mistakes. We are all Muslim, Ummat of Muhammad saws.

 

[VCheng]

How come they are private when they are taught in public?

Allowing government to enforce religion is a mistake, as this thread shows it yet again, but as a nation we choose to ignore it to our everlasting detriment.

 

[Moonlight]

Religious discussion that is getting into sectarianism so,

Thread locked.