Why has India traditionally adopted a defensive policy on Pakistan?

[Indika]

So my question for Indian members of PDF is as simple as this:

• What the heck is wrong with you people? When will you stop behaving like our Palestinian brothers who never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity?
• When will you grow up and act responsibly towards solving the Kashmir dispute by either hook or crook, thus ushering an era of peace and prosperity in the region? Having two nuclear armed states involved in proxy warfare against each other is not exactly solving anything.

Things are not so linear and simple. 1947 saw a lot of blood shed and displacement of ppl. In 1971 India at the best could have made LOC as international boundary. If india has forced pakistan to cede territory or gain gain ground in kashmir another displacement would have taken place. Luckily or unluckily due to indias ineptitude that dint happen.
India would have gained territory and avenged historical wrongs but at the cost several lives.

Well most of the pakistanis wont agree, India is a civilized nation and has better statesmen right from gandhi to modi. Its only small kids that go astray. We will keep that way.

 

[Rockets]

Dude you don't see that using Nuclear missiles on Indian cold star doctrine will lead to MAD of Pakistan. It is also well known so Pakistan will get themself killed
Also did you see both the tarilers If no then see it and comment it.

 

[hussain0216]

Indians are ball less thats why

They are 7 times larger than Pakistan, these odds should have been a slam dunk a walk in the park
But because indians are ball less they couldn't do nothing


Because india is 7 times larger there was always going to be a conventional imbalance but Pakistan is a considerable conventional power


Where arjunk failed Al khalid is a reality
Where LCA is a 40 year old paperweight JF 17 is notching up export orders and interest

Where we have been flying F16 and ancient airframes india has half of its su30s in for servicing


On future we will have 10 + AIP sub and second strike
more jf17s possible J11,
Another front line tank and we working on everything from MIRV to drones



The fact that we have 200 nuclear warheads pointed at india just makes india even more impotent

Wait till our economy improves india is in for a shock

 

[Stephen Cohen]

@Norwegian

You must take a close and HARD look at your country

And then say whether your policy has worked or not

We have to contend with TWO enemies ; so our policy must be well thought of

We have the Kashmir that we want ; we dont want your part

If you are asking about when a war will happen ; then it is in your hand

We both know that Pakistan cannot doing stop these terror attacks ; it has become Pakistan's nature

So your wish will be fulfilled one day

 

[Norwegian]

@Norwegian

You must take a close and HARD look at your country

And then say whether your policy has worked or not

We have to contend with TWO enemies ; so our policy must be well thought of

We have the Kashmir that we want ; we dont want your part

If you are asking about when a war will happen ; then it is in your hand

We both know that Pakistan cannot doing stop these terror attacks ; it has become Pakistan's nature

So your wish will be fulfilled one day

Nice points. I often see you commenting on Jpost. Not sure if that's YOU of course

 

[hkdas]

simple answer to both your questions is at that time we were not strong enof and had idots like nehru and his socialist freaks in power and pakistan had backing of entire west while we were in cucoon of NAM but now since cold war is over and so are its hangovers and indfian position is changing but dor pakistan its gonna be no free lunches anymore and western support is gone and things will never be the same again sure we lost opportunities in 1948,1965 &1971 but its now 2015 and have a agressive PMO & NSA so dont worry too much .... past is past you cant change it nor can you waste time on what and how things went wrong in past you have to moove on by taking lessons from past mistakes + work for present and invest for a better future

Nehru don't have the ability to saw the future... jinnah and Nehru were like brothers.. they fight against the british rule tougher, they both were top leaders of INC. nehru didn't expect pakistan will turn their gun against india. nehru was a freedom fighter. he don't have any experience in ruling a country. but he is one of the best pM india ever get. that that time nehru didn't even heard about a terrorist. and how can he know that one day pakistan will sponsor terrorism in india and will support suicide bombing and carnage in india?? nahru's try to improve the economy of the counry which British at that time said that indian can't never be a major economy and will be black hole. nehru manages to bring a country's agriculture sector to a highly productive one. his priority was the economic development so he almost ignored the defense sector. he was very successful in foreign affairs. non alignment movement was nehru's idea. no one is perfect, every one have both +ve and -ve side.
so pls don't think less of Nehru.. he was a good PM and also a good leader.

 

[Spectre]

Indians are ball less thats why

They are 7 times larger than Pakistan, these odds should have been a slam dunk a walk in the park
But because indians are ball less they couldn't do nothing


Because india is 7 times larger there was always going to be a conventional imbalance but Pakistan is a considerable conventional power


Where arjunk failed Al khalid is a reality
Where LCA is a 40 year old paperweight JF 17 is notching up export orders and interest

Where we have been flying F16 and ancient airframes india has half of its su30s in for servicing


On future we will have 10 + AIP sub and second strike
more jf17s possible J11,
Another front line tank and we working on everything from MIRV to drones



The fact that we have 200 nuclear warheads pointed at india just makes india even more impotent

Wait till our economy improves india is in for a shock

What is the readiness rate of J-17?

Regarding Arjun you should study the below report and educate yourself.

I don't even think our navies are comparable.

Arjun tank outruns, outguns Russian T-90 | Business Standard News

Let's confine the discussion to present alright as in future gap is only going to increase

Thanks

 

[Stephen Cohen]

Nice points. I often see you commenting on Jpost. Not sure if that's YOU of course

I am not on Jpost ; I am sorry that I dont even know what is Jpost

 

[livingdead]

@Norwegian 71 was an offensive approach by a beligerent Indian PM. BTW what exactly are we going to achieve by being offensive, no govt in India thinks rest of kashmir(with pakistan) will be with India.
We already got enough problems, in valley and in NE. why would we get more problem? We should try to reduce it.

 

[Indika]

Indians are ball less thats why
Wait till our economy improves india is in for a shock

Pakistan is generous country they gave half of theirs to Bangladesh. We are not a little country to be jealous of others. We live sanely ,only bother about our economic progress and citizens well being. A country's progress is not measured by tanks or bombs but only by life of their citizens. If bombs were a scale of measurement switzerland or norway must be undeveloped .

 

[Norwegian]

I am not on Jpost ; I am sorry what I dont even know what is Jpost

Could be another person using same name as yours:
Jpost.com - The Jerusalem Post newspaper's online edition

Pakistan is generous country they gave half of theirs to Bangladesh.

We also gave a large chunk of Kashmiri land to Chinese for reasons unknown...

 

[gau8av]

Last night I was going through a long history of military conflicts between India and Pakistan. Surprisingly enough, in most conflicts I found India merely defending attacks on its territory from Pakistan:

• In 1947, Indian armed forces were airlifted to Kashmiri capital of Srinagar for defense against Pakistani tribal militants. They were not allowed to land unless Pakistanis hadn't reached the capital first; an outcome of a typical defensive policy.
• In 1965, when Pakistani forces infiltrated J&K during Operation Gibraltar, India chickened out again. Instead of retaliating at Pakistani weak points such as East Pakistan, it opened another war front in Punjab which pakistanis defended vigorously.
• In 1971, India lost its chance to resolve Kashmir dispute with Pakistan, despite gaining total victory in East Pakistan. With Instrument of Surrender, India could have demanded Pakistan-controlled Kashmir in exchange of some 90,000 Pakistani POWs.
• In 1984, we see India for the first time going offensive and taking Siachen Glacier from Pakistan during Operation Meghdoot. The cost of maintaining military presence at such high-altitudes have drained budgets for both nations, yet it has no dispute solving significance for either country.
• In 1999, Pakistani forces infiltrated J&K again to regain its losses from India's Operation Meghdoot. The invaders were driven out and India did nothing to grab further territory from Pakistan. This conflict ended in a stalemate, giving birth to Pakistani wars of attrition against India.
• Since then, there has been two major standoffs in response to terrorist attacks from Pakistan. In both cases, India effectively chickened out after mobilizing its armed forces near the Pakistani borders. These standoffs have cost India billions of dollars, yet they have no conflict resolving effect on Pakistan.

So my question for Indian members of PDF is as simple as this:

• What the heck is wrong with you people? When will you stop behaving like our Palestinian brothers who never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity?
• When will you grow up and act responsibly towards solving the Kashmir dispute by either hook or crook, thus ushering an era of peace and prosperity in the region? Having two nuclear armed states involved in proxy warfare against each other is not exactly solving anything.

smaller economy, smaller forces, smaller country.. big insecurities, just like how an abso is more likely to bite you than a lab

Kashmir can be resolved only when the Pakistan establishment aka fauj stops seeing the LOC>IB solution as a defeat. India will not make a move to grab "azad" Kashmir and GB but not half an inch of our land will be ceeded

I read Siachen has a 3 year waiting list, no shortage of man power, or military hardware otherwise.

Having said that, Modi's main focus is on the economy, business and trade.. not war. lets hope the SCO leads to more co operation there and less border skirmishes and less Pak fauj backed jihadis (good terrorists) being pushed here.

 

[hussain0216]

Could be another person using same name as yours:
Jpost.com - The Jerusalem Post newspaper's online edition


We also gave a large chunk of Kashmiri land to Chinese for reasons unknown...

You mean a jew using a jew name
rather than a confused indian using a jew name

What is the readiness rate of J-17?

Regarding Arjun you should study the below report and educate yourself.

I don't even think our navies are comparable.

Arjun tank outruns, outguns Russian T-90 | Business Standard News

Let's confine the discussion to present alright as in future gap is only going to increase

Thanks

You are waaaaaayyyy behind on the Arjunk news

You mean the future where we have 11 AIP subs, second strike new tanks, missiles and jets

 

[Stephen Cohen]

@Norwegian

Regarding the present ; if you think that agreeing to talk is a setback to India
then it is not so

We must see who will talk and about what

The diplomats of MEA people talk in circles ; it is better to do some plain speaking

SO we are seeing NSA level talks for the first time

That is why we will see BSF - RANGERS and DGMO level talks also

And there is no talk on Kashmir ; that chapter is closed

The talks will will only be about conflict prevention

READ Preventing terror attacks and other border skirmishes

What is Pakistan's views on How to prevent a conflict

The Big powers want India to give one MORE chance for peace

If the upcoming talks yield nothing your wish will be fulfilled

You mean a jew using a jew name
rather than a confused indian using a jew name

I have explained this before ; This Guy Stephen P. Cohen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
is a genius ; his book Idea of Pakistan is what made me interested in Pakistan

 

[Indika]

We also gave a large chunk of Kashmiri land to Chinese for reasons unknown...

That was atrocious, its like giving away family property to a non-related person to spite your siblings. If pakistan really thought kashmir as part of their nation they would have never done it. Even if it is a barren land it holds sentimental/emotional value and belongingness. Unfortunately for pakistan, kashmir is a toy or a bargaining chip to play around with. If pakistan loves chinese so much like bhai-bhai why not give karachi away and make chinese a permanent family member ?