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Why Beijing should thank the US for its space and chip industries

beijingwalker

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Why Beijing should thank the US for its space and chip industries​

  • Individuals, corporations and nations grow in strength not by having an easy time but by confronting severe, even existential, challenges
Published: 9:00pm, 4 Oct, 2023

Andrew Tate sometimes reminds me of Arnold Toynbee, the historian and philosopher. Seriously. I often get a kick out of listening to the infamous social media personality not unjustly accused of being a misogynist and shameless self-promoter. Say what you like about Tate, though, he is often bang-on in his observations, like this one on why Prince Harry is such a whinging walking mess of a human being:

“I am not in a plushy bed at home, crying about what? That’s really Prince Harry’s book. It should have just been called ‘Privileged’. The best upbringing you can have is good parents and no money. If you don’t give a man struggles, look at what he becomes physically, mentally.

“Born in the royal family, everything’s been perfect his whole life. And struggle is subjective, so Prince Harry dealing with his current problems of his wife nagging him, that’s full mental breakdown.

“This guy has such a privileged life that he’s ended up a miserable, depressed, unhappy person. If bad things don’t happen to you, you’re gonna end up like Prince Harry. And you don’t want to end up like that dude, do you?”

OK, there was his mother’s horrendous death. But the prince is 39 years old now and he still can’t get over it. Of course, Anglo-American “woke” culture encourages victimhood, whether real or imagined, for everyone. But shouldn’t we teach people to raise above it, not wallow in it?

I was just watching Mission: Impossible – Dead Reckoning online this week where French actress Pom Klementieff plays a ruthless assassin. She also played Mantis in Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2.

I read that her father died when she was five, her mother had schizophrenia so she was raised by her uncle, who died on her 18th birthday, and then her older brother committed suicide on her 25th birthday. If her life story was a weepy script, Hollywood wouldn’t produce it for being too unrealistic. So really Harry, get a grip!

As it is with people growing up, so it is with societies developing into strong nations. Toynbee argues the same in his multi-volume A Study of History where he calls this phenomenon of success “the virtues of adversity”.

“We have been led to reject the popular assumption that civilisations emerge when environments offer unusually easy conditions of life and to advance an argument in favour of exactly the opposite view,” Toynbee wrote.

“Ease is inimical to civilisation … the greater the difficulty, the greater the stimulus.” Quite!

In the early 2000s. Nasa would even let Russian astronauts work in the International Space Station (ISS) but not the Chinese, who have been exclusively barred from entering any Nasa facilities.

Today, the Chinese have a new space station while the ISS is near its expiry date.

Or consider Huawei Technologies, the telecoms giant. How many times has Washington tried to kill it? As Edward Snowden revealed years ago and Beijing officially acknowledged last month, the United States carried out cyberattacks against Huawei HQ more than a decade ago.

US hostilities subsequently escalated to the failed prosecution of its founder’s daughter and company No 2, the current sanctions, the ban on advanced chip sales and the strong-arming of allies around the world to cut Huawei, among other Chinese tech companies, out of their supply chains.

Huawei recently delivered the Mate 60 Pro smartphone with a pretty good chip, not even the most advanced; Washington responded in anger and fear like the bad old days of the Cold War when Stalin and Mao exploded their first atomic bombs.

Huawei and the Chinese chip industry should thank the US for making life difficult so they have to develop their own capacities. That didn’t take long. Without the American challenges, they would still be mail-ordering the chips.

Tate and Toynbee are offering a timeless morality tale about the need for challenges and struggles, and the benefits that come with them – if you survive.

The Chinese space and chip industries are examples of that.

 
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Man, the author wrote a whole babbling article on some thing that Mencius the philosopher wrote more than 2000 years ago, and has become a common proverb that most Chinese would know and use,

"life springs from sorrow and calamity, and death from ease and pleasure."
 
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Huawei and the Chinese chip industry should thank the US for making life difficult so they have to develop their own capacities. That didn’t take long. Without the American challenges, they would still be mail-ordering the chips.

I think this is rightly put - as they say "necessity is the mother of invention". Americans also lost their biggest customers.
 
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Man, the author wrote a whole babbling article on some thing that Mencius the philosopher wrote more than 2000 years ago, and has become a common proverb that most Chinese would know and use,

"life springs from sorrow and calamity, and death from ease and pleasure."
Here is another.

The Chinese character for crisis is 危机 (Wei Ji)
It comes from two words.
危险 - Danger (Wei Xian)
机会 - Opportunity (Ji Hui)
 
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although our space industry became self reliant, it failed to gain much share of commercial launch globally, so from the US pov the embargo can be said somewhat successful.

therefore, getting self reliant should not be the end goal for chips, commercial success is the real success. Fiercely targeting the US top chip companies should be the next play. Out-compete them, if not, undercut them, with product that does 90% the job but cost only 40%, erode into both of their market share and profit margin, cause we all know these companies cannot survive without decent profit.

chip is about the only money making real industry left for America. once it's gone, everyone will see what a fraudulent nation the US truly is.
 
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although our space industry became self reliant, it

You have a Shenzhou spacecraft modeled on a Soyuz.

Your astronauts wear Russian spacesuits.

Your Tiangong uses Russian docking connectors.

Those are just items people can eyeball from pictures...who knows what else.

You are self reliant because some crucial stuff has been leveraged instead of you guys spending time and money on R&D like the Russians and the US have done. There were no shortcuts for either of us.

We weren't asking Martians to show us the way. Nor do we feel some strange need to "thank" them.
 
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Lol, what kind crap logic is that ? US bullied and blocked China nearly on every important front in the past decades, and China is supposed to thank US for doing that becus China developed its own space and chip industries despite US blockades and sanctions ? What kind arrogant and bigoted attitudes these Americans have that they really think they own the world no matter what.
 
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We weren't asking Martians to show us the way.
you did ask the Germans tho. Both the US and USSR took a huge piece off the Nazi V-2 rocket program after the war, robbing everything including documents, rocket parts and scientists, among which was Freiherr von Braun, head of the V-2 project, who later became the chief designer of Saturn V. Your Apollo mission couldn't have happened without a Nazi scientist showing your way, like literally.

no one has to reinvent the wheel if there is a shortcut to be taken, the US especially, as a backward nation in early 20th century still playing catch up to European powers back then, is probably the least qualified to point fingers at China for doing similar things
 
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I have been advocating for use of open source technologies over ARM and x86 architectures. If China is able to expand its efforts on production of RISC-V architecture just like it did before (RISC-V laptop on Alibaba) then it would be great.
 
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With and without USA, China will still build their space and chip industries.

The argument is irrelevant.
 
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You have a Shenzhou spacecraft modeled on a Soyuz.

Your astronauts wear Russian spacesuits.

Your Tiangong uses Russian docking connectors.

Those are just items people can eyeball from pictures...who knows what else.

You are self reliant because some crucial stuff has been leveraged instead of you guys spending time and money on R&D like the Russians and the US have done. There were no shortcuts for either of us.

We weren't asking Martians to show us the way. Nor do we feel some strange need to "thank" them.

At least you are acknowledging the stuff we built are real. Hahahaha. We would like to copy US methalox engine too btw, oooo wait
 
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Hahahaha. We would like to copy US methalox engine too btw, oooo wait

🤔 Maybe you should. Your TQ-12 methalox engine only puts out 167K of thrust while a Raptor is 510K+...and the dimensions of your engine are actually bigger. 🤷

Performance
Dimensions
Thrust, vacuum745 kilonewtons (167,000 lbf) for sea level nozzle
785 kilonewtons (176,000 lbf) for vacuum nozzle
Thrust, sea-level658 kilonewtons (148,000 lbf)
Chamber pressure10.1 MPa (1,460 psi)
Specific impulse, vacuum337s
Specific impulse, sea-level284.5s
Measurement3.9m
Diameter1.5m


Performance
Dimensions
Thrust
Raptor 2:
  • 230 tf (2.3 MN; 510,000 lbf)[6]
    (sea-level)
  • 258 tf (2.53 MN; 570,000 lbf)[7] (vacuum)
Raptor 3: 269 tf (2.64 MN; 590,000 lbf)[citation needed]
Highest achieved: 269 tf (2.64 MN; 590,000 lbf) Raptor 3, ~45 s test
Thrust-to-weight ratio143.8, sea-level
Chamber pressure
  • 300 bar (4,400 psi) nominal[8]
  • 350 bar (5,100 psi) Raptor 3, ~45 s test
Specific impulse, vacuum363 s (3.56 km/s)[9]
Specific impulse, sea-level327 s (3.21 km/s)[8]
Length3.1 m (10 ft)[13]
Diameter1.3 m (4 ft 3 in)[14]
 
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🤔 Maybe you should. Your TQ-12 methalox engine only puts out 167K of thrust while a Raptor is 510K+...and the dimensions of your engine are actually bigger. 🤷

Performance
Dimensions
Thrust, vacuum745 kilonewtons (167,000 lbf) for sea level nozzle
785 kilonewtons (176,000 lbf) for vacuum nozzle
Thrust, sea-level658 kilonewtons (148,000 lbf)
Chamber pressure10.1 MPa (1,460 psi)
Specific impulse, vacuum337s
Specific impulse, sea-level284.5s
Measurement3.9m
Diameter1.5m


Performance
Dimensions
Thrust
Raptor 2:
  • 230 tf (2.3 MN; 510,000 lbf)[6]
    (sea-level)
  • 258 tf (2.53 MN; 570,000 lbf)[7] (vacuum)
Raptor 3: 269 tf (2.64 MN; 590,000 lbf)[citation needed]
Highest achieved: 269 tf (2.64 MN; 590,000 lbf) Raptor 3, ~45 s test
Thrust-to-weight ratio143.8, sea-level
Chamber pressure
  • 300 bar (4,400 psi) nominal[8]
  • 350 bar (5,100 psi) Raptor 3, ~45 s test
Specific impulse, vacuum363 s (3.56 km/s)[9]
Specific impulse, sea-level327 s (3.21 km/s)[8]
Length3.1 m (10 ft)[13]
Diameter1.3 m (4 ft 3 in)[14]
So when is it flying? Lolol. Americans are behaving like Indians now?
 
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So when is it flying? Lolol. Americans are behaving like Indians now?

The Raptor did...5 months ago...

SpaceX 'Starship', the most powerful rocket ever built, blasts off​



First stage – Super Heavy
Powered by
  • Raptor engine (33)
Maximum thrust
  • 74,500,000 N
  • 7,590 Tf
  • 16,700,000 lbf
Payload to LEO100t - 150t (Reusable)
Up to 250t (Expendable)
 
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Bsg-viper-1.jpg
 
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