What role could PAF have played in the Kargil war??

[Stephen Cohen]

sure as hell didnt need JF-17 Thunder to cause the problem for indian army of shortages of coffins for the piles of indian corpses we left behind

Unfortunately for Pakistan Army soldiers their corpses were refused to be taken back by Pakistan

Indians buried them

And your casualties were More than ours

http://www.rediff.com/news/2003/aug/16pak.htm

Over 4,000 Pakistanis died in Kargil conflict: Nawaz Sharief

 

[Joe Shearer]

Unfortunately for Pakistan Army soldiers there corpses were refused to be taken back by Pakistan

Indians buried them

And your casualties were More than ours

http://www.rediff.com/news/2003/aug/16pak.htm

Over 4,000 Pakistanis died in Kargil conflict: Nawaz Sharief

Hey!

Stop poaching.

I get to kick arse on this thread. It's all mine.

 

[Stephen Cohen]

Hey!

Stop poaching.

I get to kick arse on this thread. It's all mine.

I thought you might need a break

 

[Iggy]

Hey!

Stop poaching.

I get to kick arse on this thread. It's all mine.

Come on sir!! You are decimating their first line of offence

 

[Joe Shearer]

I thought you might need a break

Oh, OK. But I'll be back.

Come on sir!! You are decimating their first line of offence

Only one of that line. The others went home to watch TV. Sensible blokes.

 

[Stephen Cohen]

the remains of both were found 7-10 km inside Pakistani territory, dummy ....so it's rather irrelevant

You are forgetting one point

Your soldiers were some 8 to 10 Km inside Indian territory where our planes were targetting them
and our Planes fell just INSIDE the LOC on your side and
NOT 10 KM inside the LOC as you are claiming

 

[Iggy]

Oh, OK. But I'll be back.



Only one of that line. The others went home to watch TV. Sensible blokes.

Have to say, your sense of humour and sarcasm is wicked..

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

True.

Fortunately your casualties caused no such problems. We buried them on the battlefield, because their own units denied them a military burial.

You obviously dont know how many commemorations there are for those Shaheeds once the campaign ended and your 10 times larger regular forces were taught a lesson they'd never forget

[Yes, yes, you know lots of hot words, but it still isn't Azad Kashmir, and as for being found 7 to 10 kms inside Pakistani territory, do you expect planes to stop still in mid-air and drop where they were when they were hit?

You are in a purple patch today, aren't you?

re-read my post, thick-head. The remains of those aircrafts were inside Pakistani territory so it's quite irrelevant. They were shot down and the battle preparedness of the air defense units on the ground was demonstrated.

while the inclusion of the AF helped india, i dont see it as a game-changer given the terrain and that in the absence of use of LGBs any bombing missions were mostly futile and counter productive in that they exposed the indians to danger especially putting troops on the ground via choppers (target practice for Pakistan)

On this post, I happen to be the chap correcting your ignorance of the basic facts. If you think smileys reduce your public humiliation, feel free to use as many as salve your hurt ego.

Oh Joseph....you're starting to sound like that tabloid journalist pranab goswami....are you guys related?

 

[Stephen Cohen]

while the inclusion of the AF helped india, i dont see it as a game-changer given the terrain and that in the absence of use of LGBs any bombing missions were mostly futile and counter productive in that they exposed the indians to danger especially putting troops on the ground via choppers (target practice for Pakistan)

Then you DO NOT know anything about Kargil and how effectively India used Airpower

Without IAF we could not have evicted them till winter and then the issue would have frozen in
favour of Pakistan which was the Original plan of Pakistan Army

That once winter sets in and Siachen is dis connected from India because of NH 1 A
in Pakistani hands ; India would have LOST Siachen In addition to 1000 SQ KM of
Territory from Kargil to Drass

http://carnegieendowment.org/2012/09/20/airpower-at-18-000-indian-air-force-in-kargil-war

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Then you DO NOT know anything about Kargil and how effectively India used Airpower

Without IAF we could not have evicted them till winter and then the issue would have frozen in
favour of Pakistan which was the Original plan of Pakistan Army

That once winter sets in and Siachen is dis connected from India because of NH 1 A
in Pakistani hands ; India would have LOST Siachen In addition to 1000 SQ KM of
Territory from Kargil to Drass

No it was the capitulation of nawaz sharif when he went helter skelter to Washington DC -- and with a track record of previous and subsequent treachery he was unceremoniously dismissed. As I said already your soldiers were rotting corpses in DROVES it was regrettably the PM and the govt. that couldnt with-stand the pressure from GOTUS. Just the mention the name Dras Sector to your veteran jawans and they'll be shitting their dhotis

 

[Stephen Cohen]

http://kaiser-aeronaut.blogspot.in/2009/01/kargil-conflict-and-pakistan-air-force.html

Air Cdre Abid Rao, Air Cdre Saleem Nawaz and myself were directed by the DCAS (Ops) to attend a briefing on the ‘latest situation in Kashmir’ at HQ 10 Corps. We were welcomed by the Chief of Staff (COS) of the Corps, who led us to the briefing room. Shortly thereafter, the Corps Commander, Lt Gen Mahmood Ahmed entered, cutting an impressive figure clad in a bush-coat and his trademark camouflage scarf.

After exchanging pleasantries, the COS started with the map orientation briefing. Thereafter, Lt Gen Mahmood took over and broke the news that a limited operation had started two days earlier. It was nothing more than a ‘protective manoeuvre’, he explained, and was meant to foreclose any further mischief by the enemy, who had been a nuisance in the Neelum Valley, specially on the road on our side of the Line of Control (LOC).

He then elaborated that a few vacant Indian posts had been occupied on peaks across the LOC, overlooking the Dras-Kargil Road. These would, in effect, serve the purpose of Airborne Observation Posts (AOP) meant for directing artillery fire with accuracy. Artillery firepower would be provided by a couple of field guns that had been heli-lifted to the heights, piecemeal, and re-assembled over the previous few months when the Indians had been off-guard during the winter extremes.

The target was a vulnerable section of Dras-Kargil Road, whose blocking would virtually cut off the crucial life-line which carried the bulk of supplies needed for daily consumption as well as annual winter-stocking in Leh-Siachen Sector.

He was very hopeful that this stratagem could choke off the Indians in the vital sector for up to a month, after which the monsoons would prevent vehicular movement (due to landslides) and, also suspend all airlift by the IAF.

“Come October, we shall walk in to Siachen – to mop up the dead bodies of hundreds of Indians left hungry, out in the cold,” he succinctly summed up what appeared to be a new dimension to the Siachen dispute.

It also seemed to serve, at least for the time being, the secondary aim of alleviating Indian military pressure on Pakistani lines of communications in the Neelum Valley that the Corps Commander had alluded to in his opening remarks. (The oft-heard strategic aim of ‘providing a fillip to the insurgency in Kashmir’ was never mentioned.)

 

[-xXx-]

Just Look up at the 2002 stand off to enlighten your self....you will get your answer, nearly a thousand Indian soldiers killed for pussyfooting on the border for a whole year .....without moving an inch.

What pride you are taking? Did your PAF killed them?

Anyways tell me did IAF let them lynched by PAF (must called GAF (Grounded)) genius?

How much pride your PAF instill in your head when your men were lynched and PAF guys were smoking cigar?

And you are comparing an army who is ready to die for country with an airforce who didn't fly? Hilarious you are

 

[Stephen Cohen]

No it was the capitulation of nawaz sharif when he went helter skelter to Washington DC -- and with a track record of previous and subsequent treachery he was unceremoniously dismissed. As I said already your soldiers were rotting corpses in DROVES it was regrettably the PM and the govt. that couldnt with-stand the pressure from GOTUS. Just the mention the name Dras Sector to your veteran jawans and they'll be shitting their dhotis

Nawaz Sharif Got Pakistan an HONOURABLE exit from Kargil

The kargil attack was so brazen -- coming so soon after Lahore visit by Indian PM
that ALL your allies dumped you

Neither China nor USA nor Saudis supported you

Nawaz Sharif went to USA because Pakistan Army was aware that it was simply
IMPOSSIBLE to Hold kargil peaks and it was better to get an honourable exit

By the time Nawaz went to USA ; Indian Army had cleared more than 80 PERCENT
of the area

 

[Joe Shearer]

You obviously dont know how many commemorations there are for those Shaheeds once the campaign ended and your 10 times larger regular forces were taught a lesson they'd never forget

No, we don't know. All we know is that we offered to hand over the bodies, and your military personnel refused to take them.

Nothing as impressive and as harrowing as a body-less commemoration.

re-read my post, thick-head. The remains of those aircrafts were inside Pakistani territory so it's quite irrelevant. They were shot down and the battle preparedness of the air defense units on the ground was demonstrated.

Battle preparedness! Wow!! some bozo with a Stinger on a mountain peak aiming at a plane hardly a hundred metres away and that's your battle preparedness? Knowing how to fire a Stinger?

while the inclusion of the AF helped india, i dont see it as a game-changer given the terrain and that in the absence of use of LGBs any bombing missions were mostly futile and counter productive in that they exposed the indians to danger especially putting troops on the ground via choppers (target practice for Pakistan)

There was no game-changing. If you knew a fraction of what you claim to know, you will also know that the bulk of the clearing was done by frontal attack in the face of firing.

But you would also know that initial failures with iron bombs and low level bombing led to the use of smart bombs released from high levels, and that this phase was the one that allowed the infantry to get to close quarters in the majority of cases particularly towards the end. It was still frontal attack and it was still, in some cases, opposed by fire, but it was hugely different from the earlier phase.

Since you are obviously practising to be a military expert, just a hint; don't confuse, as you did in your post above, bombing missions with aerial insertion of troops. What you wrote causes concern:

in the absence of use of LGBs any bombing missions were mostly futile and counter productive in that they exposed the indians to danger especially putting troops on the ground via choppers (target practice for Pakistan)

How bombing missions get conflated with aerial insertion beats me. It is probably supposed to build an aura of imperious authority on all matters relating to warfare.

Are you a civilian playing War War?

 

[Stephen Cohen]

Just the mention the name Dras Sector to your veteran jawans and they'll be shitting their dhotis

Total NONSENSE

Kargil will INSPIRE Generations of Indian Soldiers who fought against the
MOST SEVERE ODDS and drove out the intruders

Never BEFORE in HUMAN History has such a feat been done
that is what Indian Army accomplished in Kargil

Your Army too has tried to take Siachen
We know the results

Unfortunately we COULD not cross the LOC or else you would have seen the FULL MIGHT
of Indian Army

In Kargil Once India got its ACT together Pakistan Army had to leave its dead behind
and simply disown them

What can be more shameful