What can Pakistan learn from Bangladesh?

[Pakistani E]

Economic? Yes... military? No

Realpolitik makes me think otherwise. I mean, Bangladesh would not exist without the Indian military.

 

[bluesky]

More like they dont have hostile neighbours and are stable

Hostility needs two rival countries, one hand cannot clap. An economic rivalry should be in place instead of military rivalry. Pakistan's military buildup is causing its own economic downturn. An economic buildup needs investment in the civilian sectors.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

I honestly don't care what Bangladesh does. I only came to this section because of this stupid article. No one here is hiding behind any excuses, but there are hard facts and ground realities that are completely different in both nations.


Bangladesh isn't surrounded by two overtly hostile, and one covertly hostile nation actively challenging its national boundaries. Hence, Bangladesh can afford to divert more of its resources to its economy and development than Pakistan. That is not an excuse. This is a simple fact.

Bangladesh hasn't just come out of nearly 15 years civil war either. After 1971, what major military conflict have you faced that has decimated your infrastructure and scared away foreign investors? Your independence was 49 years ago, and you guys still can't stop crying about. Like I said above, you are nestled safely in the armpits of Bharat Mata, so can afford to remain insular and concentrate on other matters apart from national security. Is that an excuse? If you still think so, let me help you further:

You see where Bangladesh is? You are literally surrounded by a nation that is on friendly terms with you, and one that is your major economic and military partner.

If you'd like to compare yourselves to us, then go ahead. But don't expect me to learn any lessons from Bangladesh, because I can't find any worthwhile ones. The ones that I can see, I won't mention because I don't want to derail this thread in to a mud slinging match.

Pakistan is in the middle of US-India-Israeli proxy wars, being the Muslim world's premier military power, airforce, and only nuclear nation.

BD is far away from the Muslim heartland in both culture and geography. It is isolated from the neighborhood, while Pakistan is directly connected to three volatile regions: Middle East, Central Asia, Southwest Asia/Eurasia.

Also comparing Pakistan at its lowest point economically to BD at its highest is disingenuous.

Then why claim Kashmir? Leave it in India’s hand xzd


Economic? Yes... military? No

BD should be supporting the rights of Kashmiris too. The fact they do not shows cowardice. Some of you even support India's position which is a betrayal of Islam and Muslims.

Hostility needs two rival countries, one hand cannot clap. An economic rivalry should be in place instead of military rivalry. Pakistan's military buildup is causing its own economic downturn. An economic buildup needs investment in the civilian sectors.

Again, this is convenient for someone not in the situation which Pakistan finds itself.

What you are saying is tantamount to surrender.

If we surrendered and bowed down in the face of the enemies of Islam, we would dishonor the memories of our ancestors.

Every single Pakistani man, woman, child would be put to death, raped, sold in slavery, or burned alive.

We could never do such a thing.

Hostility needs two rival countries, one hand cannot clap. An economic rivalry should be in place instead of military rivalry. Pakistan's military buildup is causing its own economic downturn. An economic buildup needs investment in the civilian sectors.

In case of BD and Pakistan, hostility is one-sided.

Have you ever heard any recent Pakistani PM or politician spout hate on BD like Hasina and AL?

 

[Longhorn]

The Bangladeshi model cannot apply to Pakistan.
Pakistan must choose it's own path.
Pakistan has different drivers, priorities and destinies.
Pakistan is a player in a volatile, constantly changing environment of strategic interest to the major world and regional powers.
Pakistan's need to secure itself against constant threats from India, the Russian invasion of Afghanistan, American meddling in not only Pakistan but Pakistan's strategic friendship with China is what defines Pakistan and is what differentiates our situation to that of Bangladesh.
It would be easy for us to knuckle under and accept Indian hegemony which, although taking away our national self esteem, would free us up to a more peaceful day to day existence. That is something the Pakistani character will not accept. We prefer to be forged in the heat of self respect and self determination, which we will eventually achieve, rather than live at the dictation of a larger hubristic neighbour. We would be discarding the legacy of scores of generations of Muslims of the subcontinent who had it in them to rule the majority for centuries. We have lost a lot over the past decades in pursuit of this goal but we are still here, still standing and I believe the worst is behind us, the groundwork is laid, the die is cast.
What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.
Pakistan will in time emerge a strong and prosperous nation to match our strong national character. We would have preferred our Bengali brothers to be on this journey with us, however it was not to be. The characters of the two peoples are chalk and cheese, as will be their destinies, but this constant comparison to what is after all a phase that may end anytime is getting tiresome.

 

[Michael Corleone]

Realpolitik makes me think otherwise. I mean, Bangladesh would not exist without the Indian military.

So you guys would rather admit the Indian military whopped your *** in 16 days than the guerrilla warfare Pakistan army faced for 8 months prior?

BD should be supporting the rights of Kashmiris too. The fact they do not shows cowardice. Some of you even support India's position which is a betrayal of Islam and Muslims.

I don’t know any Bangladeshi that actually supports India’s position but the fact that we are not raising concern over the matter negates our plight with the rohynga Muslims of Burma. I admit our foreign policy is a controversial matter and our minister are equally inept at handling international politics

 

[mmr]

Bd can teach Pakistan ppl how to catch and cook hilsa fish.

 

[Saiful Islam]

BD has had its fair share of dealing with insurgencies in CHT and the North East, not to much mention political instability, BD politics is crazy and erratic. We came out of a civil war where infrastructure such as rail, communications and bridges were destroyed.

Even from the 1950s, the Rohingya problem has been going on, but our Gov at the time didn't want to get involved in Burmese matters. Fast forward now we host well more than 3 million which is the real figure in truer sense. We have seen that environmental changes and disasters has been the main concern and a real foe. Burmese aggression has been there for a while and there are numerous groups that have been there since the 50's or are springing up that are also causing a problem.

We have been under military rule twice, correct me if not wrong. So the fact is BD has climbed a steep bridge, facing obstacles and years and years of misrule, which is still going on now.

 

[Yankee-stani]

The Bangladeshi model cannot apply to Pakistan.
Pakistan must choose it's own path.
Pakistan has different drivers, priorities and destinies.
Pakistan is a player in a volatile, constantly changing environment of strategic interest to the major world and regional powers.
Pakistan's need to secure itself against constant threats from India, the Russian invasion of Afghanistan, American meddling in not only Pakistan but Pakistan's strategic friendship with China is what defines Pakistan and is what differentiates our situation to that of Bangladesh.
It would be easy for us to knuckle under and accept Indian hegemony which, although taking away our national self esteem, would free us up to a more peaceful day to day existence. That is something the Pakistani character will not accept. We prefer to be forged in the heat of self respect and self determination, which we will eventually achieve, rather than live at the dictation of a larger hubristic neighbour. We would be discarding the legacy of scores of generations of Muslims of the subcontinent who had it in them to rule the majority for centuries. We have lost a lot over the past decades in pursuit of this goal but we are still here, still standing and I believe the worst is behind us, the groundwork is laid, the die is cast.
What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.
Pakistan will in time emerge a strong and prosperous nation to match our strong national character. We would have preferred our Bengali brothers to be on this journey with us, however it was not to be. The characters of the two peoples are chalk and cheese, as will be their destinies, but this constant comparison to what is after all a phase that may end anytime is getting tiresome.

Russian Tanks err mean invasion woah woah did the 1980s called anyways I agree comparing Pakistan and Bangladesh is apples and oranges learning will be mostly fruitless however we should learn from the Bangladeshis how they do good at exports and textiles

Pakistan is in the middle of US-India-Israeli proxy wars, being the Muslim world's premier military power, airforce, and only nuclear nation.

BD is far away from the Muslim heartland in both culture and geography. It is isolated from the neighborhood, while Pakistan is directly connected to three volatile regions: Middle East, Central Asia, Southwest Asia/Eurasia.

Also comparing Pakistan at its lowest point economically to BD at its highest is disingenuous.



BD should be supporting the rights of Kashmiris too. The fact they do not shows cowardice. Some of you even support India's position which is a betrayal of Islam and Muslims.



Again, this is convenient for someone not in the situation which Pakistan finds itself.

What you are saying is tantamount to surrender.

If we surrendered and bowed down in the face of the enemies of Islam, we would dishonor the memories of our ancestors.

Every single Pakistani man, woman, child would be put to death, raped, sold in slavery, or burned alive.

We could never do such a thing.



In case of BD and Pakistan, hostility is one-sided.

Have you ever heard any recent Pakistani PM or politician spout hate on BD like Hasina and AL?

Meh, eventhogh we the only Islamic nation with Nukes, and have the potential to be a powerhouse we are a sub par regional power depending on Beijing

 

[Avicenna]

Bangladesh is just getting started.

The main challenge is climate change which is out of our hands.

But barring that, just keep your head down and keep working.

Whether its garments, pharmaceuticals, ship building or whatever.

The real strength of Bangladesh is its people and relatively well adjusted society.

i.e. the utilization of women being a major case in point.

As for Pakistan, good luck to you guys.

But note the tone of some of the messages on this thread.

 

[leonblack08]

The Bangladeshi model cannot apply to Pakistan.
Pakistan must choose it's own path.
this constant comparison to what is after all a phase that may end anytime is getting tiresome.

I agree completely, especially with the bold part.

Although this comparison was done by a Pakistani newspaper, but there have been so many of these kind lately, that it simply does not add any value.

These kinds of comparison only serves individual agenda and nothing else.

Bangladesh has not developed so much that we can be used as benchmark yet. Had it been that case, then most of us here would not be posting from foreign countries. We would have gone back to Bangladesh.

We should be thankful to Allah for the progress and be humble about it. We should always be mindful that it won't take long to see a reversal in fortune if Allah wills it.

So I would like to request the members to refrain from posting articles like these. These only serve to incite hate and negativity. I think none of us need more of that in our lives.

 

[Rusty]

The way I see it, Bangladesh has traded it's democracy and sovereignty (to India) for economic gains. Short term it's paying off heavily. Question is what are the long term ramifications?

Pakistan did the same thing in the 60s. We had Asia's best economy and development, but at the cost of democracy and freedom.

As for Pakistan, I see Pakistan setting up a stable foundation right now.
I am a PTI fanboy so say what you want, but setting up functioning healthcare, education, police, etc etc is the bedrock of a functioning society. And I see Pakistan doing that.

The fruits of this might not be seen for another 10 years but they will come.

All Asian tigers, as well as China did the same thing. They spent 10 years setting up the foundations and then 10 years later their economies boomed.

 

[Avicenna]

The way I see it, Bangladesh has traded it's democracy and sovereignty (to India) for economic gains. Short term it's paying off heavily. Question is what are the long term ramifications?

Pakistan did the same thing in the 60s. We had Asia's best economy and development, but at the cost of democracy and freedom.

As for Pakistan, I see Pakistan setting up a stable foundation right now.
I am a PTI fanboy so say what you want, but setting up functioning healthcare, education, police, etc etc is the bedrock of a functioning society. And I see Pakistan doing that.

The fruits of this might not be seen for another 10 years but they will come.

All Asian tigers, as well as China did the same thing. They spent 10 years setting up the foundations and then 10 years later their economies boomed.

Good luck.

I sincerely wish you guys well.

 

[Rusty]

Just to drive my point home

https://nation.com.pk/11-Jan-2020/making-pakistan-welfare-state-a-major-challenge-pm

PESHAWAR - Terming 2020 the year of employment and progress, Prime Minister Imran Khan said yesterday that the biggest challenge for his government is to make Pakistan a welfare state for elevating the weaker segments of society.



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“We are trying to make Pakistan a welfare state and come up with policies that are people friendly. Pakistan Railways will witness immense uplift through mega projects,” he said this while speaking at the inauguration ceremony of Azakhel Dry Port in Nowshera district.

Governor Khyber Pakthunkhwa, Shah Farman, Chief Minister Khyber Pakthunkhwa, Mahmood Khan, Federal Minister for Railways, Sheikh Rasheed Ahmed, Defense Minister Pervez Khattak, Provincial Ministers, MPAs and others high ranking officials were present on the occasion.

Imran Khan said the Azakhel Dry Port would provide quality transportation and logistics services. Spread over 28 kilometres, the state-of-the-art dry port has been completed by Pakistan Railways with an estimated cost of Rs 507 million in a record one-year time.

The PM lauded the efforts of Railways Minister Sheikh Rashid Ahmad for the completion of the project pending since 2006 and also for Rs 10 billion revenue generation by Pakistan Railways last year.

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He said the main line rail track, commonly known as ML-1, to be built with collaboration of China, would prove to be a revolution in the country’s railway system. The Karachi-Peshwar train on ML-1 would complete journey in eight hours, besides other benefits in shape of swift transportation of freight, he added.

Imran Khan stressed that both Pakistan Railways and the national flag career Pakistan International Airlines needed to come forward in competition with the private sector. “Several corporations have become a burden on the national exchequer and need competitive approach to survive and thrive,” he stressed.

The PM asked the employees and workers of Pakistan Railways to work diligently and act unitedly against corruption. “I want you to run Pakistan Railways with same care and concern which you attach for your own vehicle,” he said.

He said that the land of Pakistan Railways would be retrieved to get it commercialized to bridge its deficit.

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About the Ehsaas programe, he said that the country’s largest ever social welfare programme, for which Rs 190 billion had been allocated for loans, skill training, 50,000 higher education scholarships and health cards.

He said that the government would construct five million affordable houses to accommodate low-income groups and this step would benefit 40 affiliated industries.

He regretted the ‘governments of elites’ in the past which neglected major civic areas, including education, health, legal system and railways.

On the occasion, Railways Minister Sheikh Rashid announced to rename the dry port as Pir Piyai Azakhel for its acceptance by majority in the area. He mentioned about an agreement with the National Logistic Cell (NLC) to include Pehswar-Jalalabad track in ML-1, which, he said, would end smuggling. It would also ensure employment for 0.1 million as 92 percent jobs had been reserved for Pakistanis, he added.

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He said Pakistan was the sole country in the world for being profit-earning from passenger trains, adding that Pakistan Railways witnessed an increase of 0.7 million passengers last year.

Sheikh Rashid said that under the open policy, Pakistan Railways had given three freight trains and 11 passenger trains to the private sector.

He said that the PC-1 of ML-1 had been submitted to Planning Minister Asad Umer. There would be no crossing at the 1872-kilometre-long ML-1, he added. He said the railway system would be computerized with trackers installed for geo-tracking.

In his remarks, Defence Minister Pervez Khattak lauded Railways Minister Sheikh Rashid Ahmad for the completion of the dry port project and requested him to allow laying of gas and irrigation pipelines for the area through Pakistan Railways lands.

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He mentioned that the Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaf government had resolved up to 80 percent problems of Nowshera.

The Azakhel Dry Port has been completed by Pakistan Railways with an estimated cost of Rs507 million in a record one year. Spreading over 28 acres of land and located about 20 kilometres east from Peshawar on main GT Road in Nowshera district’s town Azakhel, the dry port is equipped with the modern loading and unloading facilities.

The dry port has one-window operation facility for which a facilitation centre, Pakistan Customs, Railways, National Bank of Pakistan and police check-up points, had been established. The Azakhel Dry Port would make Khyber Pakhtunkhwa, especially Peshawar, a hub of trade, business and foreign investment with a direct positive impact on people’s socio-economic lives.

Shifting of Azakhel dry-port to Nowshera from Peshawar, was planned in 2006 and its completion was possible today due to keen interest, taken by Prime Minister Imran Khan and Federal Minister for Railways Sheikh Rashid Ahmed.

 

[JohnWick]

Many things
1.How to be a traitor.
2.How to fight against own army.
3.How to assist enemy army.
4.How to be so stone heart to develop hate against motherland.
5.How to be a Hindu slave.
6.How to be defenceless.

 

[Bilal9]

From a population dynamics POV the main difference between us was the treatment of our women. You can interpret this from a dogmatic / ideological POV but numbers do not lie. Bangladesh enabled their women to work rather than only marry young and have children, therefore, become assets rather than liabilities. That's what is needed because the unchecked population growth is our greatest problem. Moving around Pakistan there is a disturbing scene of one person earning and an entire household surviving on their money; however, despite that still reproducing like there's no tomorrow. That's a problem. Modern economies are best suited for smaller families and a balance between liabilities and assets.

My opinion is based off of hard empiricism rather than ideology, please, don't analyze everything through nationalistic or ideological lenses, they have their place but taking other paradigms is also helpful. Before taking any tag, i think it's important to be a realist. We don't need any aid to change ourselves. I think this change has to be internally aroused rather than forced on anyone.

Thank you.

Well said Sir.

Cultural predilections are definitely hard factors and sometimes seem immutable.

But female education rates have contributed to lowering fertility rates (in addition to empowering women to work in factories) - that much can be confirmed for Bangladesh case. Fertility rates in Bangladesh are now hovering around 2.1 child per woman, which is almost the same as replacement rate. Which means population is NOT increasing more than say 1%. Is this where third world countries need to be? Absolutely.

Lower population makes a nation stronger, no doubt, and it has no conflict with teachings of Islam in Bangladesh.