Was Russia enticed to invade Ukarine?

[Oldman1]

That is state sponsored suicide.

Sure, but the interaction between soldiers and civilians is not hostile either.

Wait for this channel to upload. Anyway, I totally forgot the people protesting in Kaziqistan, another Russian soft belly.

https://www.youtube.com/c/CaspianReport

How is it state sponsored suicide?

Its already getting hostile. Russian troopers are shooting down civilians. Now whether it was the Russians or Chechens, I don't know. Somebody has decided to do it.

 

[nahtanbob]

He's a Chinese living in the U.S/West like many others on here. While claiming how great their home country is and how the Western country in which they live is bad/in decline and controlled by jews/zionists Lol I don't understand why such people prefer remaining in big bad West instead of going back to their country of origin which is a very smart rising country and the next superpower and is not controlled by zionists... baffles me.

China is doing well. But it is not a mecca for Chinese immigrants in the West. Some adapt when they return to China. Some don't. Like it or not a lot of them are stuck in the declining West

 

[jamahir]

being in a conformist society you are in no position to lecture others on thinking

Governments of so-called democratic societies like USA, Britain and India impose conformism upon their citizens. You either follow the conformist rules or get slotted into the homeless and miserable category though it's not like those who follow the rules also don't become miserable. Please read my post# 42.

The Communist Party of USA and the Occupy Wall Street movement are non-conformist and do you think such movements don't get sabotaged by the government ? In India progressives have gotten jailed on charges of "anti-national activities" and one of them, Stan Swamy, an elderly man of 84 with Parkinson's, died while imprisoned.

 

[mike2000 is back]

Give him a break. Not every oversea chinese is stubbornly against Chinese government. The economic stride made in recent years certainly makes China more attractive, although it may not yet be good enough for him to migrate back but you cannot blame him for having such a hope. Honestly who really wants to live in a country that he can never call it his home, no matter how good that country is?

I never said he or every overseas Chinese should be against the Chibese government or their government for that matter. I'm ot that naive or silly to think such a thing. My point is that many of them that live here in the West are often even more radical towards the West than those living in their home countr while still claiming how holy and good their home country is compared to the Western country they live in, yet they won't go back to live in their country which they claim is the best. If that's not an irony then I don't know what that is. Lol
It's like me emigrating and enjoying my life with my family in China or Russia, yet at the same time always claiming how evil and bad China/Russia is all the time and even wishing for their decline. I'm sure any Chinese/Russian will view me as an hypocrite and won't take me seriously in that case. Since if the country is that bad and I don't like the country as I claim then I will move back to my home country to enjoy my life better there. Can't imagine living in a country I despise and badmouth all the time. Its just ironic

 

[nahtanbob]

Governments of so-called democratic societies like USA, Britain and India impose conformism upon their citizens. You either follow the conformist rules or get slotted into the homeless and miserable category though it's not like those who follow the rules also don't become miserable. Please read my post# 42.

The Communist Party of USA and the Occupy Wall Street movement are non-conformist and do you think such movements don't get sabotaged by the government ? In India progressives have gotten jailed on charges of "anti-national activities" and one of them, Stan Swamy, an elderly man of 84 with Parkinson's, died while imprisoned.

In USA you are free to believe in Communism as long as you do not overthrow the government by violent means

As far as the Occupy Wall Street movement they could not win 100,000 votes in Presidential election

 

[jamahir]

In USA you are free to believe in Communism as long as you do not overthrow the government by violent means

How is that idea valid in USA while in other countries like Venezuela and Libya the USA government helps criminals in overthrowing the government by violent means ?

As far as the Occupy Wall Street movement they could not win 100,000 votes in Presidential election

Votes and all the associated drama is not what real democracy is. Please read this post of mine on that topic - origin of democracy and all. You will see how the American establishment is being undemocratic in denying the right of the Occupy movement to propagate its progressive ideas in society.

 

[Goenitz]

How is it state sponsored suicide?

Sending civilians against a professional army is certain death. Even in urban warfare or insurgency, you need to train civilians. @jhungary long time man.
Any insight on the thread?

 

[nahtanbob]

How is that idea valid in USA while in other countries like Venezuela and Libya the USA government helps criminals in overthrowing the government by violent means ?



Votes and all the associated drama is not what real democracy is. Please read this post of mine on that topic - origin of democracy and all. You will see how the American establishment is being undemocratic in denying the right of the Occupy movement to propagate its progressive ideas in society.

American state is powerful enough to crush violent rivals within and outside USA. I make no apologies for it

Occupy Wall Street movement is free to propagate ideas. For starters I do not what the f*ck they stand for.

American state has evolved for the past 250 years. It is easier to propagate progressive ideas within the system.

 

[jamahir]

American state has evolved for the past 250 years. It is easier to propagate progressive ideas within the system.

First of all, the idea of the State itself is anti-democratic. Please read that linked post of mine. So America is not a democratic country but a Capitalist, plutocratic, two-party dictatorship.

Occupy Wall Street movement is free to propagate ideas. For starters I do not what the f*ck they stand for.

In 2011 when the Occupy Wall Street movement started the American establishment tried to discredit it by saying things like the movement being a plot by Gaddafi ( against whom NATO was waging a war ), then the establishment said that the protestors were being helped by the Russian and Chinese embassies. So the Occupy movement was not quite free to propagate ideas, it was being subverted.

And why do you not agree with the movement's ideas ? Don't you want free healthcare, free education, end to the oppression-spreading and irrational Wall Street area including the stock exchange, things like these ?

American state is powerful enough to crush violent rivals within and outside USA. I make no apologies for it

Then there is no moral standing of USA's governments.

 

[jhungary]

Sending civilians against a professional army is certain death. Even in urban warfare or insurgency, you need to train civilians. @jhungary long time man.
Any insight on the thread?

Thanks, yeah, really long time, was asked to come back and comment on the current situation

Well, it show us two things.

1.) The situation in Ukraine is critical. That's what that general mobilisation mean.
2.) It also show the Ukrainian resolve on the war.

Notice that this is about morale. 1.) Sap morale of Ukrainian while 2.) Sap morale from Russian.

If the situation is that every men, women and possibly children have to pick up a weapon and fight. That will plays into the situation and which is very dire, on the other hand, would Russian soldier willing to kill Ukrainian by dove? It's not like a general warfare where you kill someone that is professional, a trained force, but if you know you are fighting an entire city and entire country, it literally mean you will only win when you kill the last one of the 45 millions population. That is quite demoralizing for the invading Russian

Even at the height of Iraq and Afghanistan insurgency, not the entire country of people want us dead. But this will be the case for the Russian soldier...You need to sit back and think about that for a second.

 

[nahtanbob]

First of all, the idea of the State itself is anti-democratic. Please read that linked post of mine. So America is not a democratic country but a Capitalist, plutocratic, two-party dictatorship.



In 2011 when the Occupy Wall Street movement started the American establishment tried to discredit it by saying things like the movement being a plot by Gaddafi ( against whom NATO was waging a war ), then the establishment said that the protestors were being helped by the Russian and Chinese embassies. So the Occupy movement was not quite free to propagate ideas, it was being subverted.

And why do you not agree with the movement's ideas ? Don't you want free healthcare, free education, end to the oppression-spreading and irrational Wall Street area including the stock exchange, things like these ?



Then there is no moral standing of USA's governments.

You are free to call USA anything you want. We need a government to avoid anarchy. feel free to create your democratic stateless society elsewhere

What does the Occupy Wall Street movement stand for ? No one knows what they stand for. Nothing is free in this world. Healthcare & education are not free. someone is going to pay for it.

Thanks, yeah, really long time, was asked to come back and comment on the current situation

Well, it show us two things.

1.) The situation in Ukraine is critical. That's what that general mobilisation mean.
2.) It also show the Ukrainian resolve on the war.

Notice that this is about morale. 1.) Sap morale of Ukrainian while 2.) Sap morale from Russian.

If the situation is that every men, women and possibly children have to pick up a weapon and fight. That will plays into the situation and which is very dire, on the other hand, would Russian soldier willing to kill Ukrainian by dove? It's not like a general warfare where you kill someone that is professional, a trained force, but if you know you are fighting an entire city and entire country, it literally mean you will only win when you kill the last one of the 45 millions population. That is quite demoralizing for the invading Russian

Even at the height of Iraq and Afghanistan insurgency, not the entire country of people want us dead. But this will be the case for the Russian soldier...You need to sit back and think about that for a second.

there are millions of Russians and Ukrainian with blood relationships. Putin has forced a real issue for both Russian and Ukrainians
Iraq and Afghanistan are tribal societies. ignoring the Russian minority Ukraine isn't a tribal society.

 

[nang2]

I never said he or every overseas Chinese should be against the Chibese government or their government for that matter. I'm ot that naive or silly to think such a thing. My point is that many of them that live here in the West are often even more radical towards the West than those living in their home countr while still claiming how holy and good their home country is compared to the Western country they live in, yet they won't go back to live in their country which they claim is the best. If that's not an irony then I don't know what that is. Lol
It's like me emigrating and enjoying my life with my family in China or Russia, yet at the same time always claiming how evil and bad China/Russia is all the time and even wishing for their decline. I'm sure any Chinese/Russian will view me as an hypocrite and won't take me seriously in that case. Since if the country is that bad and I don't like the country as I claim then I will move back to my home country to enjoy my life better there. Can't imagine living in a country I despise and badmouth all the time. Its just ironic

The irony is that no place is perfect yet people still want perfection. But look at from any angle. This is actually what drives people, without which life would be too boring.

 

[tower9]

He's a Chinese living in the U.S/West like many others on here. While claiming how great their home country is and how the Western country in which they live is bad/in decline and controlled by jews/zionists Lol I don't understand why such people prefer remaining in big bad West instead of going back to their country of origin which is a very smart rising country and the next superpower and is not controlled by zionists... baffles me.

It's almost like if you constantly smear, persecute, encourage violence against a certain people on a daily basis, they tend to rally around the flag. Kind of shocking isn't it?

 

[Goenitz]

related to the current crisis, at that time I excused myself to reply due to lack of knowledge, I would say still my knowledge related to this conflict is very shallow but after reading about the conflict in past 3-4 days I gathered the following thoughts on this subject.

Thanx bro. I think the US won't bother if it becomes an Afghan jihad like situation, as it will weak Russia and yhe fall out is for EU not for US .

Yea, it is Cuban crisis in reverse.

Sure, ultra nationalism will rise in war ridden countries as they seek glory in past, war and death. So, these things fuel to nationalism. The country who will receive the economic and refugee brunt, will also be rattled by nationalism. As it is easy to blame foreigners for their crisis.

I don't think the US can open another front to deviate Moscow. Ukraine is a core interest of Russia. Not only due to short missile flight time but the terrain is flat. Extremely easy for troops mobilisation.

Yes we must stay neutral. Thanx god out PM wars's stance always remianed pacifist.

Anyways thanx for the input. Read the OP for my perspective.

 

[MajesticPug]

Some are going on with their business but you probably haven't see other unarmed civilians blocking Russian vehicles from progressing.

Try blocking a US convoy in operation during war. They will be shot and labeled terrorists. I can't really blame the US soldiers but the Russians are too kind, too abnormal in that aspect.