Splendid that is a tacit acknowledgement that you are only limited to the so called technical side and spewing derogatory comments at innocent Chinese boys but is rather limited in terms of keeping up with the time, politics, economy and is showing severe lack of common sense.
You have a reading comprehension problem. I pointed out that when I initially challenged you Chinese boys, it was on technical issues and that I took more than reasonable efforts to support my arguments as well as being polite and on subject. You Chinese boys took exceptions to that and began to spew your petty racist hatred at me. No 'innocent Chinese boys' here, pal. Pathetic attempt to cast yourselves as victims. But this is a forum that focuses on the military and military related technology and you Chinese boys are out of your league compared to me. I see some Chinese in Canada who never served in uniform, fast food chain restaurant uniforms does not count, and some mainland Chinese who are conscript rejects and neither group done any work related to the technical subjects under discussions but have no problems making outrageous claims about things of their ignorance. I was polite before but after the racist hatred directed at me for no cause, I see no reasons to be nice to you Chinese boys' ignorance.
Whats pathetic is your inability to comprehend that I was talking about America forbidding the practice of communism elsewhere and often create a sense of fear and animosity towards "communist" countries elsewhere other than the US. Then you come back to further aid my argument with just what I needed to prove America's double standard
Forbid? How? Looks like someone need to take history lessons, particularly the map showing how many communist states there were during the Cold War. And why should we not have fear and animosity towards communism? Look at the sorry conditions of those Cold War era communist states. There were no West Berliners trying to 'escape' to East Berlin, were there? Or is there an alternate history you studied where the world was one big happy "Workers' Paradise"? And are you saying that the communists
NEVER created propaganda with the goal of instilling fear and animosity against 'Western imperialists' and their 'running dogs'? How charmingly innocent...
Yes China "liberated" Vietnam and we supported the winning side. Bite me?
No...China was in Viet Nam
NOT to 'liberate' anyone but to start a war to spread communism. It is always amusing to watch you Chinese boys tap-dance around the issue. The Americans have no problems calling US involvement for what it is: communist containment. But now, given how communism is discredited, the defenders of China's meddling in Viet Nam can do no better than the equally discredited 'liberation' arguments. Too cowardly to call it for what it was: To spread communism? Too chickenshtt to call it as: To propagate a failed ideology? Yup -- On both counts.
Good, so you condemn Diem and the west for their involvement in co-starting the Vietnam war which they have ultimately lost.
Bunk. I do not condemn Diem for being anti-communist. Diem was not the only anti-communist nationalist among other anti-communist nationalists, so do you condemn them as well? I may be critical or even condemning of Diem for being the type of leader he was but not for being anti-communist, just as you see nothing wrong with Mao for being the butcher that he was as long as he led China to independence. Brave and come out and say that being anti-communist is wrong?
Who cares what happened in TET Offensive. Yes it was a phenomenon, but the greater phenomenon wasn't the TET Offensive.
And you have the gall to debate politics and war? The 1968 Tet Offensive, or more specifically its failure to take South Vietnam, totally demolish the communist lie that Viet Nam was behind the Viet Minh and if China and the Soviet Union did not meddle in Viet Nam, North Viet Nam would not exist. But it is telling that you persists in calling out US meddling in SE Asia but not China's own actions as equally 'meddling'. Coward.
It was the sheer pase which the south collapsed when US was no longer meddling with Vietnam. I thought the south was so loved by the entire Vietnam?
Right-O...Congratulations...!!! You effectively made the ridiculous argument that since South Viet Nam collapsed the people must not have loved their side of the country very much. How about if I say this: Since China was carved up and parts became colonial prizes by and for the Europeans and later Japan, a much smaller nation-state, militarily defeated the Chinese and carved out a chunk of Chinese land called 'Manchukuo', the Chinese people must not have loved their country very much. If, and it is a big 'if', there is a 'high Chinese IQ' people, you must not be in that group with this silly argument. The Chinese truly with the 'high IQ' wisely stayed out of something they know they are ignorant about.
Funny how you claimed the Ho-Sainteny Agreement to be something new? It was nothing new at all since it was all part of the history. You have successfully contradicted yourself with history there. When you are talking about history, you are talking past tense. Regardless of your personal opinions it was a stupid war Americans started and failed. It doesn't matter how many times you revise history, it will always be told the same way. Americans lost and China helped with the liberation of Vietnam. This is a concept which is still new to you so I don't blame you for feeling alien about it. Afterall Team America is most powerful country in the world and they have Capt America right?
Yeah...The Ho-Sainteny Agreement is new to
YOU, pal. Professional historians regularly research and discovered new facts that formulate new truths about events in varying degrees of significance and impacts. Still, some facts are less well publicized and therefore less well known than others. The Ho-Sainteny Agreement is one of those less publicized and less known facts about the Vietnam War. It is a fact in history that
YOU did not know and based upon that ignorance you have a false understanding of the Vietnam War, or more specifically its causes. Those who seeks to justify communism in Viet Nam have good cause to distract attention away from this pact between the Viet Minh and France that led to the return of France as a colony reclaimant. They want to portray the Viet Minh as a victim of France and the US. And when this fact is presented to the public without their consent, they get angry.
So for the benefit of the reader who is willing to be objective about the Vietnam War, the fact that there was a pact between the Viet Minh and France so soon after the end of WW II, so soon as in months, that actually invited France back into Indochina as a colony reclaimant, and that the pact placed Viet Nam back into colonial possession status, is a moral indictment against the communists for doing their part in causing the Vietnam War. Yes, the US may have failed in Viet Nam, but that failure is irrelevant regarding the chains of events that led up to the war. The intellectually honest position when presented with new facts, new as in when a person did not know them before, not 'new' as in newly discovered by research, is to admit that those new facts compelled a reassessment of one's position regarding the historical event. The Ho-Sainteny Agreement is not new to me but it is indeed new to
YOU but you are too much of a coward to admit that it did forced you to consider the possibility that what you previously believed about the Vietnam War as wrong or even incomplete.
Many Viets who lived through the war did not know about this pact, and practically none are the Viets who came after unification and believed the communists to be pure as freshly fallen snow. The communists and their deceitful Western apologists worked hard to suppress this fact. But to no avail. So in your cowardice, it is
YOU are revising history as in revising it back to the comfort point for you despite the truth presented. But it is too much to ask any Chinese to be intellectually honest about China's meddling in Viet Nam to the detriment of the Vietnamese.
Good.. now that you have acknowledged the south was for Diem and America and the Phoenix Program was a tool and a convenient source of evidence, proving of America's meddling and co-starting of the Vietnam war.
The Phoenix Program was a tactic of war, not one of its causes. The communists have their own version which was more atrocious in that they were indiscriminate in their targets and those murders preceded the American military involvement in Viet Nam. The reason you keep calling the US the co-starter of the Vietnam War is because you are trying (in vain) to distract attraction from the truth: That China was in Viet Nam long before the US was. Do you deny that fact? Be brave and state that denial.
Yes the world would be able to see more of how America meddles with communism elsewhere in the world. The insult however was Vietnam is growing again and picking itself up from the rubbish left behind by American and the late Diem's saga.
You mean the sorry condition of every communist states, including Viet Nam? If communism was not forced upon the people, there would be no need for Viet Nam to 'grow again'. That is what the world see and understand. The PC you are using? Ain't from the communists. The Internet? Ain't from the communists. That microwave oven? Ain't from the communists. It is deliciously ironic to see that you, a Chinese Canadian who never lived through the bloody years of communism in China or through the Cold War for that matter, have been thoroughly brainwashed into believing that the
ONLY way for a people to achieve independence is to have communism imposed, suffer decades of political oppression and economic hardships, then 'grow again'. A Chinese Canadian who never know political oppression and economic hardship, and who would curse Canada at even a hint of censorship or reduction in wages, is cheering for the Vietnamese to suffer the very bloody things communists are famous for.
So as a Vietnamese you should be proud.. oh wait you are not Vietnamese right? I almost forgot about you serving in the very Army that napalmed the Vietnamese.
It is precisely this kind of cheap personal attacks from the beginning that earned you Chinese boys my contempt.
No no, not Diem, it was how America, France and Diem started the war.
Wrong...China was in Viet Nam long before the US and Diem. It was China who prodded North Vietnamese communists to start the war. After France, it was China who provided guidance and weapons to slaughter North Vietnamese anti-communist nationalists. It was China who imposed the disastrous land reform that resulted in famine in North Viet Nam. Those and many more occurred before US military involvement in Viet Nam. Be brave and state your denial of these historical facts.
Yes I am sure of it, Vietnamese really DO envy the present Japanese economy and country. Fail, just fail. Vietnam is a good land and Japan is not. In fact everyone including Chinese are sorry for the Japanese people for living in a land with little resource and is in constant threat of earthquakes, tsunami, volcanic erruptions and nuclear disasters.
Desperate...desperate...!!! Yes...The Vietnamese really
DO envy the Japanese for living better in many ways. I know because I hear them enough, in the US and in Viet Nam. It really is a desperate argument because you do not understand the 'whats' of that envy. It certainly is not the land but because despite the land's abundance of natural resources, communism prevented the Vietnamese from exploiting the bounty for their own benefits. Just like how communism denied the Chinese the same, remember the Chinese folly of adopting Lysenkoism from the Soviets? So for you to bring up threats of 'earthquakes, tsunami, volcanic erruptions and nuclear disasters' in the Japanese islands is truly a desperate and 'low IQ' argument.
Yes it would be wrong to call you a commie since you are an American living in the land of dreams. Like I said China is Communist by name but capitalist in nature. If you are not racist then you should set a good example and call us Chinese. Then again, no one her expects a bully to be capable of becoming a gentleman.lol
Me a 'bully'? That is a laugh. But if I am acting like a bully, like I said before that based upon you Chinese boys' unwarranted personal attacks against me, you Chinese boys earned it.
News for you, pal. Bao Dai abdicated while he was in North Viet Nam. Then Ho asked Bao Dai to remain as a 'senior advisor'. Bao Dai accepted. A few years later after Bao Dai got disgusted with how the Viet Minh mistreated the peasantry, he quit and moved south. So here we have more education for you about the relationships between the three men who mattered in the Vietnam War: Ho Chi Minh had Bao Dai as an advisor. Ho Chi Minh imprisoned Diem. And later fought a war against both. Still think Bao Dai and Diem were chosen from out of nowhere?
...I cannot believe that you could be that bad...Booo...!!! You argued that communism is somehow 'forbidden' in America. And when you are presented with evidence that made you look the fool, you came back with this...???
