Vietnam: the ONLY Asian developing country that drops in R&D

[FairAndUnbiased]

I believe you are too obsessed by Vietnam, that is not healthy. maybe it is true our R&D sucks, who knows, but the foreigners seem to value our engineers. a quick google "R&D Vietnam", latest announcements:

Apple (US)
Nidec Corp (Japan)
Renesas Electronics Corp (Japan)
Samsung (S Korea)
Samil CTS (S Korea)
Robert Bosch (Germany)

those are BS level engineers following orders from HQ in their home country. The RD engineers will be PhDs at company HQ or research parks.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Corruption <--- Is the only reason for the drop. Top politicians are worried that their jobs could get replaced by someone way more capable then they are so they scorn the smart/brilliant people and make them feel they are worthless. This is the same with the Universities of Vietnam. Vietnam VCP still runs by ignorant thugs. These thugs only worry about their powers and money.

There's Dreamplex in Ho Chi Minh which stands out the most. But I wouldn't say that is a place for R&D.

Well, VCP compared to CPC is like a bunch of hillbillies to a group of engineers.

Some communists are dumb as hell, while some others are genius. So this has nothing to do with the political correctness.

 

[CAPRICORN-88]

According to the NatureIndex records in 2013, 2014 and 2015, Vietnam is surprisingly experiencing consecutive drops on high-quality research paper output. Vietnam's output drops from 8.23 in 2013, to 8.03 in 2014 and 6.96 in 2015. That's indeed a surprising result! Because Vietnam is the ONLY Asian developing country that is experiencing a two-year consecutive drop! This looks really weird, because:

1. Vietnam people are definitely very smart people, and they are proud of their education system
2. Vietnam is making remarkable economic growth in recent years, so there should be more investment to R&D
3. The base record of Vietnam is extremely small (0.1% of China), so it should not be very difficult to make some growth

Are there any particular reasons to the consecutive drops of Vietnam? Or is it maybe NatureINDEX staff are very stupid, so they makes wrong calculations on Vietnam's result?

Any ideas are welcome.

link to the NatureIndex result:
http://www.natureindex.com/annual-tables/2016/country/all/regions-Asia Pacific
http://www.natureindex.com/annual-tables/2015/country/all/regions-Asia Pacific
View attachment 324958


-----------------------------------------------Background information------------------------------------------------------------
What is NatureIndex?
The Nature Index is a database of author affiliation information collated from research articles published in an independently selected group of 68 high-quality science journals. The database is compiled by Nature Research. The Nature Index provides a close to real-time proxy for high-quality research output at the institutional, national and regional level.

What are the Nature Index journals?
View attachment 324959

What is WFC?
Weighted fractional count (WFC) accounts for the relative contribution of each author to an article, and adjusts for the abundance of astronomy and astrophysics papers.

The reason is rather straight forward.

Vietnam cannot AFFORD to. R&D is expensive.
Vietnam is basically only a benchmark economy.

 

[GS Zhou]

Corruption <--- Is the only reason for the drop. Top politicians are worried that their jobs could get replaced by someone way more capable then they are so they scorn the smart/brilliant people and make them feel they are worthless. This is the same with the Universities of Vietnam. Vietnam VCP still runs by ignorant thugs. These thugs only worry about their powers and money.

There's Dreamplex in Ho Chi Minh which stands out the most. But I wouldn't say that is a place for R&D.

That should be part of the reasons. Limited investment, plus low-efficiency governance, are both explanations to the drop.

BTW, what is the Dreamplex you mentioned? Any details to share? Many thanks in advance.

 

[xunzi]

Their competition is the Pinoy so look like they are ahead of the Pinoy.

 

[BoQ77]

Each year, the Nature Index publishes tables based on counts of high-quality research outputs in the previous calendar year. It is important for users to understand that the data behind the tables are based on a relatively small proportion of total research papers, that they cover the natural sciences only and that outputs are non-normalized (that is, they don’t reflect the size of the country or institution, or its overall research output). We encourage users to combine the free-to-access Nature Index data with information from other sources.

And please don't swap the R&D term to published research papers

@GS Zhou posted the charts of research papers output, so I think he want to talk about the QUANTITY of PUBLISHED research papers output from Vietnam declined in two continuous years.

As noted by Nature Index, their data based on natural sciences only.

Research and development, abbreviation R and D, or R & D, in industry, two intimately related processes by which new products and new forms of old products are brought into being through technological innovation. - Britanica

In every means, the first post of @GS Zhou can't be titled as R&D dropped.

So, I believe that the thread title misleaded @waz

 

[GS Zhou]

Each year, the Nature Index publishes tables based on counts of high-quality research outputs in the previous calendar year. It is important for users to understand that the data behind the tables are based on a relatively small proportion of total research papers, that they cover the natural sciences only and that outputs are non-normalized (that is, they don’t reflect the size of the country or institution, or its overall research output). We encourage users to combine the free-to-access Nature Index data with information from other sources.

And please don't swap the R&D term to published research papers

papers published by world's BEST research journals, the indicator itself is already strong enough to prove the R&D progress of each country.

In addition, what be discussed here is NOT the absolute number, but the growth rate. No one expects Vietnam to publish as many high quality papers as China or Japan. What we saw is Vietnam's performance in 2015 is worse than its own performance in 2014, and the performance in 2014 is worse than 2013 performance. I think every rational person should agree that this is a bad signal that worth serious actions.

As a patriotic Vietnamese, you'd better think how your government could do differently to change the declining trends, rather than challenge this index.

 

[BoQ77]

papers published by world's BEST research journals, the indicator itself is already strong enough to prove the R&D progress of each country.

In addition, what be discussed here is NOT the absolute number, but the growth rate. No one expects Vietnam to publish as many high quality papers as China or Japan. What we saw is Vietnam's performance in 2015 is worse than its own performance in 2014, and the performance in 2014 is worse than 2013 performance. I think every rational person should agree that this is a bad signal that worth serious actions.

As a patriotic Vietnamese, you'd better think how your government could do differently to change the declining trends, rather than challenge this index.

Do you understand the meaning of Nature Index table ? @GS Zhou

I think you violated the rule to use Nature Index in wrong manner.
And create a misleading title, not based on the post.

1.4 Caveats on the use of Nature Index
The Nature Index is primarily a free database of author affiliation information that reveals global publication and collaboration patterns. Once a year, Nature Index releases a set of country- and institutional-level tables based on counts of high-quality research outputs in the previous calendar year. It is important for users to understand that these tables are based on a relatively small proportion of total research articles, that they cover the natural sciences only, and that outputs are non-normalized (that is, they don’t reflect the size of the institution or country, or its overall research output). We encourage users to combine the free-to-access Nature Index data with information from other sources.

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[GS Zhou]

Do you understand the meaning of Nature Index table ? @GS Zhou

I believe I understand the term better than you.

NatureIndex refers to the articles published by the BEST research journals worldwide. From Chemistry to Physics, from Human Science to Earth Science. It is a common practice for the research staff globally to send their findings to these journals, but only the BEST ones could be selected to be published. It's a well-accepted index in the world of scientific research.

 

[BoQ77]

I believe I understand the term better than you.

NatureIndex refers to the articles published by the BEST research journals worldwide. From Chemistry to Physics, from Human Science to Earth Science. It is a common practice for the research staff globally to send their findings to these journals, but only the BEST ones could be selected to be published. It's a well-accepted index in the world of scientific research.

I just want to know whether you understand NatureIndex table and R&D terms correctly or not.
I wonder why you used NatureIndex tables to prove that R&D in this or that country drops

Read what NatureIndex reminded

1.4 Caveats on the use of Nature Index
The Nature Index is primarily a free database of author affiliation information that reveals global publication and collaboration patterns. Once a year, Nature Index releases a set of country- and institutional-level tables based on counts of high-quality research outputs in the previous calendar year. It is important for users to understand that these tables are based on a relatively small proportion of total research articles, that they cover the natural sciences only, and that outputs are non-normalized (that is, they don’t reflect the size of the institution or country, or its overall research output). We encourage users to combine the free-to-access Nature Index data with information from other sources.

So, you could say based on the published scientific articles, we could assume that Vietnam natural sciences researches are on the declining. Anyway, you could never know what wasn't published ( have in mind that Vietnamese scientists still published in domestic magazines which never been counted in NatureIndex tables ), and can't link the quantity of published of natural sciences research paper output to the R&D

@jhungary @gambit

 

[Viet]

Don't engage in research and development.
Hurry to buy ammunition

some money goes here: Hanoi University (Thanh Long)

 

[GS Zhou]

I just want to know whether you understand NatureIndex table and R&D terms correctly or not.
I wonder why you used NatureIndex tables to prove that R&D in this or that country drops

I understand your bad feeling to read the post. But it is not my fault. You'd better to challenge your government about the bad performance of Vietnam, rather than make challenges on this index.

You want me to change the title? Change to what? Change the "R&D" to "scientific research"? Will the title
"Vietnam: the ONLY Asian developing country that drops in Scientific Research" make you happy??

It is not shameful to lagging behind in a contest temporarily. No one is born strong. What shameful is that you even don't want to acknowledge you are lagging behind.

 

[BoQ77]

I understand your bad feeling to read the post. But it is not my fault. You'd better to challenge your government about the bad performance of Vietnam, rather than make challenges on this index.

You want me to change the title? Change to what? Change the "R&D" to "scientific research"? Will the title
"Vietnam: the ONLY Asian developing country that drops in Scientific Research" make you happy??

It is not shameful to lagging behind in a contest temporarily. No one is born strong. What shameful is that you even don't want to acknowledge you are lagging behind.

I have not any bad feeling, but think it's funny to make conclusion your way.

So to you, what is the best way to measure the R&D ?

 

[GS Zhou]

I have not any bad feeling, but think it's funny to make conclusion your way.

I also think it is very funny that you don't blame your government about this, but blame me.

 

[BoQ77]

I also think it is very funny that you don't blame your government about this, but blame me.

No, I don't blame you. I laught out loud at you.
You are lack comprehensive ability and disrespect the caveats on uses of NatureIndex tables
http://www.natureindex.com/faq#introduction4