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Vietnam Defence Forum

Yes you have better relationship to America. Yes you get US weaponry, receiving better treatment. Yes you can build aircraft, ships and submarines with the assistance from South Korea and other western partners.

But if the Chinese take over the South China Sea tomorrow, controlling the $5 trillion commercial see traffic, can you do anything to stop the Chinese?

Can singapore, the other privileged nation, do anything?

If again the Khmer run amok staging genocide, can you do anything?

Can you do anything at all if a conflict or war breaks out in the region?

In reality you can Nothing.

So all others. They can nothing, either.

But if Vietnam gets a little bit better access to western weaponry, the Chinese become sleepless. The Chinese will pour money into Cambodia and Thailand as if we want to enslave the people of south east Asia tomorrow.

In short, Vietnam can alter the balance of power.

The Chinese know it: Indonesia and the rest can be ignored.
That's the reason why the chinese invest in the Formosa steel complex. Their grand purpose is to poison all the fish off the coast of central vietnam. By killing all the fishes, they will make all the fishing boats of vietnam grounded and have no incentive of going out at sea. When the scs is absence with all the viet fishing boats then the scs is a de facto chinese water. This is the reason why uprising has been en masse around the formosa steel complex with local people demand your vcp to shut down the complex.
 
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That's the reason why the chinese invest in the Formosa steel complex. Their grand purpose is to poison all the fish off the coast of central vietnam. By killing all the fishes, they will make all the fishing boats of vietnam grounded and have no incentive of going out at sea. When the scs is absence with all the viet fishing boats then the scs is a de facto chinese water. This is the reason why uprising has been en masse around the formosa steel complex with local people demand your vcp to shut down the complex.
Don't talk nonsense. Formosa steel plant is not under control of Ccp. If anything the company is under control of shareholders, and now under strict scrutiny of Vietnam environmental ministry. The Taiwanese bring $11b, later additional $11b, so in total $22b. That is a lot of money for Vietnam. They generate jobs and incomes for hundred thousand of workers. They pay taxes. And don't forget why the steel plant is set up: we need steel to reduce imports from China. 22.5m ton steel. the capacity will double to 45m ton in the second phase.

I can understand the protests, but demand of shutting down the plant is rediculous. And dangerous. It won't help anyone but will harm Vietnam enormously.

NE_Chart_2.jpg
 
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@Viet your reasoning is baseless and more like some ultra Nationalist bastard who keep arguing meh Country is the best and yuo other is nuthing, and thats very big LOL.

What made Vietnam can be better to utilizing all of the western made weapons compared to other Countries like Indonesia, Singapore who had already established our military doctrine, training module and perfected the way to use it for decades? And we had been fighting our wars with those kind of equipments and capable to handling demanding logistic issue and so on

Remember, even your South Vietnamese brethren cant utilize many US and her allies made war machines because they found it logistical demanding and very complex by nature . Is the same story cant be repeated again? Vietnam Army which is lack in initiative and research field units because of Sovyet commies doctrine standard will not get a hold to utilize NATO standard model.

In case of War against China, please stop dreaming. Your Country will be very much isolated and blockaded the moment the war is declared. The only possible routes of help for Vietnam is from the Southern Countries, like Indonesia, Australia, Singapore, and Malaysia who hold considerable Naval power and have mutual assistance arrangement between them. But it seems YOUR SUPER DUPER FROM ANOTHER PLANET OF COUNTRY CALLED VIETNAM CAN FACE ANYTHING ON EARTH ALONE, SO WHY BOTHER WITH US.
 
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Don't talk nonsense. Formosa steel plant is not under control of Ccp. If anything the company is under control of shareholders, and now under strict scrutiny of Vietnam environmental ministry. The Taiwanese bring $11b, later additional $11b, so in total $22b. That is a lot of money for Vietnam. They generate jobs and incomes for hundred thousand of workers. They pay taxes. And don't forget why the steel plant is set up: we need steel to reduce imports from China. 22.5m ton steel. the capacity will double to 45m ton in the second phase.

I can understand the protests, but demand of shutting down the plant is rediculous. And dangerous. It won't help anyone but will harm Vietnam enormously.

NE_Chart_2.jpg
What nonsense? I'm nonsense? Ok, what about the 90 million plus Viet people in Vietnam? You are such a tool of the VCP. Everyone in Vietnam with the exception of vcp supporters want to shut down this Formosa crap immediately. Let's talk about something nonsense here. Even the folks from Ha Tinh where they are supposed to work for this Formosa complex protest en masse demanding this steel complex to be shut down and they promise that they won't stop protesting until this steel complex is shut down. Do you even know that just two weeks ago, people protested right in the middle of Saigon demanding the vcp to shut down this Formosa crap?

You want more nonsense? There is no more fish (except dead fishes) for fishermen in the central coast of Vietnam to fish thanks to your Formosa steel plant polluting the environment. The fishermen of the central coast have lost their only and main source of income ie fishing. The Chinese are killing the normal viet folks from inside Vietnam without firing a single shot and you're still cheering on it?

And FYI the Chinese do not bring in $11 billion with this steel complex and hand it to your hand. $11 billion is the capitalized amount of their own equipment, machineries, materials to build this steel complex. They even bring in their own workers to build it too. Vietnam is getting NOTHING out of this $11 billion my naïve friend. Let me tell you what Vietnam will get out of this Formosa crap that Vietnamese folks want to shut it down NOW; cheap wages paid to a couple thousand of workers. Let's say that the median wage is $2000 usd/year per worker and the complex employ 5000 workers; that's $1 million usd. Yup, that's $1 million usd/year that this Formosa crap complex is contributing to the economy of Vietnam. In return, the Formosa complex poison and kill all the fishes of Vietnam and cost Vietnam BILLION of dollars.

I'm very generous with the $1 million usd number; this number should be ZERO now because none of the Viet at Ha Tinh wants to work for this Formosa complex so where can the Chinese find people to work for them; they have to import Chinese workers into Vietnam to take care of this crap.
 
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What nonsense? I'm nonsense? Ok, what about the 90 million plus Viet people in Vietnam? You are such a tool of the VCP. Everyone in Vietnam with the exception of vcp supporters want to shut down this Formosa crap immediately. Let's talk about something nonsense here. Even the folks from Ha Tinh where they are supposed to work for this Formosa complex protest en masse demanding this steel complex to be shut down and they promise that they won't stop protesting until this steel complex is shut down. Do you even know that just two weeks ago, people protested right in the middle of Saigon demanding the vcp to shut down this Formosa crap?

You want more nonsense? There is no more fish (except dead fishes) for fishermen in the central coast of Vietnam to fish thanks to your Formosa steel plant polluting the environment. The fishermen of the central coast have lost their only and main source of income ie fishing. The Chinese are killing the normal viet folks from inside Vietnam without firing a single shot and you're still cheering on it?

And FYI the Chinese do not bring in $11 billion with this steel complex and hand it to your hand. $11 billion is the capitalized amount of their own equipment, machineries, materials to build this steel complex. They even bring in their own workers to build it too. Vietnam is getting NOTHING out of this $11 billion my naïve friend. Let me tell you what Vietnam will get out of this Formosa crap that Vietnamese folks want to shut it down NOW; cheap wages paid to a couple thousand of workers. Let's say that the median wage is $2000 usd/year per worker and the complex employ 5000 workers; that's $1 million usd. Yup, that's $1 million usd/year that this Formosa crap complex is contributing to the economy of Vietnam. In return, the Formosa complex poison and kill all the fishes of Vietnam and cost Vietnam BILLION of dollars.

I'm very generous with the $1 million usd number; this number should be ZERO now because none of the Viet at Ha Tinh wants to work for this Formosa complex so where can the Chinese find people to work for them; they have to import Chinese workers into Vietnam to take care of this crap.
Hey $1m is money too, isn't it? You should write more such essays to invite more foreigners putting more money to Vietnam. Because the foreigners profits most, while Vietnam nothing. As for Chinese workers, in case you haven't noticed, Vietnam has liberated the labor laws. Any foreigner with high skills, with university degree, the domestic market cannot offer, is welcome to come to Vietnam seeking job and opportunity.

You are troller!

I give you a hint. Exxon invests $10b in a gas project. Vietnam government is expected to get $20n as share of the project. Assuming the profit is shared 50:50, Exxon gets $10b, while the Vietnamese partner gets $10$.

Formosa is no exception. I expect Vietnam and the company will share 50:50 profits. As there is no Vietnamese partner, Formosa will get 50pct.

foreign companies expect a minimum of 10pct interest or return on investment capital. If Vietnam fails to offer such profit, nobody will invest.

Also true, Vietnam will not offer profits to foreigners if she doesn't get a fair share.

@Viet your reasoning is baseless and more like some ultra Nationalist bastard who keep arguing meh Country is the best and yuo other is nuthing, and thats very big LOL.

What made Vietnam can be better to utilizing all of the western made weapons compared to other Countries like Indonesia, Singapore who had already established our military doctrine, training module and perfected the way to use it for decades? And we had been fighting our wars with those kind of equipments and capable to handling demanding logistic issue and so on

Remember, even your South Vietnamese brethren cant utilize many US and her allies made war machines because they found it logistical demanding and very complex by nature . Is the same story cant be repeated again? Vietnam Army which is lack in initiative and research field units because of Sovyet commies doctrine standard will not get a hold to utilize NATO standard model.

In case of War against China, please stop dreaming. Your Country will be very much isolated and blockaded the moment the war is declared. The only possible routes of help for Vietnam is from the Southern Countries, like Indonesia, Australia, Singapore, and Malaysia who hold considerable Naval power and have mutual assistance arrangement between them. But it seems YOUR SUPER DUPER FROM ANOTHER PLANET OF COUNTRY CALLED VIETNAM CAN FACE ANYTHING ON EARTH ALONE, SO WHY BOTHER WITH US.
Calm down sis. You failed to answer the questions I raised. Nothing with super ultra nationalistic bastard as you shouted at me. For example,

If the Chinese want to take over the South China Sea tomorrow, what can you do?

Or do you continue to sit on Leopard Panzers, driving around the Jakarta road until the fuel runs out?

I don't think the Chinese will be impressed by your well established military doctrine, training module and will stop the invasion of the South China Sea.
 
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That's the reason why the chinese invest in the Formosa steel complex. Their grand purpose is to poison all the fish off the coast of central vietnam. By killing all the fishes, they will make all the fishing boats of vietnam grounded and have no incentive of going out at sea. When the scs is absence with all the viet fishing boats then the scs is a de facto chinese water. This is the reason why uprising has been en masse around the formosa steel complex with local people demand your vcp to shut down the complex.

Interesting, according to you, the chinese control a private taiwanese company and the pollution was done for political purposes. Brilliant !!! as it can only be expected from a highly evolved brain as yours :tup::tup::tup:

@Viet your reasoning is baseless and more like some ultra Nationalist bastard who keep arguing meh Country is the best and yuo other is nuthing, and thats very big LOL.

What made Vietnam can be better to utilizing all of the western made weapons compared to other Countries like Indonesia, Singapore who had already established our military doctrine, training module and perfected the way to use it for decades? And we had been fighting our wars with those kind of equipments and capable to handling demanding logistic issue and so on

Remember, even your South Vietnamese brethren cant utilize many US and her allies made war machines because they found it logistical demanding and very complex by nature . Is the same story cant be repeated again? Vietnam Army which is lack in initiative and research field units because of Sovyet commies doctrine standard will not get a hold to utilize NATO standard model.

In case of War against China, please stop dreaming. Your Country will be very much isolated and blockaded the moment the war is declared. The only possible routes of help for Vietnam is from the Southern Countries, like Indonesia, Australia, Singapore, and Malaysia who hold considerable Naval power and have mutual assistance arrangement between them. But it seems YOUR SUPER DUPER FROM ANOTHER PLANET OF COUNTRY CALLED VIETNAM CAN FACE ANYTHING ON EARTH ALONE, SO WHY BOTHER WITH US.

Good one, a well known ultranationalist is accusing someone else of being ultranationalist. :yahoo:

What nonsense? I'm nonsense? Ok, what about the 90 million plus Viet people in Vietnam? You are such a tool of the VCP. Everyone in Vietnam with the exception of vcp supporters want to shut down this Formosa crap immediately. Let's talk about something nonsense here. Even the folks from Ha Tinh where they are supposed to work for this Formosa complex protest en masse demanding this steel complex to be shut down and they promise that they won't stop protesting until this steel complex is shut down. Do you even know that just two weeks ago, people protested right in the middle of Saigon demanding the vcp to shut down this Formosa crap?

You want more nonsense? There is no more fish (except dead fishes) for fishermen in the central coast of Vietnam to fish thanks to your Formosa steel plant polluting the environment. The fishermen of the central coast have lost their only and main source of income ie fishing. The Chinese are killing the normal viet folks from inside Vietnam without firing a single shot and you're still cheering on it?

And FYI the Chinese do not bring in $11 billion with this steel complex and hand it to your hand. $11 billion is the capitalized amount of their own equipment, machineries, materials to build this steel complex. They even bring in their own workers to build it too. Vietnam is getting NOTHING out of this $11 billion my naïve friend. Let me tell you what Vietnam will get out of this Formosa crap that Vietnamese folks want to shut it down NOW; cheap wages paid to a couple thousand of workers. Let's say that the median wage is $2000 usd/year per worker and the complex employ 5000 workers; that's $1 million usd. Yup, that's $1 million usd/year that this Formosa crap complex is contributing to the economy of Vietnam. In return, the Formosa complex poison and kill all the fishes of Vietnam and cost Vietnam BILLION of dollars.

I'm very generous with the $1 million usd number; this number should be ZERO now because none of the Viet at Ha Tinh wants to work for this Formosa complex so where can the Chinese find people to work for them; they have to import Chinese workers into Vietnam to take care of this crap.

I supposed that the billions in usd that Vietnam has to spend annually in steel imports that will be replaced by Formosa's production is NOTHING right? I guess Vietnam has so much hard currency reserves and positive trade balance that it doesn't really need it. Brilliant again :tup::tup::tup:
 
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Hey $1m is money too, isn't it? You should write more such essays to invite more foreigners putting more money to Vietnam. Because the foreigners profits most, while Vietnam nothing. As for Chinese workers, in case you haven't noticed, Vietnam has liberated the labor laws. Any foreigner with high skills, with university degree, the domestic market cannot offer, is welcome to come to Vietnam seeking job and opportunity.

You are troller!

I give you a hint. Exxon invests $10b in a gas project. Vietnam government is expected to get $20n as share of the project. Assuming the profit is shared 50:50, Exxon gets $10b, while the Vietnamese partner gets $10$.

Formosa is no exception. I expect Vietnam and the company will share 50:50 profits. As there is no Vietnamese partner, Formosa will get 50pct.

foreign companies expect a minimum of 10pct interest or return on investment capital. If Vietnam fails to offer such profit, nobody will invest.

Also true, Vietnam will not offer profits to foreigners if she doesn't get a fair share.


Calm down sis. You failed to answer the questions I raised. Nothing with super ultra nationalistic bastard as you shouted at me. For example,

If the Chinese want to take over the South China Sea tomorrow, what can you do?

Or do you continue to sit on Leopard Panzers, driving around the Jakarta road until the fuel runs out?

I don't think the Chinese will be impressed by your well established military doctrine, training module and will stop the invasion of the South China Sea.

as is Vietnam had power or mean to resist them

oh yeah right in your dreams

Interesting, according to you, the chinese control a private taiwanese company and the pollution was done for political purposes. Brilliant !!! as it can only be expected from a highly evolved brain as yours :tup::tup::tup:



Good one, a well known ultranationalist is accusing someone else of being ultranationalist. :yahoo:



I supposed that the billions in usd that Vietnam has to spend annually in steel imports that will be replaced by Formosa's production is NOTHING right? I guess Vietnam has so much hard currency reserves and positive trade balance that it doesn't really need it. Brilliant again :tup::tup::tup:

said Vietnam pompom boys
 
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as is Vietnam had power or mean to resist them

oh yeah right in your dreams
Sis we have confronted the Chinese in more times than your hands with 10 fingers. Now it is your turn.

Show the world your military power in real battles. Stop riding on tanks making pictures of yourself. Stop talking of your superior military doctrine and other theoretical stuff nobody takes seriously if not proven in combats.

The Chinese are about to take over the sea lanes in east and southern pacific. Send your warships and submarines to stop them before the Chinese strangulate all. Can you?
 
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First of all I do not mean to offend anybody.

Our foreign policy of this country was born in 1945, is the policy of Free and Active. Free impartially block anywhere in the world and actively contribute to world peace, it is stated in our constitution.

To achieve this, our country since birth carrying out measures to enforce our policies.

We held a first conference for Asian and African countries in Bandung to encourage equality and freedom of Asia and Africa countries. together with Burma, Pakistan, Ceylon (Sri Lanka), and India in 1955.

We join together to initiate the movement of non-aligned with Yugoslavia, India, Egypt, Ghana in 1961.

Since 1957 until today, we send our troops as part of a UN peacekeeping mission.

We assist in the resolution of conflict around the region by peaceful means, such as providing the largest refugee camp for refugees of civil war vietnam in Batam island in 1979. Mediate the conflict in the region between the kingdom of Cambodia and Thailand at Preah vier area.

To attempt mediation South China Sea conflict that resulted in the code of conduct.

Indonesia never want to interfere with the interests of neighboring countries because Indonesia is bound by the foreign policy of 'free and active' and as long as there is democracy in Indonesia, efforts to uphold these principles are always there.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_relations_of_Indonesia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bandung_Conference
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-Aligned_Movement
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garuda_Contingent
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnamese_boat_people
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galang_Refugee_Camp
http://www.dw.com/en/indonesias-role-in-the-thai-cambodia-border-dispute-still-unclear/a-6483440
http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/02/08/cambodia.thailand.violence/

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/world/indonesia-pushes-for-code-of-conduct-on-south-china-sea-row/news-story/8235cec1ec86703f5f45d52bf4b9ad6a
 
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First of all I do not mean to offend anybody.

Our foreign policy of this country was born in 1945, is the policy of Free and Active. Free impartially block anywhere in the world and actively contribute to world peace, it is stated in our constitution.

To achieve this, our country since birth carrying out measures to enforce our policies.

We held a first conference for Asian and African countries in Bandung to encourage equality and freedom of Asia and Africa countries. together with Burma, Pakistan, Ceylon (Sri Lanka), and India in 1955.

We join together to initiate the movement of non-aligned with Yugoslavia, India, Egypt, Ghana in 1961.

Since 1957 until today, we send our troops as part of a UN peacekeeping mission.

We assist in the resolution of conflict around the region by peaceful means, such as providing the largest refugee camp for refugees of civil war vietnam in Batam island in 1979. Mediate the conflict in the region between the kingdom of Cambodia and Thailand at Preah vier area.

To attempt mediation South China Sea conflict that resulted in the code of conduct.

Indonesia never want to interfere with the interests of neighboring countries because Indonesia is bound by the foreign policy of 'free and active' and as long as there is democracy in Indonesia, efforts to uphold these principles are always there.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_relations_of_Indonesia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bandung_Conference
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-Aligned_Movement
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garuda_Contingent
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnamese_boat_people
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galang_Refugee_Camp
http://www.dw.com/en/indonesias-role-in-the-thai-cambodia-border-dispute-still-unclear/a-6483440
http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/02/08/cambodia.thailand.violence/

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/world/indonesia-pushes-for-code-of-conduct-on-south-china-sea-row/news-story/8235cec1ec86703f5f45d52bf4b9ad6a
You should be happy living on islands protected by seas. Far away from major powers. We aren't lucky. There are too many out there who want to destroy our country, killing our people, looting our properties by citing, using every excuses. No we can't simply do a policy of Free and Active. We can't do peaceful activities, can't hold peaceful conferences, can't travel around promoting indo way of live, either. The only thing that keeps us free is the power of millions cannons.



 
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Hey $1m is money too, isn't it? You should write more such essays to invite more foreigners putting more money to Vietnam. Because the foreigners profits most, while Vietnam nothing. As for Chinese workers, in case you haven't noticed, Vietnam has liberated the labor laws. Any foreigner with high skills, with university degree, the domestic market cannot offer, is welcome to come to Vietnam seeking job and opportunity.

You are troller!

I give you a hint. Exxon invests $10b in a gas project. Vietnam government is expected to get $20n as share of the project. Assuming the profit is shared 50:50, Exxon gets $10b, while the Vietnamese partner gets $10$.

Formosa is no exception. I expect Vietnam and the company will share 50:50 profits. As there is no Vietnamese partner, Formosa will get 50pct.

foreign companies expect a minimum of 10pct interest or return on investment capital. If Vietnam fails to offer such profit, nobody will invest.

Also true, Vietnam will not offer profits to foreigners if she doesn't get a fair share.
You are so brilliant mr. troll. You acknowledge that Formosa only contributes 1 million usd to Vietnam economy while the steel plant destroys the multi-BILLION dollar fishing industry of Vietnam; what an idiotic trade off.

Your intelligence top it all when you claim that Formosa steel plant is going to share 50/50 profit with your vcp. hey, let me give you a hint; do you see Samsung or Toyota share 50/50 profit with your vcp? lol

Do you even know why exxon and Vietnam share 50/50 profit with that gas field? let me give you a partial hint. without the usa 7th fleet, no foreign corporation has the balls to develop that gas field within the 9 dashed line.
this is the largest gas field ever discovered in vietnam and it lays in the hottest spot of the scs conflict ie it lays between the central coast of vietnam and the paracels water; that' the reason why BP pulled out and exxon took over.

Interesting, according to you, the chinese control a private taiwanese company and the pollution was done for political purposes. Brilliant !!! as it can only be expected from a highly evolved brain as yours :tup::tup::tup:

I supposed that the billions in usd that Vietnam has to spend annually in steel imports that will be replaced by Formosa's production is NOTHING right? I guess Vietnam has so much hard currency reserves and positive trade balance that it doesn't really need it. Brilliant again :tup::tup::tup:
I guess you are too smart to realize that it is the people of vietnam especially the local folks where this Formosa complex is located want to shut down this steel plant, right? Hey, how about the multi-billion dollar fishing industry of vietnam that is being destroyed by this Chinese steel plant? How about the irreversible damage to the environment that this steel plant is causing by making all the fishes of central coast of vietnam dead? do you even realize that there are so many steel complex in vietnam but none is being demanded to be shut down by the people except this Formosa crap? I guess you are too brilliant to not understand it, heh?
 
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You are so brilliant mr. troll. You acknowledge that Formosa only contributes 1 million usd to Vietnam economy while the steel plant destroys the multi-BILLION dollar fishing industry of Vietnam; what an idiotic trade off.

Your intelligence top it all when you claim that Formosa steel plant is going to share 50/50 profit with your vcp. hey, let me give you a hint; do you see Samsung or Toyota share 50/50 profit with your vcp? lol

Do you even know why exxon and Vietnam share 50/50 profit with that gas field? let me give you a partial hint. without the usa 7th fleet, no foreign corporation has the balls to develop that gas field within the 9 dashed line.
this is the largest gas field ever discovered in vietnam and it lays in the hottest spot of the scs conflict ie it lays between the central coast of vietnam and the paracels water; that' the reason why BP pulled out and exxon took over.


I guess you are too smart to realize that it is the people of vietnam especially the local folks where this Formosa complex is located want to shut down this steel plant, right? Hey, how about the multi-billion dollar fishing industry of vietnam that is being destroyed by this Chinese steel plant? How about the irreversible damage to the environment that this steel plant is causing by making all the fishes of central coast of vietnam dead? do you even realize that there are so many steel complex in vietnam but none is being demanded to be shut down by the people except this Formosa crap? I guess you are too brilliant to not understand it, heh?

Not at all amigo, you are mixing up different subjects. You made a case about economics saying that Vietnam doesn't get anything and I refuted your statements which really didn't make sense from an economic point of you. I limited myself just about the economics related to having that steel plant.

Maybe you didn't notice that I didn't say anything about the other subjects that you mentioned, but if you want to know my opinion about the pollution and the fact that most Vietnamese don't like Formosa and as many protestors said in that famous slogan "I prefer fish", I can tell you that I agree with them.

The problem is not actually the foreign investors that pollute, the problem is the misguided government policies that give all investors, foreign and vietnamese a free hand to pollute. As government officials admitted after the formosa incident, the environmental regulations and requirements and environmental impact assessments of projects were just a "formality", nobody really cared or followed up on it. So, of course, investor will pollute as much as they need. The local government allowed formosa to build the underwater pipe and of course we all know why. The main guilt belongs to those that allow formosa to pollute. Bad government policies and corrupt government officials are the main ones to blame. And lets not forget that the first reaction from the government was to deny that formosa was to blame. Only when they realized that they had a very hot potato in their hands and that nobody believed the official story, then they turned around and started to change the story.

There are many smaller formosas all around Vietnam and is all happening because of the same reasons. At least the formosa incident woke up a lot of people and the government was forced to start to change their attitude to pollution and the environment.
 
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You are so brilliant mr. troll. You acknowledge that Formosa only contributes 1 million usd to Vietnam economy while the steel plant destroys the multi-BILLION dollar fishing industry of Vietnam; what an idiotic trade off.

Your intelligence top it all when you claim that Formosa steel plant is going to share 50/50 profit with your vcp. hey, let me give you a hint; do you see Samsung or Toyota share 50/50 profit with your vcp? lol

Do you even know why exxon and Vietnam share 50/50 profit with that gas field? let me give you a partial hint. without the usa 7th fleet, no foreign corporation has the balls to develop that gas field within the 9 dashed line.
this is the largest gas field ever discovered in vietnam and it lays in the hottest spot of the scs conflict ie it lays between the central coast of vietnam and the paracels water; that' the reason why BP pulled out and exxon took over.


I guess you are too smart to realize that it is the people of vietnam especially the local folks where this Formosa complex is located want to shut down this steel plant, right? Hey, how about the multi-billion dollar fishing industry of vietnam that is being destroyed by this Chinese steel plant? How about the irreversible damage to the environment that this steel plant is causing by making all the fishes of central coast of vietnam dead? do you even realize that there are so many steel complex in vietnam but none is being demanded to be shut down by the people except this Formosa crap? I guess you are too brilliant to not understand it, heh?
Where do I acknowledge the $1m figure? I said that is money, too. Learn the difference. If anything it is you who must provide proof for the figure!

Wrong. Vietnam has multiple oil projects without the 9 dash lines for years. Look at the map of oil drilling platforms of the southern part of Vietnam.

You can hope, dreaming day and night, Formosa will close the plant due to the demand of 100 protesters. But I'm afraid you will wait for ever. The chance of return of dinosaurs on the earth is higher.

I can see, you will cry the river when the HSR is coming.
 
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Rivlin tour is proof Israel, Vietnam are brothers in arms
By XUAN LOC DOAN MARCH 25, 2017 11:09 AM (UTC+8)

http://www.atimes.com/hosting-israels-president-vietnam-seeks-closer-defense-ties/

Israeli President Reuven Rivlin’s tour of Vietnam indicates ties between both countries are improving, especially in the area of defense area. The state visit, which ends today, is just the second to Vietnam by an Israeli head of state.

In November 2011, former President Shimon Peres became the first Israeli leader to visit Vietnam. The bilateral relationship has progressed rapidly since then, with both nations exchanging high-level visits and extending cooperation across many fields, including trade.

According to Vietnamese statistics, the two-way trade between was US$1.3 billion last year, rising from US$68 million in 2005. Trade will increase rapidly in the next few years, with both countries committed to striking a free-trade agreement.

The core of the relationship is, and continues to be, cooperation in defense. In March 2015, Vietnam’s Deputy Minister of Defense Nguyen Chi Vinh and Israel’s Director General of the Ministry of Defense, Dan Harel, signed a memorandum of understanding on defense cooperation, that strengthened cooperation in areas such defense sales and technology transfer.

Earlier this year, Pham Ngoc Minh, the Deputy Chief of the General Staff of the Vietnamese People’s Army (VPA), received Mishel Ben-Baruch, the Director of the International Defense Cooperation Directorate of Israel’s Ministry of Defense. The meeting ended with a resolution to improve bilateral defense cooperation.

One month later, Yitzhak Aharonovitch, chairman of Israel Military Industries Ltd (IMM), a state-owned weapons developer and manufacturer, was in Hanoi.

In hosting Aharonovitch, who already visited Vietnam in February 2014 in his role as Minister of Public Security, Vietnam’s President Tran Dai Quang said bilateral cooperation, especially in defense, “has consistently advanced.” Quang, who toured Israel in November last year in his former role as Minister of Public Security, said Israel “has become a big partner of Vietnam in the defense field.”

Lieutenant General Nguyen Chi Vinh, said he hoped that Aharonovitch and his company would continue contributing to advancing cooperation on defense.

That Vietnam’s president and a high-ranking VPA official received the head of one of Israel’s leading arms companies indicates Hanoi’s desire to enhance its defense ties with Israel and upgrade its defense capabilities.

In an IMI statement Aharonovitch said he hoped “both countries will work on streamlining the mutual collaboration and high technology knowledge transfer.” He stressed that the “advanced weapons systems developed and manufactured by IMI Systems correspond to the advanced technology used by the Vietnam army.”

While the main purpose of President Rivlin’s week-long visit is to foster cooperation in fields such as agriculture, education, health and trade, defense cooperation remains top of the agenda.

Like his predecessor six years ago, the 77-year old traveled to Hanoi accompanied by a big defense industries delegation, which reportedly includes MMI Systems, Elbit Systems, Israel Aerospace Industries and Rafael Advanced Defense Systems. Elbit, Israel Aerospace and Rafael are ranked 29, 32 and 43 in the 2016 Stockholm International Peace Research Institute index of the world’s top 100 arms-producing and military service companies.

On Monday, Vietnam’s Defense Minister General Ngo Xuan Lich received the leaders of the Israeli defense businesses. A day later, the first Vietnam-Israel defense industry forum was held in Hanoi. Lich, Rivlin and many other officials from both sides attended.

Also on Tuesday, Lich, a Politburo member, met with Rivlin and both toured an exhibit of Israeli defense equipment. During the tour, several Israeli companies, whose products were displayed, presented them with developments and advancements in unmanned planes and drones, sophisticated tanks, rocket launchers, and others.

While acknowledging that much has been achieved, both the host and the guest underlined the demand for and potential of ongoing, significant deals in defense.

According to his spokesperson, Rivlin said to Lich as “you and I were raised in countries which were battlefields, we all know that quiet, security, and peace cannot be taken for granted. The military and security forces have a role, not just in times of war, but also in times of peace.”

The message would have been well received not only because of Vietnam’s battles against foreign aggression but also for the country’s need to strengthen the military to safeguard sovereignty and territory.

China’s expansive territorial claims and its military build-up in the disputed waters of the South China Sea are now Vietnam’s biggest concern. They are also the key reason why Hanoi is seeking closer defense ties with countries that have advanced military technologies and know-how, such as Israel.

Russia and Eastern European states have been Vietnam’s main arms suppliers. That has changed in the past decade with the purchase of Western-made arms. It has, for example, ordered Israel’s surface-to-air Python and Derby (Spyder) missiles. Vietnam has increased its military spending and turned to Israel not only because it is one of the world’s top exporters of military equipment but also because the Middle East military power is willing to share its expertise.

In his talks with Vietnam’s Defense Minister, the Israeli President said his country was “a pioneer in that it recognizes the need to establish advance production lines with Israeli know-how in Vietnam, and to produce with Vietnam and in Vietnam.” Lich expressed Vietnam’s appreciation for Israel’s “extensive and excellent cooperation in the field of defense”.

That Vietnam places the greatest importance in Rivlin’s visit was evident earlier this week when he was greeted by the president, prime minister and Communist Party secretary general, the three most powerful positions in Vietnam.
 
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Where do I acknowledge the $1m figure? I said that is money, too. Learn the difference. If anything it is you who must provide proof for the figure!

Wrong. Vietnam has multiple oil projects without the 9 dash lines for years. Look at the map of oil drilling platforms of the southern part of Vietnam.

You can hope, dreaming day and night, Formosa will close the plant due to the demand of 100 protesters. But I'm afraid you will wait for ever. The chance of return of dinosaurs on the earth is higher.

I can see, you will cry the river when the HSR is coming.

Protest on the street of Saigon


Protest at Ha Tinh where Formosa complex is located


Protest in Hanoi


And yet Formosa contributes to the economy of $1 million/year while destroying multi-BILLION dollar fishing industry. Considering how much you love Formosa, I hope those protestors catch communist goon like you and throw you in one of those blast furnaces.

And no, Vietnam does not have any oil fields within the 9 dashed line adjacent to the Paracel island. the only oil fields within the 9 dashed line are deep in the south. The area within the vicinity of the paracel island is a no-go zone that's why Exxon is the only company that can develop and drill.

I'm ready to cry a river when your HSR materialize, but WHEN?
 
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