USS Fitzgerald 'at fault': Crew failed to react to approaching cargo ship in devastating crash that

[shah1398]

Having gone through quite many posts and saw the trend where some members put a question mark on professionalism. Having said so let me go out of the cone and post something which probably would already been posted as a thread, just seeking the clarification if it was a genuine piece.

Thanks in advance.

 

[powastick]

Having gone through quite many posts and saw the trend where some members put a question mark on professionalism. Having said so let me go out of the cone and post something which probably would already been posted as a thread, just seeking the clarification if it was a genuine piece.

Thanks in advance.

Its a myth, the aircraft carrier vs light house (Debunked). But sure is funny.

 

[shah1398]

Its a myth, the aircraft carrier vs light house (Debunked). But sure is funny.

Well thats what i thought so

 

[powastick]

Pictures show clearly ACX Crystal rammed into Fitzgerald, and not the other way around (unlike CX Crystal, Fitzgerald has no damage to its bow area).

Your logic, the train ram truck on the side, so train is wrong.

 

[Penguin]

Your logic, the train ram truck on the side, so train is wrong.

@oprih said "highly trained and professional american sailors ramming their ship [in]to a cargo vessel". This is clearly incorrect. That is ALL I commented on. No other point was stated or implied. So, it is YOUR logic that is wrong here (because you ASSUME something else was implied and wrong assumptions lead to wrong conclusions: GIGO).

Without making ANY statement on Crystal and Fitzgerald in particular, relative ship positions, who hits who exactly how (speeds, angle), and how ships got there are not unimportant in such a case.

http://www.professionalmariner.com/...crossing-Dont-assume-what-other-ship-will-do/
https://www.myseatime.com/blog/detail/8-colreg-rules-every-navigating-officer-must-understand

 

[jhungary]

Pictures show clearly ACX Crystal rammed into Fitzgerald, and not the other way around (unlike CX Crystal, Fitzgerald has no damage to its bow area).


Plus, there are 4 investigations, and we have yet to see how much in agreement the conclusions of all those investigations will be ....

Yes, there are 4 independent investigation, 2 by the US, 2 by the Japanese.

The question is to how or why both ships collided into each other. The reason behind may be obscure and not everyone could agree on, but the facts should be the same.

 

[Cossack25A1]

Why bother explaining the truth to the PDF Chinese Clique in this forum and their followers? They will not listen to anyone unless that someone agrees with their point of view.

 

[Penguin]

Yes, there are 4 independent investigation, 2 by the US, 2 by the Japanese.

The question is to how or why both ships collided into each other. The reason behind may be obscure and not everyone could agree on, but the facts should be the same.

Wasn't Phillipines also conducting an investigation, since that is the flag country of ACX Crystal?

Why bother explaining the truth to the PDF Chinese Clique in this forum and their followers? They will not listen to anyone unless that someone agrees with their point of view.

See posts #53 and #61

 

[powastick]

@oprih said "highly trained and professional american sailors ramming their ship [in]to a cargo vessel". This is clearly incorrect. That is ALL I commented on. No other point was stated or implied. So, it is YOUR logic that is wrong here (because you ASSUME something else was implied and wrong assumptions lead to wrong conclusions: GIGO).

Without making ANY statement on Crystal and Fitzgerald in particular, relative ship positions, who hits who exactly how (speeds, angle), and how ships got there are not unimportant in such a case.

http://www.professionalmariner.com/...crossing-Dont-assume-what-other-ship-will-do/
https://www.myseatime.com/blog/detail/8-colreg-rules-every-navigating-officer-must-understand

Right of way between ships I am aware of, but the ultimate rule is both captain must avoid collision. The radar we are not seeing right now is USS Fitzgerald which they turn off AIS. Did USS Fitzgerald make a turn? A big cargo cannot respond to a sudden movement of an agile military ship. USS Fitzgerald did not respond to the ACX Crystal radio and did nothing moments before the collision. The notion that all ACX Crystal crew member were sleeping were in fact was a lie. USS Fitzgerald played a game of chicken with a cargo ship and lost.

 

[jhungary]

Wasn't Phillipines also conducting an investigation, since that is the flag country of ACX Crystal?


See posts #53 and #61

Philippine is the registration port only, they do not have stake on this incident as the collision does not happens in High Seas (the ships was hit inside Japanese Territorial water, 10 nm off Shizuoka), the official investigate was done by Japanese Transportation Safety Board, but the Force agreement the US had with Japan means the power to investigation to US naval warship inside Japan felt only to US Navy, which mean there are only 2 official investigation. (One by JTSB and One by US Navy)

However, USCG also initiate a separate and independent Investigation on behalf of Homeland Security, and the insurer for ACX Crystal (Which is Japanese Ship-ownership Corporation) would open another to determine the insurance aspect of the incident.

In total 4 Investigations, 2 by Japan, 2 by the US

USS Fitzgerald played a game of chicken with a cargo ship and lost.

This line is just pure gold.

a 9600 ton destroyer play chicken with a 70,000 tons cargo ship......lol, Even the dumbest of the dumbest crew won't do that given the odds...
LOL @Penguin

 

[Penguin]

Right of way between ships I am aware of, but the ultimate rule is both captain must avoid collision. The radar we are not seeing right now is USS Fitzgerald which they turn off AIS. Did USS Fitzgerald make a turn? A big cargo cannot respond to a sudden movement of an agile military ship. USS Fitzgerald did not respond to the ACX Crystal radio and did nothing moments before the collision. The notion that all ACX Crystal crew member were sleeping were in fact was a lie. USS Fitzgerald played a game of chicken with a cargo ship and lost.

Sorry, unlike you, I am not speculating pending the outcome of all the investigations.

 

[powastick]

Philippine is the registration port only, they do not have stake on this incident as the collision does not happens in High Seas (the ships was hit inside Japanese Territorial water, 10 nm off Shizuoka), the official investigate was done by Japanese Transportation Safety Board, but the Force agreement the US had with Japan means the power to investigation to US naval warship inside Japan felt only to US Navy, which mean there are only 2 official investigation. (One by JTSB and One by US Navy)

However, USCG also initiate a separate and independent Investigation on behalf of Homeland Security, and the insurer for ACX Crystal (Which is Japanese Ship-ownership Corporation) would open another to determine the insurance aspect of the incident.

In total 4 Investigations, 2 by Japan, 2 by the US



This line is just pure gold.

a 9600 ton destroyer play chicken with a 70,000 tons cargo ship......lol, Even the dumbest of the dumbest crew won't do that given the odds...
LOL @Penguin

US army discipline always comes into question.
http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com...ge-drag-race-probe-shows-2010mar05-story.html

 

[powastick]

Sorry, unlike you, I am not speculating pending the outcome of all the investigations.

The one manipulating mass media and withheld information is the US. If the USS Fitzgerald was innocent, US would have release its data to prove its innocent and this would have been a "no story" by now. Instead they peddle the idea of starboard side notion, refuse to pay the damages.

 

[jhungary]

US army discipline always comes into question.
http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com...ge-drag-race-probe-shows-2010mar05-story.html

Kind of nice to show an article 7 years old and claim the Navy (Not Army, that's another beef with you later on) discipline always come into questions.

So 5 years ago the Chinese Army did this

Can I say all Chinese soldier are grenade dumb-dumb in 2017?

Also, the video showing the Army Helicopter Crash, if you care to watch the video and look at the comment, you would have know the pilot miscalculated on the aerodynamic in a MOUNTAIN area, he could have been on training, he could have been on routine fly over. It's not about discipline, it's about judgement of the pilot. He would have to required to fly close to the ground if he is an attack helicopter pilot.

 

[Han Patriot]

Kind of nice to show an article 7 years old and claim the Navy (Not Army, that's another beef with you later on) discipline always come into questions.

So 5 years ago the Chinese Army did this

Can I say all Chinese soldier are grenade dumb-dumb in 2017?

Also, the video showing the Army Helicopter Crash, if you care to watch the video and look at the comment, you would have know the pilot miscalculated on the aerodynamic in a MOUNTAIN area, he could have been on training, he could have been on routine fly over. It's not about discipline, it's about judgement of the pilot. He would have to required to fly close to the ground if he is an attack helicopter pilot.

How can you compare a rookie training to an attack helicopter maneuver done on purpose. I have a tonne of army fails from around the world OK. Recruits sometimes makes mistake, that's why those holes are there when shit happens.

Such kind of accidents normally only happens to India due to their superb training. Same for their air crash record and of course their army accidents.