US Senate panel cuts Pakistan aid over conviction

[Developereo]

What usually constitute a 'treasonous', or harmful to the country, act?

Aiding a foreign military force to conduct clandestine operations in the country.

Then why is Pakistan jailing this doctor over the killing of a fake Osama?

He is being punished for treason (see above). It wouldn't matter if the US forces conducted a clandestine operation to swat a mosquito.

Then I am confused.

Ease up on the laughing gas. It may help clear up your thinking.

 

[AbhimanyuShrivastav]

Aiding a foreign military force to conduct clandestine operations in the country.
.

Has it ever been established that the doctor knew about the fact that the result of his activities would be an armed assault by US Marines on Pakistani soil. Otherwise, the services provided by him are not very different to the contractor who drove the fuel truck across Pakistan into Afg, which was used to fuel the choppers that dropped the ST6 members into abbotabad...

 

[Mercenary]

Aiding a foreign military force to conduct clandestine operations in the country.

He is being punished for treason (see above). It wouldn't matter if the US forces conducted a clandestine operation to swat a mosquito.

Even that foreign military force is your supposed ally and giving you economic and military assistance as well?

I can understand if Indian RAW agents hired this doctor to run a Vaccine scam in Karachi to find out where Dawood Ibrahim lived and sending in Indian special forces to kill him. Dawood Ibrahim is a strategic asset for Pakistan and thus any action against him is action against Pakistan.

But are you really that offended that Bin Laden was killed? Was Osama bin Laden a strategic asset for Pakistan?

Or would it have made any difference had USA told Pakistan the location of Bin Laden and conducted a joint operation against Bin Laden. Would that have made any difference?

 

[Developereo]

Has it ever been established that the doctor knew about the fact that the result of his activities would be an armed assault by US Marines on Pakistani soil. Otherwise, the services provided by him are not very different to the contractor who drove the fuel truck across Pakistan into Afg, which was used to fuel the choppers that dropped the ST6 members into abbotabad...

The courts heard the evidence and decided it was sufficient for a conviction. In case anyone thinks Pakistani courts are in cahoots with the army, just look at recent verdicts (Lal masjid, Baluchistan missing persons, etc.) where the courts threw the book at the security establishment.

 

[Secur]

Treason, eh?
So if Pakistan consider an individual acting on his own volition to expose a wanted person that Pakistan supposedly say is an 'enemy' to be 'treasonous' then may be it is likely that Osama bin Laden was living in Pakistan with consent from the Pakistani government.

Yeah treason !

It is the duty of the state of Pakistan to chose what information to provide and what to keep from the Americans ... Intelligence sharing is on an official level ! No individual is allowed to act on his own volition ... Get it ?
I am not aware of any agreement allowing the citizens of my country to bypass ISI and directly inform the CIA ... Neither do i consider acting for cash and Green Card as a noble cause ...
Why didn't the same individual notify the law enforcement agencies of his own country ?
ISI has turned over AQ and Taliban to the US in the past and rewarded civilians for information ...
Why would it have been any different this time ?

What would you call it if an American spots a Chechen terrorist in NY and then instead of calling FBI or police , notifies the FSB and then the Russians hunt him down ? What would it be , you double standard hypocrites !

 

[gambit]

Aiding a foreign military force to conduct clandestine operations in the country.

Then convict the entire Pakistani government for the drone ops.

 

[Developereo]

Even that foreign military force is your supposed ally and giving you economic and military assistance as well?

Absolutely 100%.

Ordinary citizens are not privy to the level and types of cooperation agreed to by the officials. A foreign army is a foreign army. Period.

For me, this is not about OBL; it's about the principle of random citizens helping foreign militaries to conduct operations in the country. No country would tolerate this behavior from their citizens.

 

[Secur]

Has it ever been established that the doctor knew about the fact that the result of his activities would be an armed assault by US Marines on Pakistani soil. Otherwise, the services provided by him are not very different to the contractor who drove the fuel truck across Pakistan into Afg, which was used to fuel the choppers that dropped the ST6 members into abbotabad...

The difference being that the driver is allowed by my state to transport the fuel to Afghanistan ... What would happen if any contractor tries to supply NATO now ? Will he be allowed to do so ?

What has been established is that the doctor aided the CIA , regardless of what he knew or what not ...
That is treason by all laws ... The end result or " unintended consequence " is irrelevant !

 

[fd24]

Aiding a foreign military force to conduct clandestine operations in the country.

I must say yet again our Indian members fail to see that its not what the eventuality of his actions as we can all agree the result was the capture of OBL - The crucial issue is he did not divulge the information he had and what he was doing to his first port of call and that should have been the nation he lives in and was brought up.
Living in the UK - If anyone approached me from a foreign agency to carry out an act without the knowledge of the officials of the country i live in then i would accept that i was committing treason. Its really simple. Treason committed in Pakistan, found guilty in a court of law in Pakistan - now serve the sentence.
33 million dollars "aid" being held back? Please keep it. This "aid" is money used to bribe our corrupt politicos - i believe 85 -90% of it goes to line their pockets - so its no skin off our nose.Keep the money boys....

 

[gambit]

Absolutely 100%.

Ordinary citizens are not privy to the level and types of cooperation agreed to by the officials. A foreign army is a foreign army. Period.

All the more reasons to let him go. After all, what he did, he did it out of ignorance, not malice against Pakistan or his fellow citizens.

Looks like the inadvertent double posting problem returned. Looks like the website problems are not resolved. Am out.

 

[Mercenary]

Yeah treason !

It is the duty of the state of Pakistan to chose what information to provide and what to keep from the Americans ...
I am not aware of any agreement allowing the citizens of my country to bypass ISI and directly inform the CIA ...
Neither do i consider acting for cash and Green Card as a noble cause ...
Why didn't the same individual notify the law enforcement agencies of his own country ?
ISI has turned over AQ and Taliban to the US in the past and rewarded civilians for information ...
Why would it have been any different this time ?

What would you call it if an American spots a Chechen terrorist in NY and then instead of calling FBI or police , notified the FSB and then the Russians hunt him down ? What would it be , you double standard hypocrites !

The difference is there is no way to trust Pakistan with Osama bin Laden's location and I don't blame America for not sharing it with Pakistan.

He was found 1km from Pakistan Military Academy in a garrison town.

Either Pakistanis were totally incompetent that they didn't know he was there or there was some low level person involved in hiding him there. And thus if this information got given to Pakistan then it would have gotten leaked to Osama bin Laden.

And thus USA decided to take a unilateral action against him.

 

[Secur]

Then convict the entire Pakistani government for the drone ops.

Are you another one who thinks that the state can commit treason against itself ? See the logical fallacy here !

 

[Developereo]

Then convict the entire Pakistani government for the drone ops.

Those are official agreements (possibly denied) between the governments/militaries.

In this case, we are talking about random civilians taking it upon themselves to help foreign military operations. As I wrote above, no country would tolerate this behavior.

 

[Secur]

The difference is there is no way to trust Pakistan with Osama bin Laden's location and I don't blame America for not sharing it with Pakistan.

Yeah , why the **** did you trust us for 10 years whilst we handed high value targets to US and rewarded our civilians to aid for the capture ? Why would it have been different this time ?

All the more reasons to let him go. After all, what he did, he did it out of ignorance, not malice against Pakistan or his fellow citizens.

Looks like the inadvertent double posting problem returned. Looks like the website problems are not resolved. Am out.

Yeah , what ignorance ? ... Dr Shakil Afridi wasn't suffering from any psychiatric disorder nor was a psychopath ... He knew what he was doing , and he still continued with it because of greed ...
The basic reason that he didn't know what his information was going to lead to , despite aiding a foreign spy agency , makes his case more worse because it would have something really disastrous for the state of Pakistan ! A sensitive information leak perhaps , huh ? The law doesn't give a damn about the " end result " or " unintended consequence " as long you were busy betraying the soil !

 

[OrionHunter]

Who the hell is US to poke nose in our internal matter?

The problem is the US doesn't see it that way. This Dr Shakil Afridi was recruited by the CIA to tail Osama as part of the War on Terror. Pakistan is supposed to be an ally in this war. But is now seen as going against the interests of the US by convicting someone who was instrumental in helping them nab Osama and therefore not an 'internal matter' of Pakistan.