US objects to China-Pakistan nuclear deal

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

@AM
Would you please merge the simillar threads BTW theres already a thread going on regarding not so different issue too

http://www.defence.pk/forums/strategic-geopolitical-issues/55905-pak-get-2-n-reactors-china.html

 

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

I am sorry but i disagree....China hue and cry about selling weapons to Taiwan was a bilateral issue...US was not defaulting on any pact....If China suply of nuclear reactors to Pakistan is violation of NSG as alleged then this is a different ball game...

US will not say anything in public without will to carry it through...Reason is plane simple...Republicans will grill them if they(democrats) end up denting US image in any fashion...and you very well know how much work US had to do to get Japan and Australia on board as far as NSG approval for India is concerned...with US opposing deal is dead...unless CHina says Fukc you i am going ahead(which i doubt....)

Oh please dont let me dig into How the US went way off the track to have a civillian nuclear deal with India courtesy George Bush..

Further i think it will nothing more than a media showdown with some public whining. Bejeing has strategik interests in going ahead with this deal just the way US had with India so nothings stoping China.

 

[DesiGuy]

US is doing for south Asia benefit. Pakistan is going through one of it's worse time and all it could think of is "Nuclear deal" and why?? Just because India got one.

China knew, that US will object and that's why they offered deal to pakistan knowing that it will not pass.

China only thinks about $. But who doesn't.

 

[mehru]

Is there any morality left in American Govt? Not to mention that this will further increase Anti Americanism in our country.On one hand they try to reduce Anti Americanism and on the other hand they will do everything to harm us. Net result ZERO.

PS. Real test is for our friend China. Let's see what they do?

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

US is doing for south Asia benefit. Pakistan is going through one of it's worse time and all it could think of is "Nuclear deal" and why?? Just because India got one.

BS - Pakistan had drawn up plans and proposals to set up 4 unit NPP complexes in Chasma and Karachi (the latter proposed to be 1000 MW units) in the late nineties, before China became part of the NSG, though agreements were only signed on the Chasma plants at the time.

So Pakistan has had plans and a requirement (the current power shortage only validates that point) for NPP's.

China knew, that US will object and that's why they offered deal to pakistan knowing that it will not pass.

China only thinks about $. But who doesn't.

Or China chose to see how far the US would go in its hypocrisy by allowing one non NPT signatory to get an exemption while refusing others.

 

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

US is doing for south Asia benefit. Pakistan is going through one of it's worse time and all it could think of is "Nuclear deal" and why?? Just because India got one.

China knew, that US will object and that's why they offered deal to pakistan knowing that it will not pass.

China only thinks about $. But who doesn't.

First of all its a Bullcrap that US is doing good for SouthAsia secondly Pakistan is facing grave Power problems and US has ocationally stated that it will help in this domain. India is not the reason why Pakistan is acquiring those Nuclear Power Plants.

 

[sulemani keeda]

China is an imminent rival and pakistan is an awful liability for the US. My two cents that the deal could go through successfully.

 

[DesiGuy]

BS - Pakistan had drawn up plans and proposals to set up 4 unit NPP complexes in Chasma and Karachi (the latter proposed to be 1000 MW units) in the late nineties, before China became part of the NSG, though agreements were only signed on the Chasma plants at the time.

So Pakistan has had plans and a requirement (the current power shortage only validates that point) for NPP's.

Or China chose to see how far the US would go in its hypocrisy by allowing one non NPT signatory to get an exemption while refusing others.

They were only plans. Now when India got nuclear deal, Pakistan does not like it at all. Why we never heard news in the past, Pakistan requesting for nuclear deal before India got one.

Reason is simple. Pakistan government was not interested in nuclear deal similar to one India got. If Pakistan really wanted it for itself RATHER than just for show off, than Pakistan should have requested before India.

otherwise it just seems copycat. that Oh, India got one and we also want one.

(Not saying that it's bad, but it just shows your government policies).

 

[deckingraj]

Oh please dont let me dig into How the US went way off the track to have a civillian nuclear deal with India courtesy George Bush..

Further i think it will nothing more than a media showdown with some public whining. Bejeing has strategic interests in going ahead with this deal just the way US had with India so nothings stoping China.

Now you being stubborn here and arguing even though i have not made any such comments....For god sake from post#1 i am saying that if you are worth you will get it...World is hypocritical and when India was not worth she ain't got any....

China may have strategic interest but is her diplomatic influence as big as US??? Yes US had strategic interest otherwise why would they sign a deal with India?? but did they needed a waiver from NSG..YES...Will China need one...YES...Now tell me how will china arm twist US and countries like Japan, Australia who are key US allies??? Moreover how about Russia and other nations????

Let me repeat...If as alleged by US the proposed reactors are contradictory to China's commitment in NSG then she has to get a waiver from NSG which without US blessings is impossible...Do you agree to this much or not???

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

They were only plans. Now when India got nuclear deal, Pakistan does not like it at all. Why we never heard news in the past, Pakistan requesting for nuclear deal before India got one.

Reason is simple. Pakistan government was not interested in nuclear deal similar to one India got. If Pakistan really wanted it for itself RATHER than just for show off, than Pakistan should have requested before India.

otherwise it just seems copycat. that Oh, India got one and we also want one.

(Not saying that it's bad, but it just shows your government policies).

The were plans that Pakistan was actively working on, which is illustrated by the Chasma plants that are being constructed and proposed.

Since it isn't 'bad' I fail to see what it 'shows' about GoP policies.

What it shows is that Pakistan did not believe that it would be able to convince the US to agree to an NSG exemption, especially since the AQ Khan affair came to light at that time.

Some country or the other is always going to be the 'first' to get an exemption or any other issue - since there are only 3 countries that are not NPT signatories, it is rather absurd to argue that just because one country got the deal, the others are copy cats and 'it shows something about their policies'.

 

[Nahraf]

Ya surely they will not object .. obama and its administration made this statement in fully drunk position ????

It is called keeping up appearances ! Wait and see. United States tried sanctions, bribery and cutting all aid to Pakistan but we developed nuclear weapons and tested them. Americans have realized that threats and bribery won't work when Pakistan's interests are at stake. US needs both China and Pakistan more than ever and will not push them too far. They have already comprised and agreed to everything and this is just a public drama. Pakistan already has its nuclear installations that produce fissile material. These reactors are for electricity and would be under IAEC supervision.

 

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

Now you being stubborn here and arguing even though i have not made any such comments....For god sake from post#1 i am saying that if you are worth you will get it...World is hypocritical and when India was not worth she ain't got any....

China may have strategic interest but is her diplomatic influence as big as US??? Yes US had strategic interest otherwise why would they sign a deal with India?? but did they needed a waiver from NSG..YES...Will China need one...YES...Now tell me how will china arm twist US and countries like Japan, Australia who are key US allies??? Moreover how about Russia and other nations????

Let me repeat...If as alleged by US the proposed reactors are contradictory to China's commitment in NSG then she has to get a waiver from NSG which without US blessings is impossible...Do you agree to this much or not???

So you believe Pakistan is not worthy for such a deal

Its not only the Chinese who would influence it but the masses of Pakistan who face the music of Load-shedding(Power Shortages) on Daily basis.
Now if US really wants to Fcukitself here than they will eventually create hurdels in it which i seriously dough..!

This attitude of US though even in getting successful in Blocking the Deal will eventually backfire in its dealings with Pakistan.

I may be wrong but Its simply donot favours US to block this much needed deal by Pakistan.

 

[deckingraj]

This is my last explantion to you because you are not comprehending my post properly and hitting the reply button a bit fast...

So you believe Pakistan is not worthy for such a deal

No i did not say that....Pakistan at present cannot make people change their usual hypocracy because at present she cannot offer something more lucrative in return... Once you would be people will come to you for nuke deals... Don't worry we faced the same behaviour when we were struggling with our economy....

Its not only the Chinese who would influence it but the masses of Pakistan who face the music of Load-shedding(Power Shortages) on Daily basis.

Doesn't make a difference....B/W i hope you know that nuke deals are for future...it is not going to solve current problems anyways....

Now if US really wants to Fcukitself here than they will eventually create hurdels in it which i seriously dough..!This attitude of US though even in getting successful in Blocking the Deal will eventually backfire in its dealings with Pakistan.I may be wrong but Its simply donot favours US to block this much needed deal by Pakistan.

Did any of this stopped you from signing pipeline deal with Iran??? How on this earth you think preception in Pakistan public can stop US from opposing the deal??? I think you have forgotten than GOP approached US first for the same deal and was rebuked.....If they can rebuke you directly may i ask what is stopping them from blocking a deal with China something they have publically announced???

 

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

This is my last explantion to you because you are not comprehending my post properly and hitting the reply button a bit fast...



No i did not say that....Pakistan is not worth for making people change their usual hypocracy because at present she cannot offer something more lucrative in return... Once you would be people will come to you for nuke deals... Don't worry we faced the same behaviour when we were struggling with our economy....



Doesn't make a difference....B/W i hope you know that nuke deals are for future...it is not going to solve current problems anyways....



Did any of this stopped you from signing pipeline deal with Iran??? How on this earth you think preception in Pakistan public can stop US from opposing the deal??? I think you have forgotten than GOP approached US first for the same deal and was rebuked.....If they can rebuke you directly may i ask what is stopping them from blocking a deal with China something they have publically announced???

Yet again the Deal with Iran shows how much grave the Power shortage problem is.During the strategik dialogue US did mentioned to help Pakistan deal with its power shortage problems. Further the Pakistan's cooperation in WOT and the impact of this War onto people of Pakistan cannot be sidelined.In the Afghan matrix and the future engagement of CARs by US Pakistan bears utmost importance for US. It cannot afford to loos Pakistan on that front as they already are planning to withdraw from Afghanistan in the coming years .
Add to this the Chinese strategic and Economic interest in going ahead with this deal.

 

[deckingraj]

Yet again the Deal with Iran shows how much grave the Power shortage problem is.

And i am in agreement with your power shortage problem...I in fact support Pakistani cause for the nuke deal even knowing that there is a mad rush to increase the number of nukes which has a destination printed on them ..guess what - INDIA....

Nuke deal will help in much needed powere generation and is good for job creations and bringing in prosperity...So nothing wrong with it...

During the strategik dialogue US did mentioned to help Pakistan deal with its power shortage problems.

Ans they should...After all Pakistan have bleeded a lot in WOT...

Further the Pakistan's cooperation in WOT and the impact of this War onto people of Pakistan cannot be sidelined.In the Afghan matrix and the future engagement of CARs by US Pakistan bears utmost importance for US. It cannot afford to loos Pakistan on that front as they already are planning to withdraw from Afghanistan in the coming years .

Here you are plane wrong...As said they have snubbed you before when you approached them directly....They have made it public that they will oppose nuke deal b/w China and Pak and yet if you guys want to believe something different then i can't help.....Its ironical than you showed me how much US needs Pakistan howeever fail to see the opposite side where Pakistan need US...So its all give and take and any change on status quo would be based on give and take of equal magnitude...don't you think so???

Add to this the Chinese strategic and Economic interest in going ahead with this deal.

I am sorry that means nothing....China is yet to arrive on a global scenario where she can force other members to side with her.....I know she is gaining muscle but it is limited and at present the deal is pretty much on US mercy as far as NSG waiver is concerned....its an another topic if China portrays it as a bilateral agreement which is not binding to NSG commitments(something that China is persuing knowing very well that US will not allow NSG waiver)...In the end meeting is in a weektime...lets wait and watch