US military strike on Pakistan advocated

[The general]

Umm isnt the US one of Pakistan's biggest allies. And just because some stupid *** holes say crud like this it doesn't mean it will actually happen.

 

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

wel General Musharaff once said in security council speech " IF YOU BREAK THE THRESHHOLD , WE WILL TAKE YOU DOWN WITH us "
America is truely a milletary super power.
just think if the **** estabishment snifs out that US has such types of plans. And the millitary assistance which is Pak providing to the US so that they can survive in Afghanistan suddenly stops. Wat will the US do . man they cant even survive on their own in Afghanistan. they r also stuck in iraq.. do they really want to hunt for **** Nukes ? impossible i guess ..
just see the whole scenario If Iran becomes a nuklear power.. And Pakistan Iran team up leaving US alone in Afghanistan. Can the Us gov then shall have the couraje to think about hunting for **** Nukes.. I guess truely not .. then they shell be focusing how to get out of this reagion un harmed ..
The US will definately not take a risk to go after **** Nukes without any allighance or support. In this case the only nations which will support the US will be Israel and India. No other nation on this earth can support or can take a risk in this regard.
Russia is on the rise .
Thrd world war will happen .
But this time US will not hav enuf lobby or so called asian or muslim allighance. Every Muslim After Iraq war has developed a htred for the US which will not finish till the doomsday.

 

[EagleEyes]

Unfortunately I don’t know why but almost all threads come down to India vs Pakistan. This should not happen if all here are educated and professional people. This thread too is going off topic.

Any way I had put forward a question that what would be possible Pakistani counter plan for US attack on its facilities and are Pakistani defenses capable of withstanding such an attack? I have hardly seen any reply to that.

Please concentrate on the topic.

Hello ejaz. Please report the posts, and moderators will take actions.

Thanks.

 

[aryan2007]

no offence but usa is a bloodthirsty mongrel retarded nation of warmongerers and needs to be nuked wiped off the map for betterment of humanity.it's the MOst, i repeat, MOST antiislamic force in teh world today. closest rivals are israel uk and india. and i bleieve ALL 4 of them need to be wiped off the map before muslims can regain their place in this wrold.

i feel pakistan is just PAYING BACK for its mistakes in its early years - that of aligning with usa instead of being nonpartisan. it's just an 'anglo' thing really they've to betray and stab in the back anybody that trusts them - look at iraq or afghanistan both were formerly armed by usa, and now they're getting bombed by it!

i feel we muslims should develop our own selves in educaiton weaponry science tech etc first. and for mean time, keep our options open

so if usa threatens we tiny muslim countries like pk or bd can shift to china or russia. if we threaten this move, then all 'anglos' will be lined up.
in short that's my view. sorry for typos

Dear Sir or as Roadrunner believes Morphine? (Hash would have been better) induced posts.. I wish to counter your arguments.. the most anti-Muslim country may be USA but the most anti-Islamic force today is the Muslims themselves..

Islam being a religion of peace and of submission does not mean you will wipe off any country or people from the face of this earth.. This blasphemy and anti-Islamic..Sir I wish you to not disgrace the religion of a billion plus community which I infer you do not know much about or follow incorrectly(don't mind the stern words..)

Read the Quran with a nice transliteration or translation and revel in joy..


You are sending just like America.. they believe you guys should be nuked and you believe they... I don't know what to call both of you.. Kaffir or Believers??

 

[PakSniper]

Dear Sir or as Roadrunner believes Morphine? (Hash would have been better) induced posts.. I wish to counter your arguments.. the most anti-Muslim country may be USA but the most anti-Islamic force today is the Muslims themselves..

Islam being a religion of peace and of submission does not mean you will wipe off any country or people from the face of this earth.. This blasphemy and anti-Islamic..Sir I wish you to not disgrace the religion of a billion plus community which I infer you do not know much about or follow incorrectly(don't mind the stern words..)

Read the Quran with a nice transliteration or translation and revel in joy..


You are sending just like America.. they believe you guys should be nuked and you believe they... I don't know what to call both of you.. Kaffir or Believers??

Let's not involve religion because I believe you also don't know jack about it, rather than talking empty words repeated over air-waves, and your mind just happens to receive that same rethroic, and I suggest you also read the Quran very carefully if you choose to, to understand the state of "war".

Islam is a religion of peace, but, as usual you can't expect a Muslim to just sit around and be invaded or targeted, and not expect it to respond to a threat. Islam teaches warfare to protects oneself, family, and nation "ummah". And to respond to threats before they happen, even if that means killing (which usually happens in warfare) on a mass scale if your survival is at stake (pick up the hadith book by Imam Bukhari which talks about rules of engagement & sit with a scholor to understand its meaning, cause their are more levels to hadiths that just reading them, cause they are different meanings and how to interpret them, it's not as simple to understand as your mind thinks), pick it up and learn and revel in it's joy before lecturing to others.

EX: U.S. nuked Japan, but if you read the history from retired Generals, they themselves have said "including in declassified reports", they would have started to target other cities with 3 nukes each month, if warfare doesn't stop, don't you think Japan would have the right to respond in the same manner against U.S. if their survival is at stake.

Lo, don't talk to others as if they have no complete knowledge cause just knowing the basics which you might or might not even know wouldn't get you very far, with "Religion of peace" talk, which I hear so often about, from non-Islamic followers which makes me "cry", cause they don't know whats writtn before and after "the Religion of peace comments".

Lo, you have no clue what is blasphemy and anti-Islamic, follow the religion as a believer read all the Sunnas & hadiths to understand Islam better, before giving a lecutre of empty words.

And know, Islam says use what ever means possible to defend your self, in a "Jihad" which should be fought to the fullest, and with heart.

** More so, read about Islams early battles against different clans and see how they were dealt with, those that posed a direct threat to Islam, most of them you wouldn't even hear today, as I said before, "If survival is at stake use all means to defend yourself".

I don't expect to give this same lecture to every Indian I come across, cause it's getting really pathetic.

 

[aryan2007]

Let's not involve religion because I believe you also don't know jack about it, rather than talking empty words repeated over air-waves, and your mind just happens to receive that same rethroic, and I suggest you also read the Quran very carefully if you choose to, to understand the state of "war".

Dear Sir, like you I do not claim to be an authoritative scholar of Religion but neither I think am I a fanatic or an ignorant person willing to believe everything at face value..

from my studies and research.. primarily from a Sufi viewpoint.. Islam is a religion of peace and advocates fighting evil & tyranny whether internal or external... just like Sikhism, Hinduism etc..

Islam is a religion of peace, but, as usual you can't expect a Muslim to just sit around and be invaded or targeted, and not expect it to respond to a threat.

I fully understand Sir what you are saying.. if you are invaded/attacked unjustly many non Muslims will not only support you but fight for you as well..
just like, Muslims fought for the cause of Sikhs and Hindu Rajputs against the Mughals...

But at the moment a deep introspection is required amongst the Muslims.
Terrorism, suicide bombings, intolerance, fanaticism is on the rise, and so is their support..

Certain countries are very pro-active in this regard and just like what Muslims feel -> that they cannot be expected to not respond to a threat, they are doing same as you..

A non Muslim country declares war on terrorism and is backed by many if not all Muslim nations to take out terrorists..

And now the terrorists and inevitably innocents are dying are Muslims after all, this tantamounts to a trigger reaction in Muslims that they are under threat hence they now want to counter-attack albeit without ostensible or otherwise official/govt support..

this cycle is going off the charts.. throw in some hate mongers and simple gullible folks and there is a recipe for disaster..

I think what Israel is doing is nothing different from what certain Muslim organizations are doing.. while one is official the other is covert.. both are in my eyes dishonourable.. though the one with suicide bombings in the name of religion is more so.. This is a political struggle coupled with a communal demography..

Further USA's war on Iraq has been condemned by all, and it was purely economic and strategic in my opinion .. though they rid it of a very tyrannical regime .. yet even in Iraq Muslims are involved in a civil war.. and killing themselves instead of rebuilding the nation.. and I have yet to seen the "famed" Muslim "Ummah" uniting behind Iraq to help quell unrest and rebuild it..

In Pakistan/Afghanistan again US invaded it, somewhat justifiably in response to, similar as what you are advocating, to take out the terrorists who attacked US soil.. there again one sees Muslims involved in a civil war amongst themselves... there again most suicide bombers are targetting fellow Muslims..

Further Sir, I do not understand how can you support a person advocating nuking 3 countries with a combined population of over 1.3bn people out of which almost 200mn are Muslims...

These countries are fighting terrorists and terrorists are without a religion.. All those involved in killing innocents by blowing themselves up or by ramming planes into buildings are terrorists and if you think they are fighting for a just cause or you support them then matters are different...

If a particular group carries out attacks in a country then all their co-group members are often blacklisted.. there are just 2 ways.. sink into the abyss by continuing to do the same.. or reform oneselves and the community and work to rebuild one's reputation and prestige

Islam teaches warfare to protects oneself, family, and nation "ummah". And to respond to threats before they happen, even if that means killing (which usually happens in warfare) on a mass scale if your survival is at stake

Dear Sir, Over the past few decades it is the muslims who are killing themselves on a genocidal level and most suicide bombs also kill Muslims.

and countries like USA and Israel are doing no different than what you are advocating... though I would love to see the Quranic verse which says this..

(pick up the hadith book by Imam Bukhari which talks about rules of engagement & sit with a scholor to understand its meaning, cause their are more levels to hadiths that just reading them, cause they are different meanings and how to interpret them, it's not as simple to understand as your mind thinks), pick it up and learn and revel in it's joy before lecturing to others.

On the contrary I did post the rules of engagement in one of my posts...

And thanks for pointing out a point which I continue to highlight do not restirct yourself to transliterations and translations but try to understand the symbolic/hidden/esoteric meaning..

I don't need to sit with a scholar who has to be a Muslim by appearance or by name.. there are many scholars not of my religion whose commentaries I read on my religion and vice versa..

Anyways sir my leanings are not towards what are the mythological aspects of Islam.. but more over the theological aspects and the Sufi practises..

and yes Please could you give me an online source of the hadiths that you mention and indeed I would revel in joy of learning of a great religion being brought to shame by a few miscreants who should be skinned alive..

EX: U.S. nuked Japan, but if you read the history from retired Generals, they themselves have said "including in declassified reports", they would have started to target other cities with 3 nukes each month, if warfare doesn't stop, don't you think Japan would have the right to respond in the same manner against U.S. if their survival is at stake.

Of course.. but is the Islamic world at present being attacked by US, Israel or India??? if yes, then aren't many of the Muslim nations their premier allies with them...

Lo, don't talk to others as if they have no complete knowledge

dear sir, complete knowledge??
do you mean me able to recite Quran in Arabic without understanding its meaning.. or me being taught Whabi or Sunni or Shia way of Islam.. so that I am already biased??
I think if I would have complete grasp of what the Quran has to say then I think I would have been blessed...

cause just knowing the basics which you might or might not even know wouldn't get you very far, with "Religion of peace" talk, which I hear so often about, from non-Islamic followers which makes me "cry", cause they don't know whats writtn before and after "the Religion of peace comments".

I think simplicity is better than going deep into details unnecassary in helping one become a true muslim rather than a conservative or fanatical or scholarly Muslim..

Lo, you have no clue what is blasphemy and anti-Islamic, follow the religion as a believer read all the Sunnas & hadiths to understand Islam better, before giving a lecutre of empty words.

dear sir, me being a non-muslim "lecturing" to a muslim who advocates annhiliating 1.3bn people for fighting against terrorism, by quoting his religion is wrong in your eyes?
I understand that me being a non-muslim will always result in me being rebuked for my faith even at the cost of supporting a person who advocates annhilating 20-25% of mankind.. incl. 10-20% of all muslims in the world..
and which will result in a counter-attack which will wipe out rest of Islam.. which is against what Islam teaches... whether in peace or warfare..

Sir, I am sorry I see this more of a hate thing than one where I am wrong about Islam..


I don't need to learn about Islam.. it is rather the newly joined member whom you should be lecturing... and as for me I believe I have sufficient knowledge to know that Islam doesnot promote violence at a level which you say..
It teaches you to fight tyranny and evil and all that who threaten believers...
much the same way what Hindu texts and Sikhism teaches.. when all methods of peaceful reconcillation have been exhausted a tyrrant must be fought with violence..

And know, Islam says use what ever means possible to defend your self, in a "Jihad" which should be fought to the fullest, and with heart.

Jihad are of 2 types.. the most important one is the internal one.. the other is the external one.. to be invocated in times of dire needs.. I don't see any country threatning Islam? esp if it has almost all muslim Nations behind it..

** More so, read about Islams early battles against different clans and see how they were dealt with, those that posed a direct threat to Islam, most of them you wouldn't even hear today, as I said before, "If survival is at stake use all means to defend yourself".

Of course.. But you are missing the point sir..
how can you justify annhilating 1.3bn people fighting against tyrants and evil.?
what makes you angry that tyrant happens to be Muslim by birt? or that a non muslim is asking a muslim to get his facts right about his religion??

I don't expect to give this same lecture to every Indian I come across, cause it's getting really pathetic.

Sir I think you are not doing disservice to your faith or country etc.. by lecturing Indians, in other words your mortal enemies and at times kaffirs, on the violence propounded by Islam.. which justifies annihilating 1.3bn people who kill tyrants and terrorists who incidentally were born as Muslims..

thank you...

 

[Proud to be Pakistani]

Chances of Pakistan against US strike for Nuclear Weapons Confescation are slim.

Consider If US is allowed to muster up all its streght in Arabian Sea all Pakistan will be Sitting Duck, In order to make a Fight out of this Navy needs to Engage US fleet in open water and strike them before they do, Coastal Defence of Pakistan in wake of Sea Attack are very poor and Pakistan Needs to take out all the Battle groups in open water with Cruise missiles... and PN ships and Subs, not allow US to initiate offense but insteed make them defend. Once the matter becomes Air Conflict with US using AWACS and AEW&C, their is slim chance for our PAF to overcome such a threat.

The status of Babur series production is not known to the world, we need more fighters to be inducted in Maritime defence for future preparation if some conflict is un-aviodable.

All in all in Such a strike scenario Pakistan needs to be not patient but take the war to the enemy and strike first, not leting him muster up all his strenght and wait for their attack, get to them before they launch an offensive is the best chance Pakistan will have.

 

[IceCold]

There isnt much of a real threat for US to strike pakistan, the main reason is US is fine as long as a moderate government is in place. They do not want pakistan to turn out to be iran. The next government will be a modest one, the reason is mullahs are already on the brink of internal conflicts besides one has seen that except of fanatisim and extremism they can provide nothing to the nation, most recently the example of SWAT where one cannot even imagine, fazalullah stood up out of nowhere while MMA was the ruling party there. A government in pakistan i believe will be a collation one with parties like PML(Q) PML(N) and PPP under musharraf. Since i highly doubt any of the parties will get a two third majority so none can actually dictate and hence president will be the rulling party which in my opinion is something good as check & balance will be maintained. So in an event like this US would not sabatoge by attacking pakistan rather it will continue its support to the moderate elements in pakistan. However as a pakistani i do believe that we should prepare our selves for a future conflict with the US. The reason is US is backing elements like BB which in no way are infavour of the country and if shes kicked out, chances might be that US would decide to attack pakistan's nuclear installations. We cannot counter it with conventional capabilities, to alone counter the B-52 is a challenge which can fly all the way from US and bomb pakistan and we wouldnt even know until we get strucked and it doesnt need US carrier group anywhere near pakistani coast. The only way we can counter is if we go ICBM. This would for sure keep US in place. It will provide us the kind of detterent we are using against india, which is we might go nuclear if attacked. The fear is all what we need to create in the hearts of the americans, once created we will not be attacked not like this thats for sure.

 

[alibaz]

I think US doesn't need to attack pkistan once our own leader are trying to show more loyality by giving different statements that how would they proceed if they come into power.

 

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

To go ICBM is a good option. IT WILL DEFINATELY BE A DETERANCE AGAINST ALL THE HOSTILE US PLANS..

 

[Skywalker]

I think US doesn't need to attack pkistan once our own leader are trying to show more loyality by giving different statements that how would they proceed if they come into power.

It would be a sin for me not to agree on you this, our politcians especially bb can do anything to gain power thats why her p*** Mr. Zaradari is already in usa for discussion. God save us from this ***** and her companions.

 

[IceCold]

God save us from this ***** and her companions.

God has given us brain for one reason and one reason only that is to think, vote to the right person, because it is only our vote that can kick these b******* out to where they actually belong. Long live Pakistan

 

[bd_wonder]

my question to not only a. rahman but other forumers, does this sound offensive?

lay off the bangali weed man

you only have to tune in to bbc cnn or other english media to see how pakistan is portrayed. do i need to start a few punjabi jokes about indian punjabis (sardars and so on)? i dont think that's an amicable solution. i need friendly amicable solutions.

 

[aryan2007]

do i need to start a few punjabi jokes about indian punjabis (sardars and so on)?

I don't mind.. I am a Sikh.. go to the jokes forum...

 

[firefight]

I knew when the war on terror nonsense started there was a sinister plot behind it and
now it is starting to reveal itself.