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US concerned about human rights situation in Azad Kashmir

Should India raise the Pak occupied Kashmir and Balochistan issue with UN and other bodies?

  • Yes

    Votes: 36 64.3%
  • No

    Votes: 20 35.7%

  • Total voters
    56
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Well shall we keep this discussion decent by nit bringing each others religion? , he may had been the prime minister of the chandargupt morya but he was born at taxila as per bhuddist text so most prolly he was a Buddhist , there's no reason for a guy ho was born in south India to come that far to an alien land to give some lectures
So buddhist texts are right and jain texts are wrong. By the way he travelled whole of India in search for eligible ruler. Taxila had students from as far as mesopotamia. So why not the teachers.
Edit: There's no such thing like ancient india
Yes for Pakistani egos it doesnt. For rest of the world it does. Just like

Pakistan is located in Indian subcontinent
There is an Indian ocean
Pakistan lies next to India not the other way around.

Stop giving too much importance to yourself.
 
Usa is munafik govt I don't trust
:rofl:

So buddhist texts are right and jain texts are wrong. By the way he travelled whole of India in search for eligible ruler. Taxila had students from as far as mesopotamia. So why not the teachers.

Yes for Pakistani egos it doesnt. For rest of the world it does. Just like

Pakistan is located in Indian subcontinent
There is an Indian ocean
Pakistan lies next to India not the other way around.

Stop giving too much importance to yourself.
Here take a look at----
https://defence.pk/posts/8610145/
 
India considers Kashmir as an internal affair....you poke ur finger in ours,we will highlight the ones in yours be it Kashmir or Balochistan
As simple as that
Yet, half of Kashmir is Pakistani, so claims of "internal affairs" when it comes to Kashmir are stupid. If India kept its nose towards Azad Kashmir, instead of talking about Baluchistan, its stance would have been far more reasonable. As it is, Modi looks like he's going for brownie points.

Baluchistan is not disputed, Kashmir is, simple as that; Comparing the two is intellectual dishonesty.
 
English people call their country great Britain...calling it great doesn't makes it great....naming it Azad won't make it Azad.

It's a disputed region also.


Rest of the world?
China ? Turkey ? North Korea lol


India considers Kashmir as an internal affair....you poke ur finger in ours,we will highlight the ones in yours be it Kashmir or Balochistan
As simple as that
Yes it does because we are the one,s who liberated it from Dogra raj
 
Half of Kashmiri is Pakistani and half of it is Indian
We never interfered in Pak held K but Pakistan doesn't seems to be interested in status quo ...and if status quo is not in the table we certainly can drag Balochistan along with Kashmir
Pak should understand what is India's diplomatic prowess and behave accordingly .
India is just testing waters and ball is in Pakistans court
Ridiculous.

Not only are you no longer denying what I've said, now you're trying to make it about "influence". India overestimates itself, and underestimates Pakistan. India is the only country that benefits from the status quo, while Pakistan suffers from it, that is why the status quo is just a problem for Pakistan.
 
Fair enough, and I stand half corrected. Though I do have to mention that a part of my point WAS correct; the highlighted part talks about Baluchistan, the non highlighted part talks about Kashmir. If it was all about Kashmir, Toner would not have specifically separated the two with an "And with respect to Kashmir".

As it is, Indian media connected the non-Kashmir part with Azad Kashmir, which (in my opinion) is far more dishonest than Pakistani media simply ignoring it.

It's not about your being right or wrong!

I posted the statements to show the ambiguity, which can be read anyway, depending on how one wants to read it.

Sequentially and logically if the statement is taken as an answer to a question, the Kashmir issue has been clearly addressed, the highlighted part has been after invocation of Kashmir, the opening of Pandora's box finished the Baluchistan angle in initial part of the statement

The stress on policy on Kashmir being clear can be taken as a clarification on the policy of recognising the issue as being a bilateral one which needs to be settled by both the nations. I am again posting it to highlight how the statement, if taken sequentially, depicts applicability to Kashmir and not Baluchistan.


QUESTION: Washington Post also said that nobody knew before Prime Minister Modi spoke about this what’s happening in the Kashmir in Pakistan. So have you --

MR TONER: Nobody knew – I’m sorry – about what was happening with --

QUESTION: In the occupied Kashmir in Pakistan. Because everybody been talking about only Kashmir in India, but nobody has ever spoken about Kashmir in Pakistan --

MR TONER: Well, I think we --

QUESTION: -- because that’s what I’ve been saying for many, many years.

MR TONER: Sure. Well, I would respectfully beg to differ. We do have concerns about the human rights situation there, have reported it for several years in our Human Rights Report, and we’ve obviously – are always urging all parties in Pakistan to work out their differences peaceably and through a valid political process. And with respect to Kashmir, our policy there is well known.

Source: https://defence.pk/threads/us-conce...-occupied-kashmir.445837/page-4#ixzz4IIyULz4a

In my view, it is a typical diplomatic answer wherein the official side stepped a question for which he apparently did not have a clear answer.

Mark Toner is trolling if this is what you're trying to say? But anyway he mentions Kashmir in the end seperately and says their policies are clear about it.

Was this directed at me, Lady?

If so, allow me to answer you. If the statement is read sequentially, you will find that the statement seems to be in direct response to Kashmir, Baluchistan having only been touched in the initial part. I posted it to highlight the ambiguity, something which can lead to the difference of perception as we can see.

However, logically and sequentially, the issue seems to have been addressed and the emphasis on Kashmir policy can be to highlight the official position of US that the issue is bilateral one and both the nations need to settle it by dialogue.

As for India on Pakistani Kashmir, sometimes when no one shows care about fake propaganda, the cat starts scratching the floor, pooping on mattresses, vomiting fur balls. Same thing going on!

P.S. Our CJCSC is in Russia.

Propaganda is both ways now. Till now it was one way - we kept quiet. Now it is being used in reverse. But does that achieve anything?

And does your CJCSC going to Russia achieve anything?
 
OK I heard you. And no the earlier post was not directed at you. About the propaganda, we have actually been watching what has been going.
The 'trying' to reverse the proganda isn't seem to be working because the ground realities are totally different.

I am not happy with the fact that your forces have been involved in deliberate rape attempts. The other day I saw you defending all this by saying these are counter-insurgency tactics, I don't see eye to eye with you on this. You address people's concern, give them space, let them see the world and their minds may change.
Was this directed at me, Lady?

If so, allow me to answer you. If the statement is read sequentially, you will find that the statement seems to be in direct response to Kashmir, Baluchistan having only been touched in the initial part. I posted it to highlight the ambiguity, something which can lead to the difference of perception as we can see.

However, logically and sequentially, the issue seems to have been addressed and the emphasis on Kashmir policy can be to highlight the official position of US that the issue is bilateral one and both the nations need to settle it by dialogue.



Propaganda is both ways now. Till now it was one way - we kept quiet. Now it is being used in reverse. But does that achieve anything?

And does your CJCSC going to Russia achieve anything?
Let's see... What he can achieve
 
Soon we will see blue helmets landing in Pakistani held Kashmir and Balochistan, giving these two regions freedom and autonomy as desired by their people.
I wish you the hardest of luck for each and every thought like that.
 
OK I heard you. And no the earlier post was not directed at you. About the propaganda, we have actually been watching what has been going.

Thanks for clarifying.

The 'trying' to reverse the proganda isn't seem to be working because the ground realities are totally different.

Oh the mere fact that people have begun discussing it, howsoever absurd it may be, indicates otherwise. Take the number of threads on it. See the video of Imran Khan berating force and government apathy and violence in Baluchistan and FATA-Waziristan. How do you think that the figure of 700,000 soldiers is there? On internet, if you repeat it a number of times, it is quoted equal number of times. That is how propaganda is achieved.

I have clearly laid out the number of troops a number of times. But they are ignored. It is a two way street lady.

I am not happy with the fact that your forces have been involved in deliberate rape attempts.

I repeat, this is another example of propaganda. Think rationally and logically, step back and really think it out, putting yourself as a commander of troops in kashmir valley who has been tasked to ensure that militants do not gain upper hand and to maintain safety and security of all concerned while limiting the collateral damage.

What, as a commander, will you achieve by ordering your troops to rape? Will it not antagonise the people further and create more problems thereby nullifying your military objectives? Will it enable achieving the military tasks or further aggravate it?

Seriously, give this a thought.


The other day I saw you defending all this by saying these are counter-insurgency tactics, I don't see eye to eye with you on this. You address people's concern, give them space, let them see the world and their minds may change.

Let's see... What he can achieve

Incorrect. I was opposing posting of rape as being defined as a deliberate policy decision on a mere paper which was full of inaccuracies and complete bias and thereby trying to brand a professional army of both sides as 'rapist'.

If my aim was to sit here and spew venom and foster hatred, I would not be here in the first place. I had enough experience of that in far reaches of Kashmir itself.

I assure you, neither do I condone rapes, you did not read my post on post ratings where I have categorically called the as B4stards who are bereft of religion and nationality and deserve no sympathy and only due judicial process to punish them, nor is India using it as a policy as it is counter productive.

And my analogy to Counter Insurgency operations? It was to highlight the use of rape or threat thereof by the militants to get shelter and food and access to women ....

That is a fact. Had the author delved into these aspects, perhaps I would have respected the work and defended IA as the approach required in different light.

I refuse to listen to drivel from anyone who has not been on ground in Kashmir and roamed in the streets. The women and children are the greatest losers in any conflict. I did post a narrative on the role of women in Kashmir militancy and highlighted the fact that many women went pro only because of loss of near and dear ones.

The cycle of violence has to stop, for that Pakistan has to back off, and allow peace and development in valley.

Have you ever wondered why militancy erupted in 1989 and not in 1950?

Maybe if you looked into your own country's actions, you may , and may just get an answer which is logical and not mere rant.

You have a good day, I see your posts increasingly becoming personalised and full of animosity. I urge you to look at things by placing yourself in others boots and trying to see what would you do .... when you shout rape as a policy ... please tell me how as a commander will you justify that policy as being in consonance with your military objectives!

I wish you the hardest of luck for each and every thought like that.

Why @war&peace ? Put a few FCs with Blue Helmets .. that shall take care of that .....:cheers:
 
Until now I have not showed any animosity towards you. I don't know how you detect animosity. My behavior with you is rather lenient and I like to tell you Pakistan will only back off when the so called politicos get this thing to table and chalk out a solution.
As for the role of my army in past and in present day, I know very well, it is much different now. Much of the policies have been reversed, India as a country and people is not hated at all.
As for what you're saying I would really like to come someday to Kashmir and know for myself. May be as a researcher. I know how tough these hardliners can get when it comes to handling them, now I know. But I think only a fact-finding mission can tell the true story.
We don't need the land, we are not after the land. We are after settling of this issue and then everybody lives in peace.

Thanks for clarifying.



Oh the mere fact that people have begun discussing it, howsoever absurd it may be, indicates otherwise. Take the number of threads on it. See the video of Imran Khan berating force and government apathy and violence in Baluchistan and FATA-Waziristan. How do you think that the figure of 700,000 soldiers is there? On internet, if you repeat it a number of times, it is quoted equal number of times. That is how propaganda is achieved.

I have clearly laid out the number of troops a number of times. But they are ignored. It is a two way street lady.



I repeat, this is another example of propaganda. Think rationally and logically, step back and really think it out, putting yourself as a commander of troops in kashmir valley who has been tasked to ensure that militants do not gain upper hand and to maintain safety and security of all concerned while limiting the collateral damage.

What, as a commander, will you achieve by ordering your troops to rape? Will it not antagonise the people further and create more problems thereby nullifying your military objectives? Will it enable achieving the military tasks or further aggravate it?

Seriously, give this a thought.




Incorrect. I was opposing posting of rape as being defined as a deliberate policy decision on a mere paper which was full of inaccuracies and complete bias and thereby trying to brand a professional army of both sides as 'rapist'.

If my aim was to sit here and spew venom and foster hatred, I would not be here in the first place. I had enough experience of that in far reaches of Kashmir itself.

I assure you, neither do I condone rapes, you did not read my post on post ratings where I have categorically called the as B4stards who are bereft of religion and nationality and deserve no sympathy and only due judicial process to punish them, nor is India using it as a policy as it is counter productive.

And my analogy to Counter Insurgency operations? It was to highlight the use of rape or threat thereof by the militants to get shelter and food and access to women ....

That is a fact. Had the author delved into these aspects, perhaps I would have respected the work and defended IA as the approach required in different light.

I refuse to listen to drivel from anyone who has not been on ground in Kashmir and roamed in the streets. The women and children are the greatest losers in any conflict. I did post a narrative on the role of women in Kashmir militancy and highlighted the fact that many women went pro only because of loss of near and dear ones.

The cycle of violence has to stop, for that Pakistan has to back off, and allow peace and development in valley.

Have you ever wondered why militancy erupted in 1989 and not in 1950?

Maybe if you looked into your own country's actions, you may , and may just get an answer which is logical and not mere rant.

You have a good day, I see your posts increasingly becoming personalised and full of animosity. I urge you to look at things by placing yourself in others boots and trying to see what would you do .... when you shout rape as a policy ... please tell me how as a commander will you justify that policy as being in consonance with your military objectives!



Why @war&peace ? Put a few FCs with Blue Helmets .. that shall take care of that .....:cheers:
 
I voted yes as well :)

To all the Indian Members, please share any international media article where they say that Pakistani State is committing any atrocities in Pakistani Kashmir
 
I vote yes but still believe that we don't need any help from US or UN in this matter.
As for as P O K concern India is much capable to handle this own.
You can't even handle IOK you stupid retards.
 
You can't even handle IOK you stupid retards.
First handle ur Baluchistan keyboard warrior...
xyzdpf1si9G2yxDOT--eNd0F7tJjQG6Je-vdrh2AxGrq53vrdOzpqtsHvxv85hgmGcnosrv6lhgVmihgYTivipwulWNYc19WwWvCQDTE4pg7xKknWyzU1A1yIH9SmH1wkIA23x6dENedttO8QDUhGYEFPmbz1HpXE87JF33MQIomjg18pOeHZ7OFgnb-mLlEc3TcSDLykOG7J78xzHA=w511-h288-nc

:enjoy:
 
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