US backs India-Iran Chabahar port deal as it outflanks China-Pakistan Gwadar project

[indiatester]

Chabahar has less depth than Gwadar I think...

It can take a 250000 ton vessel. Thats more than 100000 capacity at Bandar Abbas for Iran. Good for Iran right?

 

[Kaniska]

An Indian news site. Nothing more to say.

It may sound rude..but fact is Gwadar and Chabahar is not comparable to each other...Chahbahar is used primarily by India where as Gwadar has a scope to go global one...

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

that's why you didn't allowed them to trade with INDIA and didn't allow them to take material from INDIA.. Check your conditions.

we allow Afghan trucks to send good to india just not vice versa. That isn't "Black mail" dummy, that's just common sense. Nobody said you cant fly your material from india to A-stan, that's your own prerogative

That's why you made a video with many edits in it, just bring some good editor next time.

dodging the issue like most baniyas do.....fact is - your ex navy officer (who admitted to specializing in naval warfare ops and confessed to terrorist activity / backing it) is now languishing in jail and in a very bad situation in life. His network of informants/militants crumbling like house of cards.

indians like you claim he was a "businessmen" just innocently hiding behind a Muslim name - while the indian govt. itself has admitted he's a navy officer and hence desperately trying to get consular access to him (right, good luck with that)

lol, not we just made sure that INDIAN good reach afgan while PAK cant stop it now.

Pakistan never stopped hindustan from trading with Afghanistan we just denied the indians the right to use our roads. Whatever alternate course you take is your own problem to deal with not ours as long as it's not within our territorial or maritime boundaries .

 

[Dalit]

Yet, these Americans and their newly wed Indians are having sleepless nights about Chinese presence at Gwadar. Not a day goes by without American/Indian nagging. We frankly don't care about Chabahar because it is irrelivant in the context of Pakistan. Whether it succeeds or fails does in no way affect Pakistan.

We care a great deal about Gwadar because this project will directly benefit the Pakistani economy for generations to come. Gwadar has a lot of potential and the Chinese aren't crazy to spend billions with no return of investment.

 

[Alpha Fighter]

Yet, these Americans and their newly wed Indians are having sleepless nights about Chinese presence at Gwadar. Not a day goes by without American/Indian nagging. We frankly don't care about Chabahar because it is irrelivant in the context of Pakistan. Whether it succeeds or fails does in no way affect Pakistan.

We care a great deal about Gwadar because this project will directly benefit the Pakistani economy for generations to come. Gwadar has a lot of potential and the Chinese aren't crazy to spend billions with no return of investment.

A) well is the Pakistani worker making those roads? NO
B) is Any material / Equipment they are buying from PAK for making this ? NO

China is spending for own Economy and till it not get completed PAK will get no benefit of it, at least eco.

we allow Afghan trucks to send good to india just not vice versa. That isn't "Black mail" dummy, that's just common sense. Nobody said you cant fly your material from india to A-stan, that's your own prerogative

Pakistan never stopped hindustan from trading with Afghanistan we just denied the indians the right to use our roads. Whatever alternate course you take is your own problem to deal with not ours as long as it's not within our territorial or maritime boundaries .

That is what blackmail. you only allowed Afgan trucks to India when Afgan allowed your trucks to come into their land. That's why India made alter route, So now no permission need from you.

Last time you blocked Air lift of Wheat/ biscuit from Air also.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

That is what blackmail. you only allowed Afgan trucks to India when Afgan allowed your trucks to come into their land. That's why India made alter route, So now no permission need from you.

Last time you blocked Air lift of Wheat/ biscuit from Air also.

it's not blackmail it's just a good deal for Pakistan

you're acting as if Pakistan has historically had some stranglehold over Afghanistan whereas countries like Iran have always had trade links with the former since time immemorial....the trade links are historical but your memory or attention span maybe not so good

 

[indiatester]

it's not blackmail it's just a good deal for Pakistan

you're acting as if Pakistan has historically had some stranglehold over Afghanistan whereas countries like Iran have always had trade links with the former since time immemorial....the trade links are historical but your memory or attention span maybe not so good

That is exactly the reason why India has to take the alternate route. When you there are historical trade links, you don't block them just because its a good deal.
Now that you are taking care of your good deal, let us take care of the bad deal that we got. I would have loved to use the existing routes going via Pakistan. But if my money depends on your whims and fancies, I'd be a fool not to make proper alternate arrangements.
So this is India just taking care of its money.

 

[Salik]

The general idea is that after some time, more and more Chinese warships will make goodwill visits to Gwadar, and to Karachi, thus sanitising them against seaborne attacks. Also giving China effectively a two-navy presence. There is a long time from now to 2050, so it is to be expected that Chinese hegemonism and bullying of everybody in the neighbourhood will continue for at least two or three decades more, before their intolerable ecological damage and their decline in growth combine to slow them down. There is worse to come.

I love the worse part. Can we fast forward

Jokes apart, with due respect sir because you are senior in age and experience

China has hegemony or not, someone's hegemony is at stake for sure. Lets find out who is he.

China had full fledged war last time in 1962. But America have had 15 wars in last fifty years. You can see who has hegemonic tendencies.

Current scenario is not very very serious. China and India can sign peace deal. Asians will be Asians. But it will be dead end for US here. As a reaction US may not hesitate to impose hell on Asia.

If we look today Asia can take up Europe and America economically and militarilly. Now the real competition will be among continents rather than countries.

 

[Joe Shearer]

I love the worse part. Can we fast forward

Jokes apart, with due respect sir because you are senior in age and experience

China has hegemony or not, someone's hegemony is at stake for sure. Lets find out who is he.

China had full fledged war last time in 1962. But America have had 15 wars in last fifty years. You can see who has hegemonic tendencies.

Current scenario is not very very serious. China and India can sign peace deal. Asians will be Asians. But it will be dead end for US here. As a reaction US may not hesitate to impose hell on Asia.

If we look today Asia can take up Europe and America economically and militarilly. Now the real competition will be among continents rather than countries.

I'm a pessimist.

I see China continuing to give the whole of Asia a bad time for another forty years, before succumbing to its internal corruption.

 

[SrNair]

I love the worse part. Can we fast forward

Jokes apart, with due respect sir because you are senior in age and experience

China has hegemony or not, someone's hegemony is at stake for sure. Lets find out who is he.

China had full fledged war last time in 1962. But America have had 15 wars in last fifty years. You can see who has hegemonic tendencies.

Current scenario is not very very serious. China and India can sign peace deal. Asians will be Asians. But it will be dead end for US here. As a reaction US may not hesitate to impose hell on Asia.

If we look today Asia can take up Europe and America economically and militarilly. Now the real competition will be among continents rather than countries.

US was now here in this part of Asia when we got the independence .They offered us top seats during Nehru's time .Nehru was a visionary and he could sense the dangerous motives of US .So he rejected all those perks and attempted for a brotherly relation with China .
And Chinese response was totally in opposite direction .They gravely misjudged our inherent socialist base .
They couldnt understand that one nation can remain as a democracy and socialist .
In the name of a poor Buddhist monk ,they invaded in to our land (,something that both nations could have been solve through an amicable negotiations .).
Then US began to make their moves through various ways .

I'm a pessimist.

I see China continuing to give the whole of Asia a bad time for another forty years, before succumbing to its internal corruption.

Chinese still needs to learn a lots of lesson from US .Even though Mexico itch them here and there , they will maintain a total maturity when it comes to their border .
Chinese way is very funny ,single handedly united small and large countries against them in their immediate neighbourhood.

 

[Sipahi]

we dont have any issues with who controls who or what in afghanistan we made a deal with afghan government and its there problem to give the route required security as for taliban why will they create problems for there own people in getting rich and getting new source of income just because india is building it and its coming thru iran ?


your so so wrong brother Chahbahar is not in any way against Chinese intersts or there New Silk Road to central asia and Europe

see take a map and see the diffrence between Kashgar to nearest production facilty /manufacturing cities in China and there distance from kashghar and Gawadar and how much distance china needs to cover to send its goods to central asia and Euorope (new silk road)

http://thediplomat.com/2014/05/chinas-new-silk-road-vision-revealed/


now tell me what will be chinas priority to do trade waia land in Xi’an in central China before stretching west through Lanzhou (Gansu province), Urumqi (Xinjiang), and Khorgas (Xinjiang), which is near the border with Kazakhstan. The Silk Road then runs southwest from Central Asia to northern Iran before swinging west through Iraq, Syria, and Turkey. From Istanbul, the Silk Road crosses the Bosporus Strait and heads northwest through Europe, including Bulgaria, Romania, the Czech Republic, and Germany. Reaching Duisburg in Germany, it swings north to Rotterdam in the Netherlands. From Rotterdam, the path runs south to Venice, Italy

or the CEPC where it again has to cover all the pakistan land distance after passing to karakoram pass to reach gawadar where the good will again be loaded on ships to join maratime silk route (why will they not keep using the orignal Silk Road or the maratime silk route)

in short :

1. CEPC is just Plan B /Insurence policy for trade if the chinese martime trade is effected in SCS to mallacka straits to bay of bengal to suez canal and beyond think about it

2. Chahbahaar corridoar is not even compition to chinese trade corridoar /New Silk route /Maratime Silk Route

From your Given route above, Pakistan can access central asia through china avoiding Afghanistan in the process.

 

[GURU DUTT]

From your Given route above, Pakistan can access central asia through china avoiding Afghanistan in the process.

sure sure why not even in ancient times traders from indian sub continent used silk road to take there goods to markets in cenrtal asia whats the problem in that ?

 

[SOHEIL]

US backs India-Iran Chabahar port deal as it outflanks China-Pakistan Gwadar project



Cool story

 

[Joe Shearer]

US was now here in this part of Asia when we got the independence .They offered us top seats during Nehru's time .Nehru was a visionary and he could sense the dangerous motives of US .So he rejected all those perks and attempted for a brotherly relation with China .
And Chinese response was totally in opposite direction .They gravely misjudged our inherent socialist base .
They couldnt understand that one nation can remain as a democracy and socialist .
In the name of a poor Buddhist monk ,they invaded in to our land (,something that both nations could have been solve through an amicable negotiations .).
Then US began to make their moves through various ways .



Chinese still needs to learn a lots of lesson from US .Even though Mexico itch them here and there , they will maintain a total maturity when it comes to their border .
Chinese way is very funny ,single handedly united small and large countries against them in their immediate neighbourhood.

I know this will sound funny, but I believe that there is an unsound foundation to China's incredible rise. I believe that much of that rise was a recovery of lost ground, and that the policies of the CPC had little or nothing to do with it. If anything it has contributed to the degradation of the environment to a significant degree, and to the exploitation of its own people for the benefit of a handful of their citizens. In the international sphere, it has proved to be the ultimate bad neighbour; among their neighbours, friends and the sceptical are present in equal numbers.

There is also an unsound foundation in Pakistan's relations with China.

Pakistan has put its faith in China but it is a dubious proposition with little or no future. Pakistan had earlier become a member of the American camp, fully, without half-measures; it is interesting to view the contortions needed to justify a walk across to the camp of the biggest threat to US power in the world. The Pakistan marriage of convenience with the US lasted through the Afghan war; it was abandoned, felt slighted and moved to a closer relationship with China almost immediately thereafter. The original engagement lasted forty years. The new one has already lasted nearly thirty years, just to put matters in perspective. It will be interesting to see Pakistan's fate in the next fifteen years.

One of the worst aspects of Pakistan's get-together with China is the total lack of any higher principle than that of mutual self-interest and a shared hatred of a third party. Should there be a higher purpose in the 'realpolitik' world of international relations? The vast majority of analysts will disagree; I believe that the cold calculation that lies under it, however soon it is buried under a film of economic or social or geo-political virtue, vitiates it.

This in no way places Indian policies, internal or external, at a higher plane or a higher level. However, in the basic contradiction between a state founded on parochial grounds and owing allegiance to a transcendental set of beliefs, and one founded on the rights of the individual, and the sovereignty of the people, while Pakistan has chosen to be hostile to one example of this model, it has chosen to ally itself to another example (however distorted that model might be in terms of genuine representation of popular wishes and desires). This is plain contradictory, and it does not require the subtle analysis of a Mao Zedong to find it discovered in the full glare of day.

It will not be given to all of us to see the drama unfold, but some on this forum (not I) may watch the entire cycle. May you all live in interesting times.

I love the worse part. Can we fast forward

Jokes apart, with due respect sir because you are senior in age and experience

China has hegemony or not, someone's hegemony is at stake for sure. Lets find out who is he.

China had full fledged war last time in 1962. But America have had 15 wars in last fifty years. You can see who has hegemonic tendencies.

Current scenario is not very very serious. China and India can sign peace deal. Asians will be Asians. But it will be dead end for US here. As a reaction US may not hesitate to impose hell on Asia.

If we look today Asia can take up Europe and America economically and militarilly. Now the real competition will be among continents rather than countries.

I realised quite late that I quite agreed with the contents of this post, although my own analysis varied enormously. Thank you, Sir.

 

[Gufi]

I see China continuing to give the whole of Asia a bad time for another forty years, before succumbing to its internal corruption.

They are working harder then both of our nations on this. Rather doubt they will succumb to corruption as easily as you see it.
Did you post your views on this topic anywhere in this thread, I rather not read through the pissing contest that is most probably the previous 9 pages unless someone mature has posted on it.