Urdu & Hindi Poetry

[Shamain]

Hrk bahi i was serious when i had asked abt the poem ,baad may tau i deviated from my original question magar my question was genuine.

 

[HRK]

Hrk bahi i was serious when i had asked abt the poem ,baad may tau i deviated from my original question magar my question was genuine.

would reply tomorrow ..... am like drowsy right now ....

 

[HRK]

Woh istae'aaray nahi tashbeeh hain.
U were right mujjhay nahi aatee poetry samajh magar honestly woh nazam itni sahi nahi lag rahee.

@HRK do u think i am wrong about noshi gilanis poem that i was talking abt in this thread.

Bhai actual sawal kya hai ..... ??

 

[Shamain]

Bhai actual sawal kya hai ..... ??

Matlab yeh kay jo link may nay aap ko pichlay page pay jo meri last post hai us may diya ,which takes u to noshis poem. I was saying leaving out centremost shair baqi shair arent too correct.
Like the shair which uses tashbeeh dil ki jheel see ankhain, so isnt it a wrong expression. Dil ki jheel see ankhain doesnt make lot of sense .

My real point was also nowadays there are coming up so many new poets who do not write quality stuff butyet get followed.

 

[HRK]

Matlab yeh kay jo link may nay aap ko pichlay page pay jo meri last post hai us may diya ,which takes u to noshis poem. I was saying leaving out centremost shair baqi shair arent too correct.
Like the shair which uses tashbeeh dil ki jheel see ankhain, so isnt it a wrong expression. Dil ki jheel see ankhain doesnt make lot of sense .

My real point was also nowadays there are coming up so many poets who do not write qualitu stuff butyet get followed.

Jeel si ankhain is not a Tashbeeh, its istara (Metaphor) .... Ghazali Ankhain (Eye resemble with eyes of deer) is tashbeeh ...

Noshi Gillani is not from one of the poets I like much ....don't know why ...

 

[Shamain]

Jeel si ankhain is not a Tashbeeh, its istara (Metaphor) .... Ghazali Ankhain (Eye resemble with eyes of deer) is tashbeeh ...

Noshi Gillani is not from one of the poets I like much ....don't know why ...

NAHEEEEEEEEEEEEEE.

ghazali ankhain is istaeara and jheel SEE is tashbeeh , cuz wheen we use SEE it becomes tashbeeh.
Am i right @syedali73 bahi??

 

[Shamain]

Acha khair ajj maynay bohat larai ki miscreant nation say.
Acha ihave to share lyrics of this song by noor jehan sung in 65 to raise our armed forces morale during the war.:

Ae Watan K Sajeeley Jawano
Mere Naghmey Tumharey Liye Hain

Sarfaroshi Hai Eemaan Tumhara
Jurraton K Paristaar Ho Tum
Jo Hifazzat Karey Sarhadon Ki
Woh Falakbos Deewar Ho Tum

Ae Shujaaat K Zinda Nishano
Mere Naghmey Tumharey Liye Hain
Mere Naghmey Tumhaaaarey Liye Hain

Beewiyon, Maaon, Behnon Ki Nazrein
Tum Ko Dekhein To Yun Jagmagayen
Jaisey Khamoshiyon Ki Zaban Se
De Rahee Hon Woh Tum Ko Duaen

Kom K Ae Jarrri Paasbano
Mere Naghmey Tumharey Liye Hain
Mere Naghmey Tumhaaaarey Liye Hain

Tum Pe Jo Kuch Likha Shairoon Ne
Us Mein Shamil Hai Waz Meri
Urr K Pohancho Ge Tum Jis Falak Per
Saath Jaye Gi Parwaaz Meri

Chaand Taron K Ae Raazdaro
Mere Naghmey Tumharey Liye Hain
Mere Naghmey Tumhaaaarey Liye Hain

Ae Watan K Sajeeley Jawaano .


So beautiful, it weirdly sends chills down my spine. Dunno y. And makes me want to cry as well.
Reminding me of lalak jaan Shaheed.
Peace and Allah's blessings on u beautiful soul.
log chalay jatay hain but are left forever ingrained in our memories and hearts. Some ppl are definitely that special and gifted. Or chosen ones. And again that makes me feel sad.

;,-(

 

[syedali73]

NAHEEEEEEEEEEEEEE.

ghazali ankhain is istaeara and jheel SEE is tashbeeh , cuz wheen we use SEE it becomes tashbeeh.
Am i right @syedali73 bahi??

I believe @HRK is right. You got an interesting question and a bit challenging too. You are dragging me back in time when I used to struggle with my Urdu papers.

Tashbih = Simile
Isti'ara = Metaphor

Tashbih has a limited scope whereas Isti'ara has a much wider scope. The metaphors that are derived from well-known simple similes such as 'Ghizali aankhein' are tashbihat.

Ek aalim kar-e-Risalat (Rasool's job) anjam deta hey, is the example of isti'ara, because the aalim (scholar) is not a Rasool, but his job is similar to that of a Rasool.

I hope this clears up.

Noshi Gillani is not from one of the poets I like much ....don't know why ...

Because those who have flair for Mir o Ghalib or Iqbal o Faiz will not be able to appreciate anything below par.

 

[Shamain]

I believe @HRK is right. You got an interesting question and a bit challenging too. You are dragging me back in time when I used to struggle with my Urdu papers.

Tashbih = Simile
Isti'ara = Metaphor

Tashbih has a limited scope whereas Isti'ara has a much wider scope. The metaphors that are derived from well-known simple similes such as 'Ghizali aankhein' are tashbihat.

Ek aalim kar-e-Risalat (Rasool's job) anjam deta hey, is the example of isti'ara, because the aalim (scholar) is not a Rasool, but his job is similar to that of a Rasool.

I hope this clears up.

Because those who have flair for Mir o Ghalib or Iqbal o Faiz will not be able to appreciate anything below par.

Bahi may shayad theek keh rahee hoon. Yeh link dekhain shuru may hain definitions.
Quote mat karna meri post may link del karoon gee shayad allowed na ho yahan post karna.

CSS Forums - View Single Post - Request: Please define urdu elements. SOS!

.
Because those who have flair for Mir o Ghalib or Iqbal o Faiz will not be able to appreciate anything below par.

Hehehe. Mujhay tau na ghalib pata hai na faiz. Na faraz na meer na koi aur. Or sharamnak had tak na hee iqbal.

 

[syedali73]

Hehehe. Mujhay tau na ghalib pata hai na faiz. Na faraz na meer na koi aur. Or sharamnak had tak na hee iqbal.

That is why you are struggling with differentiating between simile and metaphor.

 

[Shamain]

That is why you are struggling with differentiating between simile and metaphor.

Oh nahi i understand now, ghazali is tashbeeh, i get where i was wrong. But i was also saying jheel see ankhain is also a tashbeeh, cuz hrk was calling it istay'ara.
Nahi yeh cheezain poetry kay bagair bhi ajati hain. I got confused.
(Bezatti na karain aap meri :{{{{{ )

Cuz tashbeeh ki yeh nishani hoti hai that u can always read it as , xyz SEE abc.
So here we can say ghszali ankhin cud also be interpreted as ghazaal ki see ankhain. So ghazali is derived or kind of inflection here.

 

[syedali73]

Oh nahi i understand now, ghazali is tashbeeh, i get where i was wrong. But i was also saying jheel see ankhain is also a tashbeeh, cuz hrk was calling it istay'ara.
Nahi yeh cheezain poetry kay bagair bhi ajati hain. I got confused.
(Bezatti na karain aap meri :{{{{{ )

Cuz tashbeeh ki yeh nishani hoti hai that u can always read it as , xyz SEE abc.
So here we can say ghszali ankhin cud also be interpreted as ghazaal ki see ankhain. So ghazali is derived or kind of inflection here.

I am not insulting rather telling you that tashbeehat and isti'arat are more commonly and frequently used in poetry than in the prose, hence to understand their proper use, you have to have at-least some command of poetry. In-fact if you read about the history of Urdu, fantastic poetry has been produced much earlier than the notable prose such as Mir Amman Dehlavi's Bagh o Bahar. Another thing you have to understand is that Urdu has adopted much from Arabic and Persian, for instance the two terms 'tashbeeh', and 'isti'ara' by themselves are Arabic. In order to understand their proper use, you got to have at-least some idea of how they have been used in Arabic literature, especially in Arabic poetry. I am giving you an examples of Arabic poetry and the use of four 'tashbeehat' in a single line:

From al-Mutanabbi: 'She appeared - a full moon; she swayed - a moringa branch; she exuded fragrance - ambergris; she gazed - a gazelle'.

Now an examples of isti'ara: The poet Labid wrote a line in which he said that the 'reins of the morning' were in the 'hands of the north wind' to indicate that the morning was cool and completely under the influence of the north wind. The isit'ara is thus an imaginary ascription.

'The pond is drying' is yet another isti'ara used in Arabic to denote the end time of a person or his government etc, and many such examples exist.

 

[Shamain]

I am not insulting rather telling you that tashbeehat and isti'arat are more commonly and frequently used in poetry than in the prose, hence to understand their proper use, you have to have at-least some command of poetry. In-fact if you read about the history of Urdu, fantastic poetry has been produced much earlier than the notable prose such as Mir Amman Dehlavi's Bagh o Bahar. Another thing you have to understand is that Urdu has adopted much from Arabic and Persian, for instance the two terms 'tashbeeh', and 'isti'ara' by themselves are Arabic. In order to understand their proper use, you got to have at-least some idea of how they have been used in Arabic literature, especially in Arabic poetry. I am giving you an examples of Arabic poetry and the use of four 'tashbeehat' in a single line:

From al-Mutanabbi: 'She appeared - a full moon; she swayed - a moringa branch; she exuded fragrance - ambergris; she gazed - a gazelle'.

Now an examples of isti'ara: The poet Labid a line in which he said that the 'reins of the morning' were in the 'hands of the northwind' to indicate tha tthe morning was cool and completely under the influence of the north wind. The isit'ara is thus an imaginary ascription.

'The pond is drying' is yet another isti'ara used in Arabic to denote the end time of a person or his government etc, and many such examples exist.

Ok daaktar sahab. bobbles head sideways.
I know tashbeeh is arabic word. Istayara, is from mustaa'r ....that is borrow. Dont know exact root word for it. thanx for examples and detailed description. Though it hurt my head trying to understand it.
Kuch cheezain zindagi hamaray leay nahi choose karti, poetry is one of those things.

Istayara may bas yeh hota hai kay aap us cheez ka asli naam , type of creature., living being nahi likhtay balkay ussay woh cheez keh daitay hain jis say tashbeeh daina chahtay hain.
Jaisay 'miscreant nation' aik istaiara hai jo may nay banaya hai.

Ya phir hamaray hamsaey may aik saanp baitha tha.

Ya phir jaisay Ek shutarmurgh nay mujhay negative rating dee.

Aur aik aur jab sooraj ki roshni tez hogayi tau negative ratiing us roshni say chup gayi,
Matlab yeh kay webbie bahi ko gussa aey ga, tez roshni is extreme anger at the shutarmurgh and negative rating chup gayi means, he will reverse them.
Wuahahah shamain is a genius, yes ,shamain twirls moochain shafqat cheema style

 

[Shamain]

Oh aur @syedali73 bahi, mujhay khayal aya maynay yahab negative ratings ka lkha tha and then i wrote in post rating thread. tau let me clear yahan tau i wrote it just like that ,at that time i really really had no clue of ur rating issue and hadnt even cheked that thread. Yahan tau iwas refering to my own rating. Woh tau aisay hee i went for urdu corner thread in suggestiin forum and just like that opened that rating thread and saw ur post. Phir i lost my temper. But seriously this post of mine had nothing to do with that thread,mujhay apki rating ka pata bhi na tha. aur yahan may nay shutarmurgh ka is leay bhi likha tha cuz kal bhi these indians including him were saying v annoying stuff. I thought imust clear mysel before u,mujhay aisay hee khayal aya aap ko aisa na laga ho.
Trust me idont do dramas ,jo kehna hota hai i say it straightforwardly on face. So its just coincidence how it happened.

 

[Bratva]

Munir Niazi

@HRK One of my most favorite ghazals.

View attachment 181366

Myth has it this poem "ate " it's writer and whoever sang it fell prey to death .

Ibn e Insha pen this ghazal in 1974. Amanat ali requested to sing this ghazal and it was his last ghazal before he died at age of 52 in same year of 74. Ibn e insha was diagnosed with cancer in 75 and died at age of 50 in 1978.

Amanat ali elder son Asad Amanat sang the same ghazal Inshaa jii uthoo and died due to cardiac arrest at age of 51

So household of Shafqat amanat ali has strictly forbidden him to sing this ghazal and his mother made him swear on her life never to sing it.