Update on Kaveri Engine

[PARIKRAMA]

Update on Kaveri Engine

According to Prasun K Sengupta

• R & D work on Kaveri turbofan is on-going & will be taken to its logical conclusion.
• What was tested on an IL-76MD airborne testbed in Russia was only the proof-of-concept technology demonstrator’s engine core.
• Presently, a flightworthy version of the Kaveri is being fabricated & after its undergoes flight validation tests in Russia on an IL-76MD of the Gromov Flight-Research Institute
• It will be retrofitted on a MiG-29B-12 of the IAF (only 1 such engine will be retrofitted) & test-flown following which it will be fitted on an Tejas Mk.1 PV model for similar flight-tests.
• But this engine will never enter series-production.
• Instead, a higher-thrust derivative will be developed.

+++
This is different from Ghatak engines which is progressing in a good speed as i have said earlier.. In news media only this much about Ghatak has been revealed.

The original Kaveri project was meant to power the light combat aircraft but it got shelved as the engine could not deliver sufficient thrust for the fighter aircraft. In its revived avatar, the engine will be modified and its afterburners will be removed to power the first Indian UCAV.

Government set to clear Rs 3,000 crore plan to develop engine for India's first UCAV - The Economic Times

+++

This is good news for Kaveri Program and awesome update. Is the higher thrust derivative indicating that we may see a small batch of perhaps AMCA powered by our own Kaveri... If so, this is seriously good development...

@Abingdonboy@Levina @anant_s @Ankit Kumar @Skull and Bones @nair @MilSpec @AUSTERLITZ @cerberus @knight11 @Vauban @Taygibay @WAJsal @Slav Defence @Icarus @raktaka @surya kiran @SRP @Picdelamirand-oil @randomradio @bloo @danish_vij @GORKHALI @ni8mare @ranjeet @Armani @Techy @TimeTraveller @DavidSling @sathya @mirage @Syama Ayas @GURU DUTT @HariPrasad @SR-91 @kaykay @SpArK @mpk1988 @rockstarIN @magudi @sarjenprabhu @Rain Man @saitama

 

[Echo_419]

Update on Kaveri Engine

According to Prasun K Sengupta

• R & D work on Kaveri turbofan is on-going & will be taken to its logical conclusion.
• What was tested on an IL-76MD airborne testbed in Russia was only the proof-of-concept technology demonstrator’s engine core.
• Presently, a flightworthy version of the Kaveri is being fabricated & after its undergoes flight validation tests in Russia on an IL-76MD of the Gromov Flight-Research Institute
• It will be retrofitted on a MiG-29B-12 of the IAF (only 1 such engine will be retrofitted) & test-flown following which it will be fitted on an Tejas Mk.1 PV model for similar flight-tests.
• But this engine will never enter series-production.
• Instead, a higher-thrust derivative will be developed.

+++
This is different from Ghatak engines which is progressing in a good speed as i have said earlier.. In news media only this much about Ghatak has been revealed.

The original Kaveri project was meant to power the light combat aircraft but it got shelved as the engine could not deliver sufficient thrust for the fighter aircraft. In its revived avatar, the engine will be modified and its afterburners will be removed to power the first Indian UCAV.

Government set to clear Rs 3,000 crore plan to develop engine for India's first UCAV - The Economic Times

+++

This is good news for Kaveri Program and awesome update. Is the higher thrust derivative indicating that we may see a small batch of perhaps AMCA powered by our own Kaveri... If so, this is seriously good development...

@Abingdonboy@Levina @anant_s @Ankit Kumar @Skull and Bones @nair @MilSpec @AUSTERLITZ @cerberus @knight11 @Vauban @Taygibay @WAJsal @Slav Defence @Icarus @raktaka @surya kiran @SRP @Picdelamirand-oil @randomradio @bloo @danish_vij @GORKHALI @ni8mare @ranjeet @Armani @Techy @TimeTraveller @DavidSling @sathya @mirage @Syama Ayas @GURU DUTT @HariPrasad @SR-91 @kaykay @SpArK @mpk1988 @rockstarIN @magudi @sarjenprabhu @Rain Man @saitama

We need to develop our very own engine test bead

 

[PARIKRAMA]

We need to develop our very own engine test bead

Fully agree..
As of now we are dependent on Russia to let us use IL76 MD as FTB...
We need to have a plan for this and start sourcing the right fit of FTBs

 

[Tejasfan7]

a very good news. this is the right approach. credit should go to parikar???

one the biggest challenges in engine development is lack of full fledged but customizable supersonic platform. With Tejas being wholeheartedly welcomed by IAFnow, that needed platform is tejas. offcourse HAL still need to build a inhouse test bed. but thats cool. expect some serious efforts in engine development now.

 

[bloo]

Update on Kaveri Engine

According to Prasun K Sengupta

• R & D work on Kaveri turbofan is on-going & will be taken to its logical conclusion.
• What was tested on an IL-76MD airborne testbed in Russia was only the proof-of-concept technology demonstrator’s engine core.
• Presently, a flightworthy version of the Kaveri is being fabricated & after its undergoes flight validation tests in Russia on an IL-76MD of the Gromov Flight-Research Institute
• It will be retrofitted on a MiG-29B-12 of the IAF (only 1 such engine will be retrofitted) & test-flown following which it will be fitted on an Tejas Mk.1 PV model for similar flight-tests.
• But this engine will never enter series-production.
• Instead, a higher-thrust derivative will be developed.

+++
This is different from Ghatak engines which is progressing in a good speed as i have said earlier.. In news media only this much about Ghatak has been revealed.

The original Kaveri project was meant to power the light combat aircraft but it got shelved as the engine could not deliver sufficient thrust for the fighter aircraft. In its revived avatar, the engine will be modified and its afterburners will be removed to power the first Indian UCAV.

Government set to clear Rs 3,000 crore plan to develop engine for India's first UCAV - The Economic Times

+++

This is good news for Kaveri Program and awesome update. Is the higher thrust derivative indicating that we may see a small batch of perhaps AMCA powered by our own Kaveri... If so, this is seriously good development...

@Abingdonboy@Levina @anant_s @Ankit Kumar @Skull and Bones @nair @MilSpec @AUSTERLITZ @cerberus @knight11 @Vauban @Taygibay @WAJsal @Slav Defence @Icarus @raktaka @surya kiran @SRP @Picdelamirand-oil @randomradio @bloo @danish_vij @GORKHALI @ni8mare @ranjeet @Armani @Techy @TimeTraveller @DavidSling @sathya @mirage @Syama Ayas @GURU DUTT @HariPrasad @SR-91 @kaykay @SpArK @mpk1988 @rockstarIN @magudi @sarjenprabhu @Rain Man @saitama

The only logical step now is to make a 120/140+ turbofan variant, or else the Kaveri program was for nought.

 

[PARIKRAMA]

a very good news. this is the right approach. credit should go to parikar???

one the biggest challenges in engine development is lack of full fledged but customizable supersonic platform. With Tejas being wholeheartedly welcomed by IAFnow, that needed platform is tejas. offcourse HAL still need to build a inhouse test bed. but thats cool. expect some serious efforts in engine development now.

Time for some serious R& D budget and dedicated team... Lets involve some pvt sector folks now itself so that the whole ecosystem gets created in a planned and phased manner..

The only logical step now is to make a 120/140+ turbofan variant, or else the Kaveri program was for nought.

That day will come for sure.. I would like to see first a 110-120 Kn version and then a more uprated 140+ turbofan variant...

But this path wont be easy.. We should expect obstacles to be created most probably by USA/GE who knows if our Turbofan is successful then they lose too much of future $$..

 

[subincb]

It will enter serial production if completed. We made PTAE 7 and now it's in lakshya. Same way something will come up. It's a jet engine.

 

[Maarkhoor]

Ghatak engines

Sounds like a movie...ooh well Sunny Deol acted well....
Any ways Indian research institutes learning fast...Kaveri gives the ground and experience for Ghatak project (@PARIKRAMA can u tell me little more about Ghatak engines)...so lets add Tejas also in the list of gaining experience and open up about it...leave and develop new planes what experience HAL / DRDO got during this project.

 

[PARIKRAMA]

Sounds like a movie...ooh well Sunny Deol acted well....
Any ways Indian research institutes learning fast...Kaveri gives the ground and experience for Ghatak project (@PARIKRAMA can u tell me little more about Ghatak engines)...so lets add Tejas also in the list of gaining experience and open up about it...leave and develop new planes what experience HAL / DRDO got during this project.

You know its good bro you remember Sunny Deol not Sunny Leone .. Atmosphere would turn hot there..

On Ghatak engines
Basically from the original Kaveri project, a plan was initiated for an engine based on Kaveri but without after-burner stage.
Its key benefits will be

• Lighter Weight
• Size becomes smaller than original Kaveri Engine dimensions
• A new exhaust redesign to lower the temperature and thermal signature.
• The engine derivative Ghatak is formally for all stealth based UCAVs
• A separate part of the project is to see how best longer endurance can be achieved

Prime users of Ghatak are expected to be

• The AURA project
• Black Project for a Long endurance High altitude HALE project (design and advanced cooperation under way)

A key focus is on exhaust heat reduction techniques and designing new vents for the same. An emphasis is on evasion against IR missiles by first lowering the detection probability. The same sub system and process would be used later in AMCA project.

This is from Economic Times infographic

 

[ni8mare]

Update on Kaveri Engine

According to Prasun K Sengupta

• R & D work on Kaveri turbofan is on-going & will be taken to its logical conclusion.
• What was tested on an IL-76MD airborne testbed in Russia was only the proof-of-concept technology demonstrator’s engine core.
• Presently, a flightworthy version of the Kaveri is being fabricated & after its undergoes flight validation tests in Russia on an IL-76MD of the Gromov Flight-Research Institute
• It will be retrofitted on a MiG-29B-12 of the IAF (only 1 such engine will be retrofitted) & test-flown following which it will be fitted on an Tejas Mk.1 PV model for similar flight-tests.
• But this engine will never enter series-production.
• Instead, a higher-thrust derivative will be developed.

+++
This is different from Ghatak engines which is progressing in a good speed as i have said earlier.. In news media only this much about Ghatak has been revealed.

The original Kaveri project was meant to power the light combat aircraft but it got shelved as the engine could not deliver sufficient thrust for the fighter aircraft. In its revived avatar, the engine will be modified and its afterburners will be removed to power the first Indian UCAV.

Government set to clear Rs 3,000 crore plan to develop engine for India's first UCAV - The Economic Times

+++

This is good news for Kaveri Program and awesome update. Is the higher thrust derivative indicating that we may see a small batch of perhaps AMCA powered by our own Kaveri... If so, this is seriously good development...

Very good news especially for me ...............but we need local airborne test bed

 

[Brahmaputra Mail]

• R & D work on Kaveri turbofan is on-going & will be taken to its logical conclusion.

• What was tested on an IL-76MD airborne testbed in Russia was only the proof-of-concept technology demonstrator’s engine core.

• Presently, a flightworthy version of the Kaveri is being fabricated & after its undergoes flight validation tests in Russia on an IL-76MD of the Gromov Flight-Research Institute

• It will be retrofitted on a MiG-29B-12 of the IAF (only 1 such engine will be retrofitted) & test-flown following which it will be fitted on an Tejas Mk.1 PV model for similar flight-tests.

• But this engine will never enter series-production.

• Instead, a higher-thrust derivative will be developed

Why not just build the derivative first and then run trials ?

 

[PARIKRAMA]

Why not just build the derivative first and then run trials ?

Bro you want to give class 12 exam before giving class 10?

Derivative of higher thrust will require more sub units to enable acceptable changes in bypass ratio without compromising on other parameters.
See this

See this simple figure from wikipedia
Jet engine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

High-bypass turbofans have larger bypass ratios, sometimes on the order of 6:1 or above. These turbofans can produce much more thrust than low-bypass turbofans (2:1) because of the large mass of air that the fan can accelerate, and are often more fuel efficient than low-bypass turbofans.

The bypass ratio (BPR) is the ratio between the mass flow rate of air drawn through the fan disk that bypasses the engine core (un-combusted air) to the mass flow rate passing through the engine core.

See here how an animated high bypass ratio engine looks like

Animation of a 2-spool, high-bypass turbofan.
A. Low-pressure spool
B. High-pressure spool
C. Stationary components
1. Nacelle
2. Fan
3. Low-pressure compressor
4. High-pressure compressor
5. Combustion chamber
6. High-pressure turbine
7. Low-pressure turbine
8. Core nozzle
9. Fan nozzle
Turbofan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Thus increasing such bypass ratio requires first a stabilised model with longest engine components life and wear and tear/ageing studies..

Then only some changes based evolution can be studied and finally a new variant with improved thrust but without compromising on ageing is finally designed and produced.. You might get higher thrust but more wear and tear implies premature ageing as well as high SFC meaning lower loiter time as fuel load is fixed.

Its a much wider topic and i tried in a nutshell the very simple things..

 

[Abingdonboy]

We need to develop our very own engine test bead

Very good news especially for me ...............but we need local airborne test bed

Watch this space my friends, within 4/5 years you'll get your wish

 

[thesolar65]

Update on Kaveri Engine

According to Prasun K Sengupta

• R & D work on Kaveri turbofan is on-going & will be taken to its logical conclusion.
• What was tested on an IL-76MD airborne testbed in Russia was only the proof-of-concept technology demonstrator’s engine core.
• Presently, a flightworthy version of the Kaveri is being fabricated & after its undergoes flight validation tests in Russia on an IL-76MD of the Gromov Flight-Research Institute
• It will be retrofitted on a MiG-29B-12 of the IAF (only 1 such engine will be retrofitted) & test-flown following which it will be fitted on an Tejas Mk.1 PV model for similar flight-tests.
• But this engine will never enter series-production.
• Instead, a higher-thrust derivative will be developed.

+++
This is different from Ghatak engines which is progressing in a good speed as i have said earlier.. In news media only this much about Ghatak has been revealed.

The original Kaveri project was meant to power the light combat aircraft but it got shelved as the engine could not deliver sufficient thrust for the fighter aircraft. In its revived avatar, the engine will be modified and its afterburners will be removed to power the first Indian UCAV.

Government set to clear Rs 3,000 crore plan to develop engine for India's first UCAV - The Economic Times

+++

This is good news for Kaveri Program and awesome update. Is the higher thrust derivative indicating that we may see a small batch of perhaps AMCA powered by our own Kaveri... If so, this is seriously good development...

@Abingdonboy@Levina @anant_s @Ankit Kumar @Skull and Bones @nair @MilSpec @AUSTERLITZ @cerberus @knight11 @Vauban @Taygibay @WAJsal @Slav Defence @Icarus @raktaka @surya kiran @SRP @Picdelamirand-oil @randomradio @bloo @danish_vij @GORKHALI @ni8mare @ranjeet @Armani @Techy @TimeTraveller @DavidSling @sathya @mirage @Syama Ayas @GURU DUTT @HariPrasad @SR-91 @kaykay @SpArK @mpk1988 @rockstarIN @magudi @sarjenprabhu @Rain Man @saitama

Yeah...I said that long before. Why not make AMCA a twin Kaveri engined Plane? I have full trust in Kaveri even if entire PDF Indian embers aginst it. But I do not have trust in Gromov testing result. Might have been compromised!!

 

[Ankit Kumar]

Update on Kaveri Engine

According to Prasun K Sengupta

• R & D work on Kaveri turbofan is on-going & will be taken to its logical conclusion.
• What was tested on an IL-76MD airborne testbed in Russia was only the proof-of-concept technology demonstrator’s engine core.
• Presently, a flightworthy version of the Kaveri is being fabricated & after its undergoes flight validation tests in Russia on an IL-76MD of the Gromov Flight-Research Institute
• It will be retrofitted on a MiG-29B-12 of the IAF (only 1 such engine will be retrofitted) & test-flown following which it will be fitted on an Tejas Mk.1 PV model for similar flight-tests.
• But this engine will never enter series-production.
• Instead, a higher-thrust derivative will be developed.

+++
This is different from Ghatak engines which is progressing in a good speed as i have said earlier.. In news media only this much about Ghatak has been revealed.

The original Kaveri project was meant to power the light combat aircraft but it got shelved as the engine could not deliver sufficient thrust for the fighter aircraft. In its revived avatar, the engine will be modified and its afterburners will be removed to power the first Indian UCAV.

Government set to clear Rs 3,000 crore plan to develop engine for India's first UCAV - The Economic Times

+++

This is good news for Kaveri Program and awesome update. Is the higher thrust derivative indicating that we may see a small batch of perhaps AMCA powered by our own Kaveri... If so, this is seriously good development...

@Abingdonboy@Levina @anant_s @Ankit Kumar @Skull and Bones @nair @MilSpec @AUSTERLITZ @cerberus @knight11 @Vauban @Taygibay @WAJsal @Slav Defence @Icarus @raktaka @surya kiran @SRP @Picdelamirand-oil @randomradio @bloo @danish_vij @GORKHALI @ni8mare @ranjeet @Armani @Techy @TimeTraveller @DavidSling @sathya @mirage @Syama Ayas @GURU DUTT @HariPrasad @SR-91 @kaykay @SpArK @mpk1988 @rockstarIN @magudi @sarjenprabhu @Rain Man @saitama

And what about the gas turbine project. The last time naval officials were given a briefing they were very excited about it.
Yes GE and RR is a far cry, even the Ukrainian ones, but if we make a decent one , a big boost to our Navy and we have a very big market ahead of us. And we will surely have price advantage over RR and GE . If we actually complete it on time our competitions will be only with Russians, Chinese only , I am counting on present turmoil in Ukraine and thus keeping it out.

Yeah...I said that long before. Why not make AMCA a twin Kaveri engined Plane? I have full trust in Kaveri even if entire PDF Indian embers aginst it. But I do not have trust in Gromov testing result. Might have been compromised!!

Sirjee , I am with you on this.
AMCA will not be a heavy fighter like flankers so two afterburning jet engines with a wet thrust of 110kn each and 2D TV will be awesome.

Just 2 days ago news was about Russian engine maker signing a MOU with Indian firm for co development, of a Thrust Vector version.

@thesolar65
An improved Kaveri +

""
Interestingly India’s Gas Turbine Research Establishment (GTRE) and Russian JSC Rosoboronexport/JSC Klimov have entered into a memorandum of understanding (MoU) for joint development of Multi-Axis Thrust Vectoring Nozzle for future generation aero-engine applications.

According to Sources close to idrw.org Klimov have offered to develop thrust vectoring nozzle (TVN) technology based on the universal KLITV (Klimov Thrust Vector) technology which can be customised for fitment on any jet engines.

Sources also informed that thrust vectoring nozzle (TVN) technology offered can be matted with engines of any OEM’s even if engines are from United states. India will commence development work on Homegrown 5th generation fighter aircraft project which as per IAF request will have thrust vectoring nozzle (TVN).

" from thread India to use GE’s Engine for possible co-development of 110kN thrust engine for AMCA