UAE Mirage to PAF and SH to IAF Extract

[ice_man]

by going for the M2K9 we also open up the AIM120Cs & JDAM & the Sniper pods can easily be integrated with the platform. & as for the mirages themselves i think our technicians know this fighter better than they know their women! they know how it will react to different situations!

besides by getting the mirages we will insure minimum time is spent on training pilots as most of the squadrons flying the old miarge IIIs can easily get familiarized with the new systems on board the M2K such as fly by wire...making their life easier & our country safer!

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Unless the avaionics are at least new as 2004/2000 its not worth investing in plane with pre 2000 avionics and technology

But if the technology is superior to F16 Block A/B sure worth consideration

 

[Super Falcon]

yes but a probleum is PAF not even looking at them first we dont get chances like this to buy a fighter jet in half of the price see IAF using their Mirage 2000-5 in IAF after SU 30MKI Mirage is regarded the best and we are getting newer version of Mirage 2000-9 i hope we get it if not PAF than PN should have look around them.

 

[Kompromat]

I guess after reading MASTAN KHAN's post we should buy this opportunity as first of all we can get them for a good price secondly we already have mirage infrastructure for Training and Rebuilding so it is a good option for time being specially for NAVY.

View attachment 8cec087b316b2bebc4c52e2013b4bb5c.bmp_.jpg

 

[Super Falcon]

yes navy also can use them better with harpoon and exost missiles and very very good fighter jet for maritime use

 

[MaXimMaRz]

no buddy IAF also tryed to get second hand mirages from arab countries. but they demand more than 50 million per plane. but our goverment expected it around 35 million us dollars. mirages are way better than f-16 in air to ground role(include nuclear delivery). but in air combact itr powerless engine makes huge disadvantage. but it have great self-defence equipment against SAMs. if it available for paf in just 20 million it huge bonus for you

If you are takling about close combat then its not just the thrust to weight ration. The main disadvantage is Induced drag that is generated by the delta wings....otherwise there are other fighters that have lesser thrust to weight rations but are good in close combat.

 

[pak-yes]

So from the above discussion it is clear that if PAF doesn't try to get these Aircraft's it will be a huge blunder and really a very very huge mistake.

1.Although some ppl say that we already have 4th generation aircraft.But Ask again do we really have them at the ground.No.They are in just Planning stage.And it will take years to actually get them on the ground and make a squadron.

2.If we get these Mirages.We can almost immediately form a squadron and so PAF will have good 4th generation aircraft actually on the ground.

3.Because INDIA is getting adventurous these days so we really need to awake from our sleep and need these Air crafts to defend our country.As a member said there is no price for freedom.Until F-16s MLU's and J-10 arrive which will take quite some time these Air Crafts will defend our Air Space.

4.There will be no logistics or Induction problems and cost to train pilots will be minimum.

5.A big problem for PAF known as Money also does not remain a problem for this deal.These second hand versions are very cheap and if some diplomacy is used we can even get them on credit.

6.Patriotism is a good thing but we should avoid blind patriotism.We should whole heartedly acknowledge our short comings.

7.PAF says they will lay their lives in this i have no doubt but the enemy is also not their to just run away.Especially when they have both numbers and quality.
If PAF misses this chance it will be fatal.

8.In short there is no drawback of this deal.It is a win win situation for Pakistan.

Pls i request to all those Professionals who know some in PAF.Pls try to induce their attention in this deal.It's no use if we just comment here and they doesn't bring any good to the country.Or Some professional write a letter to PAF to look into this matter.

Pls anyone correct me if i am wrong.

 

[Peshwa]

Just out of curiosity....

If the PAF actually go for the UAE Mirage option.....Being that the production line for the Mirage has been closed....how does the PAF plan to acquire spares etc if the procurement becomes a reality?...

 

[pak-yes]

Just out of curiosity....

If the PAF actually go for the UAE Mirage option.....Being that the production line for the Mirage has been closed....how does the PAF plan to acquire spares etc if the procurement becomes a reality?...

just as we have kept alive our previous Mirages.

 

[mr_cool]

I agree with most people on here that we should go ahead and purchase these planes.

The security situation is getting from bad to worse for pakistan. Before we had only india to worry about. Now we also have America/Nato on our doorstep...not to mention the internal threat in the form of 'terrorists', who everyone with abit of common sense knows, are backed by the indians and americans!

At the moment America is making alsorts of demands from pakistan, which we seem to be happily obliging to. These demands seem to be getting more and more ridiculous by the day. So, god knows what situation we will end up in when we finally do have the balls and end up rejecting their demands!
Also, only recently, US defence secretary Robert Gates said "It is not unreasonable to assume Indian patience would be limited were there another attack." I know some of you will disagree but in my opinion, this is giving indirect backing to india to go ahead with a war in future!

It is always a good pratice to be prepared for the worse case scenario...after all that is why we say 'better safe than sorry'!!

Masha allah we have a very good and a true patriotic army who are ready to sacrifice their lives for pakistan. Many countries would kill to have such a loyal, professional and passionate army such as ours. However, it would be such a great injustice to them if we do not back them up with the required resources!

Anyway....

Do any of you know who else is in the running to get these birds?

Also, IF pakistan was to go ahead to acquire these birds...
realistically speaking, what are the chances UAE will favour PAF over others?? Or is it a case of the highest bidder gets them?! Surely UAE can't be doing it just for the money, right??

Regards,
Zafar

 

[MZUBAIR]

First, All of us on this forum dont know How much PAF is serious to get these birds?

Second, If UAE give these 60-70 birds to PAF within cost of 300-400 million $ that's almot 5-7 million $ each unit..........b4 2012 (If PAF gets them later then 2012, then they may be get obselete or useless)........... I think PAF should go for it only if it costs 5-7 million $ per unit and they get them before 2012 . Otherwise this deal is money wastage.

Third, Y we need them?...........
We need them to increase number of 4th generation units in our air fleet.....We have 50-60 Mirage 3,5 (3rd generation) ......60 - 80 Mirage 3,5 ROSE (4th generation).........40 + F-16 (4th generation)......50 + F-7PG (3rd gene)......
PAF already hav exp on M2K ...
and Kamra hav exp of Mirage 3 and 5.

So, combination of ROSE Mirage and Mirage2K would be good addition....and may serve PAF till 2020....May be this combination help to develop 4 to 5 Sqd's for Navy.

I think Gov can manage 300 m $....as its annual revenue of arm sale from Pak defence.

 

[Super Falcon]

as far as i know our old mirages are useless when comes to dog fight but for ground roles they are superb so we need mirage 2000-9 to fill the gap of mirage rose who is lacluster in dog fight or give those new mirages to PAF and old ones go to PN naval aviation role or half of them to army aviation role or tank buster role

 

[gowthamraj]

If you are takling about close combat then its not just the thrust to weight ration. The main disadvantage is Induced drag that is generated by the delta wings....otherwise there are other fighters that have lesser thrust to weight rations but are good in close combat.

i agree. . .

 

[Luftwaffe]

Thank you MastanKhan for giving us the picture of today's PAF..
I do not understand why some of the nations like Vietnam/Indonesia/morocco/Algeria are getting their hands on some serious good stuff they have ease in procuring platforms oh include Thailand too while what in the hell with the PAF in procuring a right platform why is our policy narrow and short term? I've asked this question with no satisfactory answer to why PAF doesn't have a long term plan in procuring a right fight platform true multirole to get over with once and for all atleast for 2 decades in good number. I've heard enough about no funds i see how funds are distributed on making villas and and kid getting mcse certificate with awards of up to 500,000 rupees and police catches a thief awards a million, Pakistan cricket wins a game awards of a million rupees each what a waste its their Jobs to do! why pay they get a steady income already. If everything is taking so long to integrate so be it than procure something too good doesn't matter if it takes longer we've lost to India when it comes to Air Force inventory, agree or disagree..now thaT the whole world is going for shopping of top stuff we are waiting for those 36 darn J-10s and F-16 had we ordered Rafale in the same time of 2012 we would have been able to integrate it rather to J-10 would be delivered in 2014/2015 and than the headaches of integrations till 2016/2017.. it is humiliating that counties like Thailand with gripens top notch/Vietnam with SU-30 and other nations having the same love bird su-30s and gripens and procuring rafale while we're stuck in the era thinking about funds to hell with fund people were dieing of hunger already for the past so many years what difference did Musharraf made with reducing the number of procurement of F-16s? with gripens avionics even superior to them..The question of the day is Does PAF has long term Plan for the air force or would it be like that forever a man comes on stage reads words from the papers "our air force is capable to defend her skies" all said Garbage!. We must enter serious discussions with Russia even if we have to apologize for Soviet war!

 

[gowthamraj]

as far as i know our old mirages are useless when comes to dog fight but for ground roles they are superb so we need mirage 2000-9 to fill the gap of mirage rose who is lacluster in dog fight or give those new mirages to PAF and old ones go to PN naval aviation role or half of them to army aviation role or tank buster role

sir mirage 2000-9 are very good in BVR. if it is active with mica missiles(one of the deadliest in world) it make lot pressure on our air force. . thats why i want this in indian color. . .