U.S. To Beef Up Pakistani Weapons

[Bull]

Put an Abrams and an Al-Khalid in head to head combat. Who do you think will destroy who?

consider how much you will have to pay for it too. al khalid is made by you, u save a lot of forex and helps improve domestic industry.

Abrams are good but way too expensive.

 

[EagleEyes]

The only way purchase of Abram tanks will be effective is if it comes with some sort of transfer of technology, so with that, modifications can be made for all of our Al-Khalid's to get better lets per say in electronics, better software, and design?

Officer or somebody else would probably be good in shedding light on this issue and how could the transfer of technology can help Al-Khalid to be a better tank, or will it be even useful?

 

[RAPTOR]

For one thing..the Armor coating tiles on the Abrams is second only to the British Challenger. The other is the weapons loading system and the Abrams infra-red targetting system.

 

[RAPTOR]

M1A2 SYSTEM ENHANCEMENT PACKAGE (SEP)

In February 2001, GDLS were contracted to supply 240 M1A2 tanks with a system enhancement package (SEP) by 2004. The M1A2 SEP contains an embedded version of the US Army's Force XXI command and control architecture; new Raytheon Commander's Independent Thermal Viewer (CITV) with second generation thermal imager; commander's display for digital colour terrain maps; DRS Techologies second generation GEN II TIS thermal imaging gunner's sight with increased range; driver's integrated display and thermal management system. The US Army decided to cancel future production of the M1A2 SEP from FY2004, but in June 2005 ordered the upgraded of a further 60 M1A2 tanks to SEP configuration.
Under the Firepower Enhancement Package (FEP), DRS Techologies has also been awarded a contract for the GEN II TIS to upgrade US Marine Corps M1A1 tanks. GEN II TIS is based on the 480 x 4 SADA (Standard Advanced Dewar Assembly) detector. The FEP also includes an eyesafe laser rangefinder, north-finding module and precision lightweight global positioning receiver which provide targeting solutions for the new Far Target Locate (FTL) function. FTL gives accurate targeting data to a range of 8,000m with a CEP (Circular Error of Probability) of less than 35m.

FBCB2
In June 2004, DRS Technologies was awarded a contract to provide systems including rugged appliqué computers for the M1A2 Abrams tanks (and M2A3 Bradley fighting vehicles) as part of the US Army's Force XXI Battle Command, Brigade and Below (FBCB2) program. FBCB2 is a digital battle command information system which provides enhanced interoperability and situation awareness from brigade to individual soldier that will be used in conjunction with the Army's Tactical Internet.
M1 ABRAMS ARMAMENT

The main armament is the 120mm M256 smoothbore gun, developed by Rheinmetall Waffe Munition GmbH of Germany. The 120mm gun fires the following ammunition: the M865 TPCSDS-T and M831 TP-T training rounds, the M8300 HEAT-MP-T and the M829 APFSDS-T which includes a depleted uranium penetrator. Textron Systems provides the Cadillac Gage gun turret drive stabilisation system.
The commander has a 12.7mm Browning M2 machine gun and the loader has a 7.62mm M240 machine gun. A 7.62mm M240 machine gun is also mounted coaxially on the right hand side of the main armament.
DEPLETED URANIUM ARMOUR

The M1A1 tank incorporates steel encased depleted uranium armour. Armour bulkheads separate the crew compartment from the fuel tanks. The top panels of the tank are designed to blow outwards in the event of penetration by a HEAT projectile. The tank is protected against nuclear, biological and chemical (NBC) warfare.
One L8A1 six-barrelled smoke grenade discharger is fitted on each side of the turret. A smoke screen can also be laid by an engine operated system.

FIRE CONTROL AND OBSERVATION
The commander's station is equipped with six periscopes, providing 360 degree view. The Raytheon Commander's Independent Thermal Viewer (CITV) provides the commander with independent stabilised day and night vision with a 360 degree view, automatic sector scanning, automatic target cueing of the gunner's sight and back-up fire control.
The M1A2 Abrams tank has a two-axis Raytheon Gunner's Primary Sight- Line of Sight (GPS-LOS) which increases the first round hit probability by providing faster target acquisition and improved gun pointing. The Thermal Imaging System (TIS) has magnification x10 narrow field of view and x3 wide field of view. The thermal image is displayed in the eyepiece of the gunner's sight together with the range measurement from a laser rangefinder. The Northrop Grumman (formerly Litton) Laser Systems Eyesafe Laser Rangefinder (ELRF) has a range accuracy to within 10m and target discrimination of 20m. The gunner also has a Kollmorgen Model 939 auxiliary sight with magnification x8 and field of view 8 degrees.
The digital fire control computer is supplied by General Dynamics - Canada (formerly Computing Devices Canada). The fire control computer automatically calculates the fire control solution based on: lead angle measurement; bend of the gun measured by the muzzle reference system; velocity measurement from a wind sensor on the roof of the turret; data from a pendulum static cant sensor located at the centre of the turret roof. The operator manually inputs data on ammunition type, temperature, and barometric pressure.
The driver has either three observation periscopes or two periscopes on either side and a central image intensifying periscope for night vision. The periscopes provide 120 degrees field of view. The DRS Technologies Driver's Vision Enhancer (DVE), AN/VSS-5, is based on a 328 x 245 element uncooled infrared detector array, operating in the 7.5 to 13 micron waveband. A Raytheon Driver's Thermal Viewer, AN/VAS-3, is installed on the M1A2 Abrams tanks for Kuwait.

PROPULSION
The M1 is equipped with a Honeywell AGT 1500 gas turbine engine. The Allison X-1100-3B transmission provides four forward and two reverse gears. The US Army has selected Honeywell International Engines and Systems and General Electric to develop a new LV100-5 gas turbine engine for the M1A2. The new engine is lighter and smaller with rapid acceleration, quieter running and no visible exhaust.

 

[Officer of Engineers]

Officer or somebody else would probably be good in shedding light on this issue and how could the transfer of technology can help Al-Khalid to be a better tank, or will it be even useful?

For the AL-KHALID? Not very useful to the point of counter-productive and a moot point since the US will not offer these technologies nor the M1 itself.

First, you're talking two different beasts here. The AL-KHALID is a medium tank when compared to the M1A2SEP. It simply is not big enough to house all the toys the M1A2SEP does.

2nd, the M1 series is designed for an American doctrine and American military expertise to which the PakArmy is extremely lacking. Your officer corps had a tendency to micromanage every aspect they could control. It's not that bad when your current technology does not allow even a company commander to directly interfere with platoon assets but that changes when your battalion commander can see and control every asset up close and in real time.

Lastly, read the article with a careful eye. The US is determining Pak defence needs; not the Paks themselves. And the US does not see India as a threat to Pakistan. That leaves the internal security situation as the primary threat to Pakistan in American eyes. For that, the PakArmy does not need the M1A2SEP to replace the AL-KHALID nor any of these other toys that scares the Indian Army more than they do terrorists.

 

[sigatoka]

For the AL-KHALID? Not very useful to the point of counter-productive and a moot point since the US will not offer these technologies nor the M1 itself.

The Abraham cant even cross many bridges in the third world. One of them collapsed a brigde in Iraq and the driver drowned. They Abrahams have also been damaged and destroyed in Iraq, it was not invinsible as claimed by the U.S. in 1991 which was not a correct indication. Seconldy due to the restrictions on labour mobility in the world, the price of labour to capital is very different in Pakistan and the U.S. Even if Pakistan could purchase the Abraham, it would not be economically efficient even if technologically so because Pakistan would have a different ideal ratio of labour to capital than the U.S. to maximise capability. I have put an analysis in the Artillery thread where i have explained it properly.

 

[Officer of Engineers]

Nice analysis ... until you start losing wars.

 

[EagleEyes]

My discussion belonged to the point of transfer of technology and how it can benefit Al-Khalid, it was a good clarification from you, but i never said U.S offering M1.

 

[Officer of Engineers]

There are two things here. What does Pakistan want and what is the US offerring?

 

[Nasir]

Pakistan, U.S. complete talks to strengthen military relations
The United States and Pakistan has wrapped up five days of talks designed to enhance the strategic relationship between the two countries, a U.S. Embassy statement said on Wednesday.

The talks, led by U.S. Under Secretary of Defense for Policy Eric Edelman and Pakistani Secretary of Defense Tariq Waseem Gahzi, focused on counterterrorism and ways to promote stability in South Asia.

The Military Cooperation Committee that met as part of the talks agreed to schedule military exercises and training activities in 2007.

Another working group on security assistance considered subjects that included Pakistani military equipment repair, technology transfers, upgraded or new weapons systems and the interoperability of equipment and tactics between the two nations.

The Counterterrorism Working Group focused on ways to synchronize and expand efforts against violent extremists.

The May 1-5 gathering in Washington was the 17th annual meeting of the U.S.-Pakistan Defense Consultative Group.

The next meeting is scheduled to take place in Pakistan in 2007, Pakistan news agency NNI reported on Wednesday.

The delegations reviewed successful joint humanitarian operations between Pakistan and the United States following the earthquake that hit Pakistan in October 2005, as well as progress in the war against terrorism.

Representatives from the two countries heard presentations on U. S. foreign policy objectives in South Asia, efforts to stabilize Afghanistan, and security measures and counterterrorism strategies along Pakistan's borders.

http://english.people.com.cn/200605/11/eng20060511_264574.html

 

[RAPTOR]

There are two things here. What does Pakistan want and what is the US offerring?

Thats a good point. The reason "I" mentioned the Abrams was because of the statements that the US is willing to provide Pakistan the latest and most modern weaponry. So...the Abrams and Apaches fall under that category. Those two items alone give Pakistan the edge over anything that india currently has or can get elsewhere.

As for the "little economics tit bits " above...the boy is studying it in school so its something new for him. Also i dont know how many bridges the Abrams will have to cross in the Punjab and Sind plains...so im totally bewildered about that one.

 

[Bull]

Thats a good point. The reason "I" mentioned the Abrams was because of the statements that the US is willing to provide Pakistan the latest and most modern weaponry. So...the Abrams and Apaches fall under that category. Those two items alone give Pakistan the edge over anything that india currently has or can get elsewhere.

There are a lot of other small arms and technology gadgets that fall under that...other than such big hardwares.

And as what webby said, a tot can be worked out if you are ready to pay lots of dollars and order in good numbers,may be like say 200 -300 abrams...and that will cost a lot.So a tot or abrams coming to pakistan can be ruled out and also pakistan doesnt need it.

I think they need to beef up their helicopter fleet .

As for the "little economics tit bits " above...the boy is studying it in school so its something new for him.

why is that u cant stop with this mocking???

U r lucky that others hvnt been bitten by a similiar bug.

 

[tahirkhely]

Guy my guess is that Pakistan is surely going to get some AH - 1s alongwith some UAVs. for the rest i m not sure. may be some peripheral equipment for tanks and aircrafts.

 

[EagleEyes]

I dont understand why United States refused the selling of Predator UAV to Pakistan. The UAV could be used in the operations on the war on terror, and it could really boost the existing capability of Pakistan manufacturing the UAVs at home.

 

[Officer of Engineers]

Too many classified products within that toy to be given away. You're talking uplink and downlink; encrytion and compression; and both COMSEC and OPSEC protocals. Even allies like Canada and the UK are not authorized to have the PREDATOR.