U.S. Influence Rises in Asia amid Chinese Disputes

[notsuperstitious]

What a jerk, can no differentiate between the quoted statement by the Navy chief and the opinion of the piece writer!!!

 

[TheInvisible]

Strong words buddy.

If you think that China does NOT want a "peaceful rise"... then what country do you think China wants to declare war on, before our economic development has finished?

Tell me why we would want to throw away all of our economic growth, just for a pointless war?

These angry words are just a method for the Chinese government to appease the ultra-nationalists within our country. Nobody actually believes that we are going to declare war on somebody just for the hell of it. The Chinese government is pragmatic, they won't do something if there is no benefit to be gained from it.

That is the difference between the democracy and a one man or one party or a military rule...

Democracy appeases its voters....

 

[TheInvisible]

I honestly don't see there's any problem with how we're dealing with Vietnam or South Korea.

Vietnam and China has been harassing each other's fishmen for years now, and protesting each other's moves in the disputed areas. It's actually quite funny reading the two countries' protests as they both talk in exactly the same communist propaganda speak. As far as I'm concerned we're just trading exactly the same barbs. Find me something China has done to Vietnam in recent years that Vietnam hasn't done to China then perhaps I'll reconsider.

As for South Korea, after Cheonan sinking their government tried to strongarm China with a bit of American help, and failed quite miserably. They're now busying mending ties with us.

I thank for your kind advice 'antagonize them at your peril', but I have to say any such antagonism is mutual. I'm also very doubtful about the 'peril' part, countries in the region has been antagonizing each other for decades now, and few has been in any 'peril' because of that.

Ahh... what a policy... what a policy... I must really admire CPC...

One captain got arrested... China threatens Japan with worst consequences turning the world upside down... hmm...

But when a China's failed friend torpedoes and kills 40 navy staff South Korea is expected to meekly submit before the CPC god... even a genuine request or demand would be considered as strongarming tactic...

Ahh... what a policy... what a policy... I must really admire CPC... Of course nationalist are only in China and are copyrighted by CPC...

No other country can copy the Chinese nationalist or at least reverse engineer...

 

[Nomenclature]

Ahh... what a policy... what a policy... I must really admire CPC...

One captain got arrested... China threatens Japan with worst consequences turning the world upside down... hmm...

But when a China's failed friend torpedoes and kills 40 navy staff South Korea is expected to meekly submit before the CPC god... even a genuine request or demand would be considered as strongarming tactic...

Ahh... what a policy... what a policy... I must really admire CPC... Of course nationalist are only in China and are copyrighted by CPC...

No other country can copy the Chinese nationalist or at least reverse engineer...

The problem isn't about the Japanese arresting a fish-boat captain, it's about subjecting him to domestic legal procedure, which is unprecedented and reflected a new assertiveness on the Japanese side.

As for South Korea, after the Cheonan incident, they refused to invite China to participate in the investigation, which was conducted almost entirely by U.S allies. Then they presented the results to China and expect China to accept them. Of course it's their boat that got sank, they can do whatever they please with the investigation, just don't expect us to accept their 'international' findings.

 

[huzihaidao12]

That is the difference between the democracy and a one man or one party or a military rule...

Democracy appeases its voters....

You are dreaming, democracy is more dangerous at this point, you look at India to know, not even with any one country to solve the border problem.

 

[siegecrossbow]

Yes that is true that no countries foreign policy is entirely democratic, but in democratic societies public opinion plays a very major part in not allowing a draconian foreign policy to be implemented. It checks the excesses that a government might indulge in terms of foreign policy.

Lets take the Netherlands for example - they have ended the Afghanistan deployment as the public opinion is not in favor of it, though the government had favored a continued deployment to keep Washington happy.

and what is all this talk of not treating us as badly as South Korea or Vietnam? are you doing us a favor? this is precisely the arrogant attitude that we associate with the Chinese government here (as different to the people). India is no push over & neither are Japan, South Korea or even Vietnam. Antagonize them at your peril or try to reconcile the differences.

How the hell did we go from talking about foreign policies to forms of government?

If you really think about it China is a fierce proponent of democratic international dealings. In democratic countries you have at least two opposition parties but if China conforms to America's every whim, who is going to provide the opposition? China is invaluable for keeping international affairs multipolar and democratic.

 

[siegecrossbow]

Ahh... what a policy... what a policy... I must really admire CPC...

One captain got arrested... China threatens Japan with worst consequences turning the world upside down... hmm...

But when a China's failed friend torpedoes and kills 40 navy staff South Korea is expected to meekly submit before the CPC god... even a genuine request or demand would be considered as strongarming tactic...

Ahh... what a policy... what a policy... I must really admire CPC... Of course nationalist are only in China and are copyrighted by CPC...

No other country can copy the Chinese nationalist or at least reverse engineer...

What about invading a country over invisible WMDs and sanctioning another over rumors of nuclear weapons development? That smells like double standards to me.

 

[Renegade]

How the hell did we go from talking about foreign policies to forms of government?.

No one is talking about forms of government. Do read carefully, the example was only quoted to show public opinion can have a moderating effect on the foreign policy of the government.

If you really think about it China is a fierce proponent of democratic international dealings. In democratic countries you have at least two opposition parties but if China conforms to America's every whim, who is going to provide the opposition? China is invaluable for keeping international affairs multipolar and democratic.

I dont quiet follow. What are you getting at? Care to eloberate.

 

[siegecrossbow]

No one is talking about forms of government. Do read carefully, the example was only quoted to show public opinion can have a moderating effect on the foreign policy of the government.





I dont quiet follow. What are you getting at? Care to eloberate.

I intended that to be a bit of a joke but it was supposed to mean something like this:

The United States is democratic but she ultimately advocates a uni-polar world, which is not very democratic for the people of the world. China spices things up by offering oppositions on many issues and thus makes the world, as a whole, more democratic.

 

[Renegade]

I intended that to be a bit of a joke but it was supposed to mean something like this:

The United States is democratic but she ultimately advocates a uni-polar world, which is not very democratic for the people of the world. China spices things up by offering oppositions on many issues and thus makes the world, as a whole, more democratic.

Oh ok. An interesting point of view.

 

[Ruag]

No, I did NOT say that. Where did you read that?

That is just one reason, there are many others. Nuclear weapons is another big issue. In your "dreams of war", how do you think China is going to solve that problem?

Solve that problem?

How many of China's neighbors with whom it has territorial disputes possess nuclear weapons? Only India.

The recent events clearly show how China has tried to intimidate its non-nuclear neighbors.

Regarding India... China already took care of that factor by supplying nuclear weapons to its arch-enemy.

When people say "trust me" on the internet it doesn't inspire any confidence.

I'm not here to inspire any confidence. My argument was logical enough and therefore, there is no need for me to try something extra to "inspire confidence".

Plus, making other countries/people "feel better" is hardly our job. If you feel bad, take some aspirin.

Sometimes I forget how logical and reasonable PDF members are.

 

[Ruag]

To quote some wise Indian members here. Sympathy is easy to get, Jealousy you have to earn. Suits your case very well.

Lol... how is that quote even remotely relevant here?

Which part of the quoted article or my comments give any indication that someone here is trying harness sympathy?

As usual, some members on PDF will purposely make completely irrelevant remarks just divert attention from the topic being discussed. Lame.

 

[siegecrossbow]

Solve that problem?

How many of China's neighbors with whom it has territorial disputes possess nuclear weapons? Only India.

The recent events clearly show how China has tried to intimidate its non-nuclear neighbors.

Regarding India... China already took care of that factor by supplying nuclear weapons to its arch-enemy.



I'm not here to inspire any confidence. My argument was logical enough and therefore, there is no need for me to try something extra to "inspire confidence".



Sometimes I forget how logical and reasonable PDF members are.

We formerly had territorial issues with Russia, the #1 nuclear nation in the whole world and that has been settled peacefully. We currently have no terrestrial territorial disputes with any of our neighbors with the exception of India (quite an achievement considering that the number of countries that China shares her borders with). Can you enlighten me on the number of land based territorial disputes that Indian has with her neighbors?

As for your argument that China has supplied nuclear weapons to Pakistan, there is no evidence that China directly gave nuclear weapons to Pakistan. Besides the development of nuclear arms in Pakistan was in response to the development of nuclear weapons by India.

If by logical you mean rehashing the same old rhetoric from TOI and NYT then yes, you are very logical.

 

[gpit]

So, China's sole motivation to not go to war with any other country is just to maintain its economic health. And, what happens when the economic growth becomes stagnant?

Trust me, that attitude does not make your neighboring countries feel any better.

Correction: "that attitude does not make India feel any better."

Your logical reasoning capability has been deteriorated to such a sad degree.

That attitude certainly makes Pakistan feel better, which is a neighbor country of China.

That attitude certainly makes Afghanistan feel better, which is a neighbor country of China.

That attitude certainly makes Kyrgyzstan feel better, which is a neighbor country of China.

That attitude certainly makes Kazakhstan feel better, which is a neighbor country of China.

That attitude certainly makes N. Korea feel better, which is a neighbor country of China.

That attitude certainly makes Laos feel better, which is a neighbor country of China.

That attitude certainly makes Burma feel better, which is a neighbor country of China.

……

Trust you? We can't trust you untill you stop making joke, start making sense!

 

[TheInvisible]

We currently have no terrestrial territorial disputes with any of our neighbors with the exception of India (quite an achievement considering that the number of countries that China shares her borders with). Can you enlighten me on the number of land based territorial disputes that Indian has with her neighbors?

Bro, you are trying to hide a whole big pumpkin in your food plate... neither you can hide it nor eat it...

Correction: "that attitude does not make India feel any better."

Your logical reasoning capability has been deteriorated to such a sad degree.

That attitude certainly makes Pakistan feel better, which is a neighbor country of China.

That attitude certainly makes Afghanistan feel better, which is a neighbor country of China.

That attitude certainly makes Kyrgyzstan feel better, which is a neighbor country of China.

That attitude certainly makes Kazakhstan feel better, which is a neighbor country of China.

That attitude certainly makes N. Korea feel better, which is a neighbor country of China.

That attitude certainly makes Laos feel better, which is a neighbor country of China.

That attitude certainly makes Burma feel better, which is a neighbor country of China.

……

Trust you? We can't trust you untill you stop making joke, start making sense!

Afghanistan, Kyrgyzstan, Kazakhstan, N. Korea, Laos, Burma...

Bravo China, you have beaten all the weaker states into submission...

North:

What about Russia?

What about Mongolia?

East China Sea:

What about South Korea?

What about Japan?

South China Sea:

What about Vietnam?

What about Malaysia?

What about Philippines?

What about Indonesia?

What about Brunei?

South:

What about India?

Sirji, China has toooo many disputes...

So next time think twice before saying India has disputes with its neighbors...