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Turkish Peace Operations in Syria (Operation Olive Branch) Updates & Discussions


PKK account shares footage of terrorists shooting at ATAK helicopter. I really don't understand why Atak's pilot risked the chopper by flying that much low altitute. Atak can fly above MANPADS range and can use Cirit missiles against those terrorists. But he decided to fly it 100m altitute and flying in front of PKK column 3 times o_O ? I think army aviation pilots need to re-training.
I was confused that tweet said Supercobra when showing Atak footage.
 
Your opinion ≠ facts.
Pointing the huge mistake that risked chopper and pilots' lives for no reason by flying in front of PKK column 3 times in low altitute like this


is a fact and has nothing to do with "opinions". This is not like "i like apple juice and you like orange juice". There are manpands and anti-aircraft guns with known specs, there is chopper with known specs, and there are physic rules. Anything beyond is pure dogmatism and stupidity.
 
Well i did talk about that those pilots were not just doing wrong, but doing absolutely wrong o_O Feel free to get triggered.

They are pure lucky to turn their house in one piece after this mistake, that does not mean they will be that much lucky everytime, and that is the reason why re-training is utterly important for not to see this


ridiculous mistake ever again.

Are you trying to imply that you know better then the pilots flying? Do you even know that we took that mountain from PKK? Don't spread shit.
 
Do you even know that we took that mountain from PKK?
Yes i actually watched the footage of FSA and Turkish tank rolled in that hill and mounting Turkish flag. That is funny that you actually put this as an argument where i didn't claim otherwise. What i claim is just application of physic rules, feel free to refute if you are able to, or stop shitposting.
 
Yes i actually watched the footage of FSA and Turkish tank rolled in that hill and mounting Turkish flag. That is funny that you actually put this as an argument where i didn't claim otherwise. What i claim is just application of physic rules, feel free to refute if you are able to, or stop shitposting.

The only one shitposting is you, sitting in your armchair "major tactician". lmao
 
VERY GRAPHIC!

Dont want to risk a ban for the pictures so I put a space in the link.

Twitter.com /JOHTURK1/status/957323563186507776
 

PKK account shares footage of terrorists shooting at ATAK helicopter. I really don't understand why Atak's pilot risked the chopper by flying that much low altitute. Atak can fly above MANPADS range and can use Cirit missiles against those terrorists. But he decided to fly it 100m altitute and flying in front of PKK column 3 times o_O ? I think army aviation pilots need to re-training.
You should teach them

@u.MP Welcome to the internet where couch potatoes with little knowledge and lots of arrogance try to teach professionals, who dedicated their lives to their jobs, how to do their job with little information about the situation they are in.
 
If you really think this is the way to use attack choppers against terrorists which has doçka and manpads


Then you are really stupid, and there is nothing to talk about


In both the war in Iraq and the war in Afghanistan, coalition helicopters in combat operations used tactics which were a far cry from traditional Cold war doctrine.

In the days of the Cold war, attack helicopters were expected to operate in, engage with and survive in, a SAM and AAA rich environment. For this reason Western helicopters had first rate optics and sensors, and their crews were trained to fly low and fast, carefully using the terrain to negate radar operated anti-air weaponry. In this, a helicopter has an inherent advantage over fixed wing aircraft- they can hover, or fly very slowly, in and amongst trees and the terrain, whereas aircraft like the A-10 and Harrier would be at risk of simply crashing if they attempted to do this.

In both Iraq and Afghanistan, the AAA and SAM threat virtually disappeared. Now the main threat was heavier automatic machine guns like the DShK, largely aimed with the old fashioned mk1 eyeball with consequent penalties in range and effectiveness. Instead of highly sophisticated SAM systems, you now had totally unguided RPG type weapons, but primed to explode at a particular range.

As a result of this, it was now safer for Apache aircrew to fly higher, beyond the range of most small arms, and engage at distances which minimised the risk from RPGs. They were able to do this because even the 30mm cannon on the Apache had an effective range of 1500m and beyond, whereas hellfire and 2.75 inch rockets had ranges in excess of 5km- neatly beyond the threat posed by most of the typical weaponry insurgents were likely to obtain. It was also helpful that most recent Western aircraft have received substantial avionics and cockpit upgrades in the last few decades. Apache was of course high up on the list in this regard, a it's sensors, radar, threat receivers and optics are probably all nearly as good as money can buy- compare the Gulf War 1 gun camera footage to that shown by American forces in more recent times. Now even single enemy combatants can be spotted easily in all weathers and at night, at ranges that put the attacking helicopter out of direct earshot of the persons being targeted.

But this is all somewhat besides the point. The question asked was about the tactics adopted by Russian forces in Syria. I believe the reason is basically related to the same reasons NATO forces trained as they did 30 or 40 years ago- the Russians are flying low and very fast in an attempt to make SAM and AAA weaponry less effective. A lot of documented footage has shown rebels using various kinds of MANPADs to down hostile aircraft, both rotary and fixed wing. Clearly, the Russians believe that the insurgents still have access to these weapons and so are using tactics one might use to combat the threat they do. You will see that most of their attacks are carried out by more than one aircraft at a time- so any SAMs launched can be spotted quickly and attacked without delay, and so even a downed aircrew can be aided by their wingman.

I also surmise (but have no evidence) that the quality of the sensors and optics on a typical Russian Mi-24 are not as high quality as those on the Apache or similar in the West and so mean shorter ranges or salvos of unguided weapons are used instead.

https://www.quora.com/Why-do-Russian-helicopters-in-Syria-fly-so-low

Read this bro.
 

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