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Turkish Engine Programs

TS-1400 is to small to power a jet fighter.
43e46b1760dc8cd892838e89d8636f59.gif


This the Engine of F-16.

Or it is would be too big and expansive to power a cruise missile.
36MT+turbofan.jpg


I'm giving these for just comparison...as Turboshaft and Turbofan are two entirely different designs.

turbosaft_motor2.jpg

engine_desktop_full_color.png


Further more, notice that TS1400 air take is radial...let's say that (we are imagining they took of the first stage radial compressor and replaced that with a conventional vane and blades...

Notice our engine don't have bypass canal that Turbofans need to have.
Low-bypass-Turbofan.png


Turbofan and Turboprop are two different designs, you can't convert one to other.

Interesting, so you got all of that out me trying to figure out whether centrifugal compressor could power a Turbofan engine.. can you point to the bit where I say anything about it powering jet fighter lol..

The answer is yes btw, a centrifugal compressor can spin a fan. So tech being worked on with TS1400 can be used to develop a Turbofan jet engine. Pratt & Whitney and Williams engines are some good examples.
 
TS-1400s will probably be used to develop engines to power Hürkuş, Atak, Atak2 in future. But i do not think they will power any UAV. Akıncı is the only HALE project as of yet i heard, and will use two 550hp engines if their claim is true. Baykar would directly jump into MİUS after Akıncı. I didn't hear any HALE project from TAI neither.
 
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Interesting, so you got all of that out me trying to figure out whether centrifugal compressor could power a Turbofan engine.. can you point to the bit where I say anything about it powering jet fighter lol..

The answer is yes btw, a centrifugal compressor can spin a fan. So tech being worked on with TS1400 can be used to develop a Turbofan jet engine. Pratt & Whitney and Williams engines are some good examples.
I think, we can agree on by saying "TS1400" won't be converted to a Turbofan.
 
I think a brief explanation of the main types of engines would be a good read, especially for people like me who don't have the expertise needed to understand the nuances of these complex machines ;

http://www.boldmethod.com/learn-to-fly/systems/the-4-types-of-turbine-engines/

How The 4 Types Of Turbine Engines Work
primary-turbine.jpg
Live from the Flight Deck
Gas powered turbine engines have come a long way since 1903. That was the first year a gas turbine produced enough power to keep itself running. The design was accomplished by Norwegian inventor Aegidus Elling, and it produced 11 horsepower, which was a massive feat at the time.

These days, gas turbine engines come in all shapes and sizes, and most of them produce a lot more than 11 horsepower. Here are the 4 main types of turbine engines, as well as the pros and cons of each.

1) Turbojet Engine
turbojet-plane.jpg
Wikipedia
Heinkel He 178, the world's first turbojet aircraft

Turbojet engines were the first type of gas turbine engine invented. And even though they look completely different than the reciprocating engine in your car or plane, they operate using the same theory: intake, compression, power, exhaust.

diagram-turbojet.jpg

How Does A Turbojet Work?
Turbojets work by passing air through 5 primary sections of the engine:

Step 1: Air Intake
The air intake is essentially a tube in front of the engine. The air intake may look simple, but it's incredibly important. The intake's job is to smoothly direct air into the compressor blades. At low speeds, it needs to minimize the loss of airflow into the engine, and at supersonic speeds, it needs to slow the airflow below Mach 1 (the air flowing into a turbojet needs to be subsonic, regardless of how fast the airplane is flying).

Step 2: Compressor
The compressor is driven by the turbine in the rear of the engine, and its job is to compress the incoming air, significantly increasing the air's pressure. The compressor is a series of 'fans', each with smaller and smaller blades. As air passes through each compressor stage, it gets more compressed.

Step 3: Combustion Chamber
Next up is the combustion chamber, where the magic really starts happening. The high pressure air is combined with fuel, and the mixture is ignited. As the fuel/air mixture burns, it continues through the engine toward the turbine. Turbojets run very lean, with approximately 50 parts air to every 1 part of fuel (most reciprocating engines run anywhere from 6-to-1 to 18-to-1). One of the main reasons turbines run this lean is that extra airflow is needed to keep a turbojet cool.

Step 4: Turbine
The turbine is another series of 'fans', which work like a windmill, absorbing energy from the high speed air passing through it. The turbine blades are connected to and turn a shaft, which is also connected to the compressor blades at the front of the engine. The turbjet's 'circle of life' is almost complete.

Step 5: Exhaust (aka "I'm outta here!")
The high speed burned fuel/air mixture exits the engine through an exhaust nozzle. As the high speed air exits the rear of the engine, it produces thrust, and pushes the airplane (or whatever it's attached to) forward.

Turbojet takeaway:

  • Pros:
    • Relatively simple design
    • Capable of very high speeds
    • Takes up little space
  • Cons:
    • High fuel consumption
    • Loud
    • Poor performance at slow speeds


2) Turboprop Engine
turboprop.jpg
Live from the Flight Deck
King Air with turboprop engines

The next three types of turbine engines are all forms of the turbojet engine, and we'll start with the turboprop. The turboprop is a turbojet engine, connected to a propeller through a gearing system.

diagram-turboprop.jpg

How Does A Turboprop Work?
Step 1: The turbojet spins a shaft, which is connected to a gearbox

Step 2: A gears box slows down the spinning, and the slowest moving gear connects to the propeller

Step 3: The propeller rotates through the air, producing thrust just like your Cessna 172

Turboprop takeaway:

  • Pros:
    • Very fuel efficient
    • Most efficient at mid-range speed between 250-400 knots
    • Most efficient at mid-range altitudes of 18,000-30,000 feet
  • Cons:
    • Limited forward airspeed
    • Gearing systems are heavy and can break down


3) Turbofan Engine
turbofan-gc.jpg
Live from the Flight Deck
Some wide-body turbofan engines can produce more than 100,000 pounds of thrust

Turbofans combine the best of both worlds between turbojets and turboprops. And, you'll probably see these engines when you head out to the airport for your next airline flight.

diagram-turbofan.jpg

How Does A Turbofan Work?
Turbofans work by attaching a ducted fan to the front of a turbojet engine. The fan creates additional thrust, helps cool the engine, and lowers the noise output of the engine.

Step 1: Inlet air is divided into two separate streams. One stream flows around the engine (bypass air), while the other passes through the engine core.

Step 2: Bypass air passes around the engine and is accelerated by a duct fan, producing additional thrust.

Step 3: Air flows through the turbojet engine, continuing the production of thrust.

Turbofan takeaway:

  • Pros:
    • Fuel efficient
    • Quieter than turbojets
    • They look awesome
  • Cons:
    • Heavier than turbojets
    • Larger frontal area than turbojets
    • Inefficient at very high altitudes


turbofan.jpg
USAF
Pratt & Whitney F100 turbofan with afterburner on an F-16



4) Turboshaft Engine
helo.jpg
NASA
Bell 206 helicopter with turboshaft engine

Turboshaft engines are primarily used on helicopters. The biggest difference between turboshafts and turbojets is that turboshaft engines use the majority of their power to turn a turbine, rather than produce thrust out the back of the engine.

diagram-turboshaft.jpg

How Does A Turboshaft Work?
Turboshafts are essentially a turbojet engine with a large shaft connect to the back of it. And since most of these engines are used on helicopters, that shaft is connected to the rotor blade transmission.

Step 1: The engine operates like a turbojet, for the most part.

Step 2: The power shaft attached to the turbine powers the transmission.

Step 3: The transmission transfers rotation from the shaft to the rotor blade.

Step 4: The helicopter, through mostly unknown and magical means, is able to fly through the sky.

Turboshaft takeaway:

  • Pros:
    • Much higher power-to-weight ratio than piston engines
    • Typically smaller than piston engines
  • Cons:
    • Loud
    • Gear systems connected to the shaft can be complex and break down
4 Types Of Engines, Based On The Same Basic Concept
Gas turbine engines have come a long way in the past 100 years. And while turbojets, turboprops, turbofans and turboshafts all have their differences, they way they produce power is essentially the same: intake, compression, power, and exhaust.
 
I think a brief explanation of the main types of engines would be a good read, especially for people like me who don't have the expertise needed to understand the nuances of these complex machines ;

http://www.boldmethod.com/learn-to-fly/systems/the-4-types-of-turbine-engines/

How The 4 Types Of Turbine Engines Work
primary-turbine.jpg
Live from the Flight Deck
Gas powered turbine engines have come a long way since 1903. That was the first year a gas turbine produced enough power to keep itself running. The design was accomplished by Norwegian inventor Aegidus Elling, and it produced 11 horsepower, which was a massive feat at the time.

These days, gas turbine engines come in all shapes and sizes, and most of them produce a lot more than 11 horsepower. Here are the 4 main types of turbine engines, as well as the pros and cons of each.

1) Turbojet Engine
turbojet-plane.jpg
Wikipedia
Heinkel He 178, the world's first turbojet aircraft

Turbojet engines were the first type of gas turbine engine invented. And even though they look completely different than the reciprocating engine in your car or plane, they operate using the same theory: intake, compression, power, exhaust.

diagram-turbojet.jpg

How Does A Turbojet Work?
Turbojets work by passing air through 5 primary sections of the engine:

Step 1: Air Intake
The air intake is essentially a tube in front of the engine. The air intake may look simple, but it's incredibly important. The intake's job is to smoothly direct air into the compressor blades. At low speeds, it needs to minimize the loss of airflow into the engine, and at supersonic speeds, it needs to slow the airflow below Mach 1 (the air flowing into a turbojet needs to be subsonic, regardless of how fast the airplane is flying).

Step 2: Compressor
The compressor is driven by the turbine in the rear of the engine, and its job is to compress the incoming air, significantly increasing the air's pressure. The compressor is a series of 'fans', each with smaller and smaller blades. As air passes through each compressor stage, it gets more compressed.

Step 3: Combustion Chamber
Next up is the combustion chamber, where the magic really starts happening. The high pressure air is combined with fuel, and the mixture is ignited. As the fuel/air mixture burns, it continues through the engine toward the turbine. Turbojets run very lean, with approximately 50 parts air to every 1 part of fuel (most reciprocating engines run anywhere from 6-to-1 to 18-to-1). One of the main reasons turbines run this lean is that extra airflow is needed to keep a turbojet cool.

Step 4: Turbine
The turbine is another series of 'fans', which work like a windmill, absorbing energy from the high speed air passing through it. The turbine blades are connected to and turn a shaft, which is also connected to the compressor blades at the front of the engine. The turbjet's 'circle of life' is almost complete.

Step 5: Exhaust (aka "I'm outta here!")
The high speed burned fuel/air mixture exits the engine through an exhaust nozzle. As the high speed air exits the rear of the engine, it produces thrust, and pushes the airplane (or whatever it's attached to) forward.

Turbojet takeaway:

  • Pros:
    • Relatively simple design
    • Capable of very high speeds
    • Takes up little space
  • Cons:
    • High fuel consumption
    • Loud
    • Poor performance at slow speeds


2) Turboprop Engine
turboprop.jpg
Live from the Flight Deck
King Air with turboprop engines

The next three types of turbine engines are all forms of the turbojet engine, and we'll start with the turboprop. The turboprop is a turbojet engine, connected to a propeller through a gearing system.

diagram-turboprop.jpg

How Does A Turboprop Work?
Step 1: The turbojet spins a shaft, which is connected to a gearbox

Step 2: A gears box slows down the spinning, and the slowest moving gear connects to the propeller

Step 3: The propeller rotates through the air, producing thrust just like your Cessna 172

Turboprop takeaway:

  • Pros:
    • Very fuel efficient
    • Most efficient at mid-range speed between 250-400 knots
    • Most efficient at mid-range altitudes of 18,000-30,000 feet
  • Cons:
    • Limited forward airspeed
    • Gearing systems are heavy and can break down


3) Turbofan Engine
turbofan-gc.jpg
Live from the Flight Deck
Some wide-body turbofan engines can produce more than 100,000 pounds of thrust

Turbofans combine the best of both worlds between turbojets and turboprops. And, you'll probably see these engines when you head out to the airport for your next airline flight.

diagram-turbofan.jpg

How Does A Turbofan Work?
Turbofans work by attaching a ducted fan to the front of a turbojet engine. The fan creates additional thrust, helps cool the engine, and lowers the noise output of the engine.

Step 1: Inlet air is divided into two separate streams. One stream flows around the engine (bypass air), while the other passes through the engine core.

Step 2: Bypass air passes around the engine and is accelerated by a duct fan, producing additional thrust.

Step 3: Air flows through the turbojet engine, continuing the production of thrust.

Turbofan takeaway:

  • Pros:
    • Fuel efficient
    • Quieter than turbojets
    • They look awesome
  • Cons:
    • Heavier than turbojets
    • Larger frontal area than turbojets
    • Inefficient at very high altitudes


turbofan.jpg
USAF
Pratt & Whitney F100 turbofan with afterburner on an F-16



4) Turboshaft Engine
helo.jpg
NASA
Bell 206 helicopter with turboshaft engine

Turboshaft engines are primarily used on helicopters. The biggest difference between turboshafts and turbojets is that turboshaft engines use the majority of their power to turn a turbine, rather than produce thrust out the back of the engine.

diagram-turboshaft.jpg

How Does A Turboshaft Work?
Turboshafts are essentially a turbojet engine with a large shaft connect to the back of it. And since most of these engines are used on helicopters, that shaft is connected to the rotor blade transmission.

Step 1: The engine operates like a turbojet, for the most part.

Step 2: The power shaft attached to the turbine powers the transmission.

Step 3: The transmission transfers rotation from the shaft to the rotor blade.

Step 4: The helicopter, through mostly unknown and magical means, is able to fly through the sky.

Turboshaft takeaway:

  • Pros:
    • Much higher power-to-weight ratio than piston engines
    • Typically smaller than piston engines
  • Cons:
    • Loud
    • Gear systems connected to the shaft can be complex and break down
4 Types Of Engines, Based On The Same Basic Concept
Gas turbine engines have come a long way in the past 100 years. And while turbojets, turboprops, turbofans and turboshafts all have their differences, they way they produce power is essentially the same: intake, compression, power, and exhaust.

Bro, if you are having hard time to visualize the airflow going through the engines that we posted for example;


TS1400 (Turboshaft)
turbosaft_motor2.jpg


HF-120 (TurboFan)
engine_desktop_full_color.png


Red line is the airflow going through the engine core.
Blue line is the bypass flow
 
Bro, if you are having hard time to visualize the airflow going through the engines that we posted for example;


TS1400 (Turboshaft)
View attachment 481529

HF-120 (TurboFan)
View attachment 481532

Red line is the airflow going through the engine core.
Blue line is the bypass flow
Nothing new here, turbofan is "just" widened turboprob engine with bypass airflow arround the core engine it self, so once you have the turboprop core engine to develop turbofan or turboshaft is no big deal. I'm trivializing it offocurse but it is definitelly not big deal for those developer once they have the knowledge on a core engine. Well done TEI and TR!
 
I think, we can agree on by saying "TS1400" won't be converted to a Turbofan.

No, I believe TS1400 core could be converted into a Turbofan engine.
066961ff-1ec0-4dd1-a0f1-9ee33aabaafc.png


Garrett F109 Core is pretty much exactly the same configuration as TS1400. 2 centrifugal compressors, 4 turbines.
tfe109.jpg

turbosaft_motor2.jpg
 
Last edited:
Nothing new here, turbofan is "just" widened turboprob engine with bypass airflow arround the core engine it self, so once you have the turboprop core engine to develop turbofan or turboshaft is no big deal. I'm trivializing it offocurse but it is definitelly not big deal for those developer once they have the knowledge on a core engine. Well done TEI and TR!

No, I believe TS1400 core could be converted into a Turbofan engine.
066961ff-1ec0-4dd1-a0f1-9ee33aabaafc.png


Garrett F109 Core is pretty much exactly the same configuration as TS1400. 2 centrifugal compressors, 4 turbines.
View attachment 481534
turbosaft_motor2.jpg

Okay, i guess we will have to wait and see. Let's agree to disagree for the time being.
 
TS-1400s will probably be used to develop engines to power Hürkuş, Atak, Atak2 in future. But i do not think they will power any UAV. Akıncı is the only HALE project as of yet i heard, and will use two 550hp engines if their claim is true. Baykar would directly jump into MİUS after Akıncı. I didn't hear any HALE project from TAI neither.

What about “Advanced UAV” by TAI.
 

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