Turkey limits defense sales to India to appease Pakistan

[Ankit Kumar]

Because the intention was not to harm India but to show a gesture to Pakistan. If we wanted to harm India we would have supplied Pakistan with those systems with considerable discount so that their economy can handle purchasing them.



Given the amount of arms import by India and the rapid expansion of the Turkish defense industry, there is a high chance of possible future deals. I don't know why it bothers you so much.

1.Your nation has directly supported Pakistan with funds and machines during wars. And we haven't ran up to the Turkish government complaining about it. You may do anything with Pakistan , that's an bilateral issue.

I am bothered here because this involves my nation.

2.The notion that our imports are rising is a false notion in defence sector. And even though however perfect the simple mathematical relation may look , its not feasible .

Example : UK has a very vibrant defence industry, yet its share in Indian defence sales is comparatively small. Reason => The defence solutions , which UK has does not solves our needs. Same is the case with Turkey at present. Your nation may be building ships with great capabilities , but does it mean it will find a market in India? No , why ? Simply because we are self sufficient mostly.

Untill Turkey makes a 130mm naval gun superior to that of Italians or start manufacturing high end radars like Selex does, I find near to nil opportunities for Turkey in India.

There was a possibility for armoured vehicles, but now with the advent of private players , that's also closed.

Note:- Just because Russia does not manufacture more pro crew comfort systems , this doesn't mean that's junk in comparison to that of NATO. I would love to see you at this point again but with a reasoning. Not with a biased mindset.

Thanks.

 

[mustafa erkan]

ındia wanted our radio systems ı think not weapons.
news is about software based frequency hopping military radios.They have multisystem,multiband and multi mode.They have crypto systems and intenal gps and internal map applications.It can be useful for disasters when communication system lacks.They are working at VHF and UHF band.If ı am not wrong they are the first radio systems give permisions to transfer digital datas to long distances at these bands.
Indians are in front of us in some defence sectors and also behind us in some defence sectors.I dont know their situation in communication systems .

 

[SirHatesALot]

Nice joke since when india-turkey has a relationship in defense sector heck even business relationships isn't that great.

 

[TurAr]

1.Your nation has directly supported Pakistan with funds and machines during wars. And we haven't ran up to the Turkish government complaining about it. You may do anything with Pakistan , that's an bilateral issue.

I am bothered here because this involves my nation.

2.The notion that our imports are rising is a false notion in defence sector. And even though however perfect the simple mathematical relation may look , its not feasible .

Example : UK has a very vibrant defence industry, yet its share in Indian defence sales is comparatively small. Reason => The defence solutions , which UK has does not solves our needs. Same is the case with Turkey at present. Your nation may be building ships with great capabilities , but does it mean it will find a market in India? No , why ? Simply because we are self sufficient mostly.

Untill Turkey makes a 130mm naval gun superior to that of Italians or start manufacturing high end radars like Selex does, I find near to nil opportunities for Turkey in India.

There was a possibility for armoured vehicles, but now with the advent of private players , that's also closed.

Note:- Just because Russia does not manufacture more pro crew comfort systems , this doesn't mean that's junk in comparison to that of NATO. I would love to see you at this point again but with a reasoning. Not with a biased mindset.

Thanks.

I'm not saying your imports are raising or falling but stating the fact that India is currently the second biggest arms importer after Saudi Arabia which tells a lot about its self sufficiency, or more like the lack of it.

Again, why does a possible deal between India and Turkey bothers you so much? It would be nothing but beneficial for your nation. Why are you so vocally against it? You are simply ruling out the Turkish options without knowing anything about them and without knowing anything about what Turkey has to offer. I'd understand if you express your suspicions but for example, dismissing all the combat proven land vehicles of Turkey by showing your "private players" is just ridiculous.

 

[ni8mare]

Indians are in front of us in some defence sectors and also behind us in some defence sectors.I dont know their situation in communication systems .

true .......and rationally posted

India is currently the second biggest arms importer

have you thought why india fell from first to second ??........food for thought

 

[DavidSling]

"Turkey limits defense sales to India to appease Pakistan"

India doesn't need Turkey defense exporters and the Turks know this.
They're just announcing that they won't sell weapons to India to appease Pakistan, for Turkey it has no big significant, since it knows that India relies on local products & weapons from Russia, Israel and US.
As some people mention before, Turkey does have UCAV and Radars , but Israel and US have armed drones for a decade atleast, Elta (IAI subsidiary) is selling all sort of radars to India, Rafael is selling Spike anti tank missiles, spice missiles, pods and more.
I conclude from the writing above that this headline or this article has no significant for India, and little benefit for Turks who want to look like they're "going" toward pakistan

 

[Ankit Kumar]

I'm not saying your imports are raising or falling but stating the fact that India is currently the second biggest arms importer after Saudi Arabia which tells a lot about its self sufficiency, or more like the lack of it.

Again, why does a possible deal between India and Turkey bothers you so much? It would be nothing but beneficial for your nation. Why are you so vocally against it? You are simply ruling out the Turkish options without knowing anything about them and without knowing anything about what Turkey has to offer. I'd understand if you express your suspicions but for example, dismissing all the combat proven land vehicles of Turkey by showing your "private players" is just ridiculous.

1. I am not against anything. I am just pro anything which suits India.

2. My point is your not selling to us will not impact us.

3. If you have decided that you will not sell us then why so desperate aboutadvertising your systems.

4.And about India not being self sufficient , yes may be. But we have reliable suppliers. ( Gurantee of Turkey being one ?.) I again say,

" WHICH SYSTEM , THAT TODAY OR IN COMING SHORT TERM (5-7 years ) WHICH INDIA IS GOING TO IMPORT , DOES TURKEY CAN OFFER US BETTER THAN ( not the quality of weapon, rather terms ) WHAT ISRAEL, FRANCE OR RUSSIA CAN ? "

 

[Water Car Engineer]

I'm not saying your imports are raising or falling but stating the fact that India is currently the second biggest arms importer after Saudi Arabia which tells a lot about its self sufficiency, or more like the lack of it.

There is a big defence market in India, you're right. And recently the Indian private sector are being allowed to enter India's def sector in big ways. Several of these Indian private firms are multi billion dollar firms - several are trying to tie up with outside partners for co-operation. This is where your companies for UAVs, armor, etc. would team up with, like the Samsung and Indian L&T, TATA and airbus, etc.

This is where things are unfeasible for Turkey, because of your relations with Pakistan. You're not only arming India's military, but also supporting it's defence industry by tying up with such private firms, building their capability. Big deals now require offsets as well.

 

[TurAr]

1. I am not against anything. I am just pro anything which suits India.

2. My point is your not selling to us will not impact us.

3. If you have decided that you will not sell us then why so desperate aboutadvertising your systems.

4.And about India not being self sufficient , yes may be. But we have reliable suppliers. ( Gurantee of Turkey being one ?.) I again say,

1. Doing business with Turkey would bring nothing but benefit to India

2. Agreed

3. Turkey has plenty of non-lethal defence products.

" WHICH SYSTEM , THAT TODAY OR IN COMING SHORT TERM (5-7 years ) WHICH INDIA IS GOING TO IMPORT , DOES TURKEY CAN OFFER US BETTER THAN ( not the quality of weapon, rather terms ) WHAT ISRAEL, FRANCE OR RUSSIA CAN ? "

You can pretty much buy anything Russia has to offer from US and vice versa. With that logic you can rule out every single country as potential supplier if you have either Russia or US as your supplier. So this argument of yours doesn't much sense.

With its relatively new appearance in the field, offering better terms as in high quality for fair prices is the only way for Turkey to be able to compete with those giants, thus that's exactly what Turkey has been doing with its aggressive marketing and pricing; offering better terms.

 

[Kaniska]

1. Doing business with Turkey would bring nothing but benefit to India

2. Agreed

3. Turkey has plenty of non-lethal defence products.



You can pretty much buy anything Russia has to offer from US and vice versa. With that logic you can rule out every single country as potential supplier if you have either Russia or US as your supplier. So this argument of yours doesn't much sense.

With its relatively new appearance in the field, offering better terms as in high quality for fair prices is the only way for Turkey to be able to compete with those giants, thus that's exactly what Turkey has been doing with its aggressive marketing and pricing; offering better terms.

I will provide a straight forward answer to your question which other INDIAN posters are avoiding to tell you so that you do not feel offended.

India do not trust Turkey for any arm sales if also it is good and cheap. The reason is simple..you seems to be more loyal to our rival than to us..You have to remember that arms import with any country does involved some political alignment too....In the long run, we can be good economic partner but not the defense as your country sides with Pakistan in major political issue and that is the reason India will always have a second look whenever they would like to have a defence deal with you although you have a better offer than the rest.

 

[Ankit Kumar]

1. Doing business with Turkey would bring nothing but benefit to India

2. Agreed

3. Turkey has plenty of non-lethal defence products.



You can pretty much buy anything Russia has to offer from US and vice versa. With that logic you can rule out every single country as potential supplier if you have either Russia or US as your supplier. So this argument of yours doesn't much sense.

With its relatively new appearance in the field, offering better terms as in high quality for fair prices is the only way for Turkey to be able to compete with those giants, thus that's exactly what Turkey has been doing with its aggressive marketing and pricing; offering better terms.

1.Non lethal defence products. As said , if Turkey can offer India specific solutions in Armoured Vehicles category, then that's one place where Turkey has a chance. But that remains to be seen. I am critical not only of Turkey but others too here.

2. And you have to understand this, we cannot simply buy something because its good. We will only buy it if there is a need. That's where, I see most of the Turkish products go out. ( Like Tanks and attack helicopters. ) I am not only ruling out Turkey here, but others too.

3. Offering better terms. That's the key word.
A example, we will be buying mounted gun systems too, around 1000 of them .And most likely we will be buying the French Ceaser over the BAE Archer, even though Archer is better, why? Because the French System suits our needs more. And they offer better terms.

 

[TurAr]

I will provide a straight forward answer to your question which other INDIAN posters are avoiding to tell you so that you do not feel offended.

India do not trust Turkey for any arm sales if also it is good and cheap. The reason is simple..you seems to be more loyal to our rival than to us..You have to remember that arms import with any country does involved some political alignment too....In the long run, we can be good economic partner but not the defense as your country sides with Pakistan in major political issue and that is the reason India will always have a second look whenever they would like to have a defence deal with you although you have a better offer than the rest.

Correct me if I'm wrong but Turkey has always been cautious not to upset the power balance between India and Pakistan. Turkey's close relationship with Pakistan doesn't mean India is expendable. India is still seen as an important partner and market from Turkey. So I doubt your government shares the same concerns as you.

 

[AbRaj]

Dude, what I'm saying is Turkey has an ambitious and growing defense industry offering many high quality combat proven platforms for relatively cheap prices compared to their counterparts from other big exporters. There are literally thousands of things Turkish arms industry can offer to India from basic communication equipments to flight simulators, from electronic warfare systems to radars. Since India is the second biggest arms importer after Saudi Arabia it is far from being self-sufficient, is it? So don't get cocky with me.

Turkey has good experience in armored vehicles

 

[illusion8]

 

[Kaniska]

Correct me if I'm wrong but Turkey has always been cautious not to upset the power balance between India and Pakistan. Turkey's close relationship with Pakistan doesn't mean India is expendable. India is still seen as an important partner and market from Turkey. So I doubt your government shares the same concerns as you.

Just see the title of the thread...It explicitly mentions that Turkey is just explicitly prefers Pakistan over India...Although India does not Purchase anything from Turkey, still then Turley would like to score some points with this statements...Now, what do you expect from India in this situation? Now, when Turkey is taking explicit stand in India Pakistan dispute then there will be some reaction from India too...Is it not quite expected?