Turkey converts another former Istanbul church into a mosque

[masterchief_mirza]

it was a church whole world knows it . it was converted to mosque after defeat and fall of byzantines
don't tell me defeated people willingly sold it to the victor impressed with his sword .

So what? 1453. The ottoman empire wasn't a "secular republic". When Hindustan destroyed the mosque and Hindu peace loving mobs killed Muslims on top of the destruction event in locations all over India, supported by the police, L.K Advani, Modi and other political figures, India was a self-annointed secular republic.

 

[GHALIB]

So what? 1453. The ottoman empire wasn't a "secular republic". When Hindustan destroyed the mosque and Hindu peace loving mobs killed Muslims on top of the destruction event in locations all over India, supported by the police, L.K Advani, Modi and other political figures, India was a self-annointed secular republic.

lol childish arguements ....

religious fanatics know how erdogon did that miracle and how to follow it .
erdogan has shown the way how to manufacture arguements how to convert other religion's buildings to own religious place ,

 

[masterchief_mirza]

Uff. Please manage to post a single reliable source of 'Muslims being killed while defending destruction of the structure on 6th December 1992'.

Don't know who you are but I'm getting annoyed by you trying to derail this pleasant discussion with your hair splitting nonsense. It is well established that some Muslims remained in ayodhya on the day of destruction and were murdered during the rampage to the Babri site.

I shall find you references in due course. But please don't bring your obfuscation here.

 

[masterchief_mirza]

"Fearing tension after the court decision, Mohammed Shahid, 48, the grandson of the mosque’s last Imam, or prayer leader, has decided to move his family away.

He has reason to be afraid.

Shahid’s father, Mohammed Shabir, was killed by a mob of Hindus who rampaged through Ayodhya before tearing down the mosque on Dec. 6, 1992.

“In 1992, we decided to stay put – a decision that we live to regret,” Shahid said, sitting in the courtyard of his run-down, two-story house. “Other than killing my father, they set ablaze our house and a sawmill, our only source of income.” "

The imam's son was murdered for starters. I am sure there were several other deaths that day and will hunt for resources for your benefit at some point. However, that is secondary to the main discussion.

Indian Muslims concerned as court prepares to rule on destroyed Babri Masjid

Indian Muslims are anxious as they await a court ruling on the 16th-century Babri Masjid, destroyed by a Hindu mob in 1992

www.google.com

 

[masterchief_mirza]

What happened that December night in Ayodhya

In the hours after the mosque was razed, at least 17 persons were killed and over 250 homes and shops gutted or damaged

www.google.com

A dozen or so innocent Muslims were murdered at ground zero. This was an event that was part of the rampage that destroyed Babri masjid. Hindus decided that along with the debris of a masjid, Muslim blood was also needed on their clothes that particular night, hence the murders of these innocent defenceless souls. It wasn't a "riot". It wasn't some pitched battle. Hindu mobs simply dumped isolated Muslims into dry wells and set them on fire.

Indian media remembers these incidents as riots. In reality, they were pogroms, in the late 20th century, in a secular democratic republic.

 

[masterchief_mirza]

lol childish arguements ....

religious fanatics know how erdogon did that miracle and how to follow it .
erdogan has shown the way how to manufacture arguements how to convert other religion's buildings to own religious place ,

Please confirm when hagia Sofia was (a) a church, (b) a mosque, (c) a museum and (d) a mosque again. Hagia Sofia wasn't under dispute. Babri has been under dispute ever since the British colonial era and every time Hindus attempted to usurp the site, local Muslims resisted.

 

[agamdilawari]

Don't know who you are but I'm getting annoyed by you trying to derail this pleasant discussion with your hair splitting nonsense. It is well established that some Muslims remained in ayodhya on the day of destruction and were murdered during the rampage to the Babri site.

I shall find you references in due course. But please don't bring your obfuscation here.

So that's ur argument ? "Its well established but where...I don't know". Great

 

[masterchief_mirza]

So that's ur argument ? "Its well established but where...I don't know". Great

I've already addressed your query. Look above.

 

[xeuss]

Uff. Please manage to post a single reliable source of 'Muslims being killed while defending destruction of the structure on 6th December 1992'.

In 1992, Muslims accounted for 8-10% of the population of Ayodhya.

The situation did not improve after the imposition of President's rule at 9.10 P.M. on 6 December. Despite the large presence of the CPMF in Ayodhya-Faizabad, these forces were not deployed to protect the citizenry. Attacks against the minority community continued till the late hours of the 7 December. Only on the morning of 8 December did the new administration intervene to normalise the situation. By then at least 14 people had been killed and another 14 injured, all Muslims. Another 3 were missing. The damage to property was extensive. According to the Muslim relief organisations, 267 houses, 23 mosques and 19 mazaars were destroyed or damaged. Government estimates are substantially lower. According to official figures only one mosque and two graves were substantially destroyed, and 542 Muslim residences were destroyed and looted, with losses estimated to be Rs. 1,91,39,400. In most instances, local officials just estimated the losses of one household per building, although in almost all cases more than one family resided in each structure. Thus, official figures are, according to the incomplete information available with the Commission, a gross underestimate.

From Citizens Tribunal on Ayodhya (authors Kamala Prasad, Kamal Chenoy, Kirti Singh, Dinesh Mohan, Sagari Chhabra, S.C. Shukla), published July 1993, New Delhi

Also, Muslim did not pray in the mosque because of a court order that prevented Muslims from access to their mosque.

 

[agamdilawari]

In 1992, Muslims accounted for 8-10% of the population of Ayodhya.

The situation did not improve after the imposition of President's rule at 9.10 P.M. on 6 December. Despite the large presence of the CPMF in Ayodhya-Faizabad, these forces were not deployed to protect the citizenry. Attacks against the minority community continued till the late hours of the 7 December. Only on the morning of 8 December did the new administration intervene to normalise the situation. By then at least 14 people had been killed and another 14 injured, all Muslims. Another 3 were missing. The damage to property was extensive. According to the Muslim relief organisations, 267 houses, 23 mosques and 19 mazaars were destroyed or damaged. Government estimates are substantially lower. According to official figures only one mosque and two graves were substantially destroyed, and 542 Muslim residences were destroyed and looted, with losses estimated to be Rs. 1,91,39,400. In most instances, local officials just estimated the losses of one household per building, although in almost all cases more than one family resided in each structure. Thus, official figures are, according to the incomplete information available with the Commission, a gross underestimate.

From Citizens Tribunal on Ayodhya (authors Kamala Prasad, Kamal Chenoy, Kirti Singh, Dinesh Mohan, Sagari Chhabra, S.C. Shukla), published July 1993, New Delhi

Also, Muslim did not pray in the mosque because of a court order that prevented Muslims from access to their mosque.

The guy states Muslims died on 6th Dec 1992 under the structure at the very site when it was being razed. Does ur reply validate that ? off course not. You are stating incidents on arson. Yahan to baat hi dusri hai.

 

[xeuss]

The guy states Muslims died on 6th Dec 1992 under the structure at the very site when it was being razed. Does ur reply validate that ? off course not. You are stating incidents on arson. Yahan to baat hi dusri hai.

I am sorry that the death of Muslims in Ayodhya does not move your conscience just merely because their location was not right beneath their mosque.

 

[agamdilawari]

I am sorry that the death of Muslims in Ayodhya does not move your conscience just merely because their location was not right beneath their mosque.

And you say that bcz I said that was not being discussed ? Was that the topic in hand ? Not to state that the sources you are quoting are from sabrang. You know about Sabrang ? How Teesta and co have accused by same people of fraud whom she tried to portray as victim and hounded money in their name ? Try and do better.

 

[masterchief_mirza]

The guy states Muslims died on 6th Dec 1992 under the structure at the very site when it was being razed. Does ur reply validate that ? off course not. You are stating incidents on arson. Yahan to baat hi dusri hai.

I didn't say literally "UNder the structure". I said during the rampage, distinct from the nationwide riots that followed. Muslims were in Ayodhya on the day standing their ground - not many - but certainly some. They were slaughtered ruthlessly by the mob and are martyrs to the cause.

What you're indulging in here is simple obfuscation of a straightforward issue. It's nothing new around pdf and indeed, it remains a weapon of choice among many of your countrymen.

Now if you really wish to help my understanding, please explain why this kangaroo justice system has not convicted the culprits of the crimes against Babri and the people of ayodhya.

 

[xeuss]

And you say that bcz I said that was not being discussed ? Was that the topic in hand ? Not to state that the sources you are quoting are from sabrang. You know about Sabrang ? How Teesta and co have accused by same people of fraud whom she tried to portray as victim and hounded money in their name ? Try and do better.

The source was provided. The authors of the tribunal report were named along with the place/date of publication. If you have any other facts to dispute this account, please feel free to cite it.

 

[Menthol]

Turkey is worth to watch.

It's the start of a huge event, a world changing one.

The final chapter for the start of the event that we have been waiting for so long.