Turkey Contained ?

[Ottoman-Turk]

nuetral citizen are you german?

 

[BronzePlaque]

nuetral citizen are you german?

He is Egyptian

 

[p(-)0ENiX]

p(-)0ENiX, mate can you provide any information about that Aryan ancestors of the most Pakistanis issue? I am not expert on this issue so please forgive me for my ignorance but i witnessed a lot of Indians who claimed that their ancestors were also Aryans..

No problem bro, I don't have too many online sources though, but I am going to try & provide you with the sources I have for now. Yes, I know many Indians claim Aryan ancestry, in fact as far as I know some North Indians do have Aryan ancestry. Anyway here are some sources for you to refer too:

A Concise History of India, Chapter 1

Who Were the Aryans of the Vedas? | Robert Lindsay

History of Pakistan: The Aryans of Pakistan

History of Pakistan: Pakistanis' ignorance to their roots (Not really related but an interesting read)

Pakistan - Early Civilization in Pakistan

Here is a PDF file link, I am still reading it myself. In fact to be honest I am still learning about the Sanskrit speaking Aryans myself lol.

North Indian Protohistory and Vedic Aryans | Bhan | Ancient Asia

An Introduction to Pakistan

 

[Armstrong]

I think Pakistan needs a mixture of Aryan & Islamic Nationalism. When I say Aryan I mean "Vedic Aryans" who happen to be the common ancestors of most Pakistanis. I might start a thread about this soon, however I don't want to discuss this here because it's not related to the topic of this thread.

I dunno about my Aryan roots...I'm an ethnic Kashmiri born to a Punjabi mother but being a Pakistani is the only national identity I'd be willing to accept. Islamic Nationalism...yes, thats something that we not only need but we were created to preserve and nurture that.

 

[Cem_]

Originally Posted by Ottoman-Turk
neutral citizen are you german?

Originally Posted by BrozePlaque He is Egyptian

I don't think he is Egyptian, he is obsessed with the Great-Turkey idea, considering his posts i guess it must be Chinese, same with S-19 guy, he claims to be Kazakh which is highly unlikely as i have some very close friends who are Kazaks, believe me they are nothing like him, reading those posts of him to i'm 90% sure he is also a Chinese.

 

[Mahmoud_EGY]

I don't think he is Egyptian, he is obsessed with the Great-Turkey thing, considering his posts i guess it must be Chinese, same with S-19 guy, he claims to be Kazakh which is highly unlikely as i have some very close friends who are Kazaks, believe me they are nothing like him, reading those posts of him to i'm 90% sure he is also a Chinese.

he is egyptian

 

[Cem_]

Can you proof it?

 

[Mahmoud_EGY]

Can you proof it?

we can ask him

 

[p(-)0ENiX]

Aryan Nationalism would be a kind of 'Ancestor Worship' and thus closer to 'Shirk'.

The idea behind creation of Pakistan was that no matter what our ancestors were, which languages we speak, what cultural practices and customs we follow - we are all bound together by the 'Ties of Islam'. Islam is the glue that makes us a Nation, otherwise the genetic make-up of Pakistani population is a genetic mix of all 3 major racial groups: Negroid, Caucasoid and Mongoloid. Any attempt of bringing the people together on the basis of one racial identity will backfire.

I don't think Aryan nationalism is closer to shirk bro, I will never ascribe any partner to the one & only true God. There is no doubt that Islam is extremely important to Pakistanis & it is important to me as well, but having some ethnic nationalism will aid in further increasing unity. Not everyone is Pakistan is a Muslim so focusing on only Islamic nationalism will lead them to feel left out in my opinion. A mixture of both ethnic & religious nationalism means that we focus on improving our country as much as we can & take pride in our ancestors while simultaneously being proud of our religion too.

Yea it's true Pakistan's population is a mixture of all racial groups, but I can safely say that the majority of them are mixed with Aryans even if it's to a little extent. Besides, in terms of culture & language, almost every Pakistani is an Aryan.

I dunno about my Aryan roots...I'm an ethnic Kashmiri born to a Punjabi mother but being a Pakistani is the only national identity I'd be willing to accept. Islamic Nationalism...yes, thats something that we not only need but we were created to preserve and nurture that.

I am ethnic Kashmiri too, born in Lahore. Islamic nationalism is great & I support it, but I think that all nations on earth must honor their roots as well.

 

[Cem_]

Originally Posted by Mahmoud_EGY
we can ask him

Well he can say, i'm monkey??!!

 

[Desert Fox]

p(-)0ENiX, mate can you provide any information about that Aryan ancestors of the most Pakistanis issue? I am not expert on this issue so please forgive me for my ignorance but i witnessed a lot of Indians who claimed that their ancestors were also Aryans..

Pakistan is comprised of different people, different ethnicities, you will find variety here. The region of Afghanistan and Pakistan is located at the crossroads of Asia, we have seen the movements of different people and so many invasions, including Aryans.


Punjabis:

Pashtuns:

Sindhis:

Baluchis:

Kashmiris:

Hazaras (Mongols):

And some Turkic people from the north where Pakistan borders Xinjiang:

 

[PERSIAN GOD KING]

Iran is a Russian puppet,dont play the anti-imperialist game here.

Ask Russia to the Chechens(aka Muslims)

LOL. yeah because we are really controlled by russia.
You been living too much in istanbulshit.
go out and see the real world.

 

[Armstrong]

I don't think Aryan nationalism is closer to shirk bro, I will never ascribe any partner to the one & only true God. There is no doubt that Islam is extremely important to Pakistanis & it is important to me as well, but having some ethnic nationalism will aid in further increasing unity. Not everyone is Pakistan is a Muslim so focusing on only Islamic nationalism will lead them to feel left out in my opinion. A mixture of both ethnic & religious nationalism means that we focus on improving our country as much as we can & take pride in our ancestors while simultaneously being proud of our religion too.

Yea it's true Pakistan's population is a mixture of all racial groups, but I can safely say that the majority of them are mixed with Aryans even if it's to a little extent. Besides, in terms of culture & language, almost every Pakistani is an Aryan.

I am ethnic Kashmiri too, born in Lahore. Islamic nationalism is great & I support it, but I think that all nations on earth must honor their roots as well.

Another Kashmiri...! I've never met a single Kashmiri in Lahore and yet here on PDF I've come across 3 or 4, Damn !

I think ethnic nationalism will only serve to divide us further. Case in point : Barring Punjab and to a certain extent KP, look at the rest of the Provinces ? Furthermore, I as a Punjabi-Kashmiri have very little in common with a Baloch, a Sindhi and a Pathan; I don't speak their language, my heroes may not be their heroes and my culture may not be theirs. So why should they embrace me as one of their own ? Answer : Because we're Muslims; because Islamic polity is based on a common collective consciousness (Islam in other words) instead of such finite things like ethnicity and language. I belong to the Province of Punjab, Punjab has a rich culture of her own, a beautiful language of her own and I, as a son of this soil, am proud of my Province but at the same time I am extremely conscious of what Our Father taught us : You are Sindhis, Balochis, Punjabis, Pathans - they are provinces, they are units...but have you forgotten what Islam taught us 1300 years ago that whatever else you maybe you are first a Muslim and that you have carved out a territory...a vast territory. It doesn't belong to a Sindhi or a Punjabi or a Pathan, it is 'Yours'. So if you wish to galvanize yourselves into a strong nation then for God's sake give up this Provincialism.

My friend, that observation of Jinnah rings more true today then ever before. So don't go down this path of invoking ethnicity or linguistic based nationalism because it truly is a can of worms which will rip the very foundations of this nation apart. However, giving each ethnicity or linguistic group the space to express themselves, their language and their culture is perfectly agreeable because indeed 'Sindhi hum, Balochi hum, Punjabi hum, Pathan hum...' but Pakistaniyat mustn't be a collection of different ethnic nationalism but Our Common Identity as Muslims. Period.

And my friend, there is no such thing as an Aryan Nationality....its far too back into the past and the rest of us, despite having a common ancestor, have evolved into such different directions that convergence is nearly impossible. Not to mention...how are you going to break this news to the illiterate amongst us who wouldn't be able to differentiate 'Aryan' from 'Arian' !

Lastly Iqbal was right when he observed :

'In tazaa khudaaon mein baraa subb seh watan hai, jo perahan iss ka hai woh mazhaab ka qafan hai'

English : Of these new idols (or Gods) the newest is Nationalism (ethno-linguistic nationalism), for its garb is the dead shroud of Religious Unity !

 

[DRaisinHerald]

One correction, Punjabis are an heterogeneous ethnic group; you're punjabi so long you speak the Punjabi language and (to a degree) practise the Punjabi culture, despite what your "original" homeland might be. So Iqbal is no less Punjabi then those that have lived in Punjab for centuries.
Can't speak about the other ethnic groups in Pakistan.

Lastly:

“He is not one of us who calls to tribalism. He is not one of us who fights for the sake of tribalism. He is not one of us who dies following the way of tribalism.”

[Sunan Abu Dawud, Book 41, Number 5102]

Rest is up to your own interpretation, but the fruits of "tribalism" are there; one Muslim killing the other because they're supposedly inferior or different etc

 

[user1]

I don't think Aryan nationalism is closer to shirk bro, I will never ascribe any partner to the one & only true God. There is no doubt that Islam is extremely important to Pakistanis & it is important to me as well, but having some ethnic nationalism will aid in further increasing unity. Not everyone is Pakistan is a Muslim so focusing on only Islamic nationalism will lead them to feel left out in my opinion. A mixture of both ethnic & religious nationalism means that we focus on improving our country as much as we can & take pride in our ancestors while simultaneously being proud of our religion too.

Yea it's true Pakistan's population is a mixture of all racial groups, but I can safely say that the majority of them are mixed with Aryans even if it's to a little extent. Besides, in terms of culture & language, almost every Pakistani is an Aryan.




I am ethnic Kashmiri too, born in Lahore. Islamic nationalism is great & I support it, but I think that all nations on earth must honor their roots as well.

If you say that not everyone in Pakistan is a Muslim then it is also true that not everyone in Pakistan has Aryan roots. There is a sizeable population in Pakistan that ascribes it's roots to Arab diaspora, hence, Semitic and Non-Aryan, there are also plenty of people who are of Dravidian ancestry. How about people of Central Asia that came with Mughals, many of the were Mongoloid. Will these people not feel left out?

Bro, taking pride in our ancestors is what I call as 'Ancestor Worship', this is something we are not supposed to do; I will explain by 2 quick examples:

1. Prophet Ibrahim did not follow what his father wanted him to do (Idol worship as prescribed by his father). He instead told His father about the faults in idolatory.

2. When Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) started preaching in Makkah, the elders of Quraish tribe were perplexed; they said no matter how right the Prophet is, they will not let go the religion of their ancestors. They offered The Prophet great wealth to stop preaching. Prophet (PBUH) said that even if they put Sun in my one hand and Moon in other, I will still say the word of Allah.

Moral of the above two is: following our ancestors leads us astray. We should have an independent thought. That also means Question the Quran!

Talking about pride - this is what Satan did, pride is the cardinal sin.

Talking about roots (biological) - all mankind was born from a single being (Nafs). Our ancestors are from Africa, we have a single root.

Talking about Nationhood - demarcation of political boundaries is a man made system. Nation State is an idea that (according to Michael Woods - the historian) is bound to go to the dustbin of history. Anyhow will you prefer a man made system to a system prescribed by Allah (SWT)?