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Turk-Russian Approach: Russia is ready to offer joint production of Su-57 fighters to Ankara

PUTIN said this a few days ago when meet with ERDOGAN in Moscow
It can be a massive development if true. A Russian Design Aircraft with Turkish Avionics can be a Step forward for Russian Industry as well. Yes Russians are been capped hard by USA without much exposure to western hardware and technology. And i do believe Italy and UK will also collaborate with Turkish firms for Avionics development.
Russians alone cannot achieve true potential of a 5th Gen fighter alone from su57 without help of a major Western Arms Developer. Turkey can be the one. Wonder how USA Respond
As far as OP is concerned Sputnik have a bad reputation .
 
F-22 is a different story but If You compare F-35 and Su-57, I believe Su will perform better than F-35. I need analyse of an expert.
F-22A and F-35 variants are well-researched and tested VLO designs.

Su-57 is a decent bird in its own right but it is nothing like F-35 - not VLO.

Why Russia is so eager to offer joint production of Su-57 to Turkey? Cutting-edge much? Something is amiss.
 
Russians are squeezing juice out of USA. Russians are making it really difficult for USA to sell weapons along foreign policy interests.

Turks have many 5th gen options on table. They will manage good.

Not to forget China's FC-31 for other States that can't access/afford the Su 57.
 
Su-57 comes into the category of F-22 not F-35 and to be honest I consider Su-57 better than F-22 in many aspects. The only place Su-57 lacks is avionics and data link and that is where Turkey comes in. Russia needs Turkey more than Turkey needs F-35. Will make a detail analysis on Su-57 shortly and tag you we will discuss it.
This would be amusing, really.

For starters:-

RCS1.png


PAK-FA = Su-57

And watch this video:-


Conventional comparisons are meaningless.

F-22A and F-35 variants are completely different class of birds in comparison to Russian 4.5th generation Su-57.
 
This would be amusing, really.

For starters:-

RCS1.png


PAK-FA = Su-57

And watch this video:-


I will help you.

Actually what you don't understand is what 5th gen actually is?

5th gen is a doctorin and to make it simple by Turkey moving into SU-57 the Russian doctorin improves considerably. I will explain this in detail.
 
Actually what you don't understand is what 5th gen actually is?

5th gen is a doctorin and to make it simple by Turkey moving into SU-57 the Russian doctorin improves considerably. I will explain this in detail.
I understand what 5th generation is all about on a basic level to say the least. Pay attention to my 'disclosures' - they will help you.

F-22A and F-35 variants represent a revolutionary stealthy design philosophy in the domain of aerial combat whose merits cannot be [conventionally] compared with those of Su-57 in writing. Watch the video which I have posted - you will not find a better explanation.

Turkish-origin components will not transform Su-57 into a VLO design or something close. No harm in inducting Su-57 (if possible) but Turkey should prioritize its domestic TF-X project in the long-term. In other words, Turkey needs to go back to the drawing board in the absence of F-35 variants. Their is a price to pay for abandoning NATO - its perks will vanish as well.
 
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Su-57 is at best a 4++ Gen fighter
It's radar cross section is still more than the 19 years old F-22 out in the market
Their engines are over exposed
The only advantage for Turkey at present is development of their Aviation industry in case they went with Su-57 TOT
America still controls all the strings since it's the financial hub of the world
You can't Fight without money can you?
Russians & Chinese are surrounded on all sides by the Americans
NATO,Taiwan South Korea Japan India all key Allies of USA
 
It can be a massive development if true. A Russian Design Aircraft with Turkish Avionics can be a Step forward for Russian Industry as well. Yes Russians are been capped hard by USA without much exposure to western hardware and technology. And i do believe Italy and UK will also collaborate with Turkish firms for Avionics development.
Russians alone cannot achieve true potential of a 5th Gen fighter alone from su57 without help of a major Western Arms Developer. Turkey can be the one. Wonder how USA Respond
As far as OP is concerned Sputnik have a bad reputation .

Its true , a few days ago PUTIN said that Russia, Turkey have other Arms agreements in addition to S-400 deal

Russians are ready to work with Turkey for not only S400 and SU-57 but also Helicopters and Engines

top Russian aerospace concern expressed interest in developing a turbofan engine to power the TF-X
Fighter Jet .... ( British companies BAE Systems and ROLLS ROYCE interested in Turkey's TFX 5th gen Fighter Jet program )


btw Russians wants to use Turkey's soft power for export Russian weapons to Islamic World
and Russia so happy for selling weapons to one of the strongest NATO member Turkey ( that will be the prestige and advertising for Russia )

and Turkey can help Russia in top class electro-optics and avoinics for Russian platforms
even Turkey can help Russia for UAV-UCAV technology

also Turkey can play key role for Russia's security interests in Caucasia and Black Sea ( there are over 22 millions of muslim population in Russia and most of them are Turkic People ... and Turkey control Bosphorus , only gateway to the Black Sea for the US/NATO )

and PUTIN replaced Ukraine with Turkey for Russia's energy security .. ( Turkstream gas pipeline ) also Russia invest $22 billion to build the first Nuclear Power Plant in Turkey

also Russia - Turkey are together working in Syria

also Russia wants to make Turkey more stronger in the Eastern Mediterranean against the US-the EU-Israel alliance in natural gas race

win-win strategy
 
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People need to understand Turkey will either need to buy a multi-role jet NOW - or shift it's airforce operating doctorine for the next 20 years.

The Su57 (a BEAUTIFUL bird, i'm in love with the design TBH) is not production ready. If Turkey decided to setup shop for it's production AND started re-designing critical components so it will be basically a NATO compliant plane, that would take around 2 to 4 years in the best case scenario.

So in 4 or so years we would be ready to start building the Su57 for our own - BUT the engine would still need to come from Russia, and Russia is still testing the new engine with no reports as of yet on where they stand on it's certification and mass production. But for the sake of argument, let's say while we're doing our part of this endeavor Russia finishes the engine and no other setbacks are introduced.

You have to also remember that this scenario includes Russia giving a NATO member, Turkey, ALL access to the plane including the right to modify it as she pleases. Russia's brand new 5th gen jet, the jewel of her eye! BUT - for the sake of the argument, let's also say that this somehow happens.

So in 4 years we're finally ready to start mass production and if we're lucky in 1 year we'll have half a squadron, in 2 years a full squadron. In total, only 1 squadron 6 years later.

So billions of dollars later, if EVERYTHING goes to plan, and nothing bad happens, Turkey can get one squadron of SU57's that will comply with her own systems in 6 years = 2025.

But it doesn't end there. We need capable multi-role planes to fill the void of F4's and the Su57 is geared more towards air superiority, so it still doesn't scratch our itch completely.

THEN there's the issue of not having VTOL and Turkey desperately trying to outclass her neighborhood by fitting 2 ships with around 20 or so VTOL capable 5th generation planes. Russia's SU57 will be of no help there - so we lose out on that too.

And remember, this is the best case scenario where everything goes smoothly, and papa bear says "sure, here's my top plane, go nuts with it".

All of this makes no sense. Look, I love the Su57 and I think it's an incredible plane on many fronts - but it makes NO sense for Turkey to even try and buy one.

And the worst part? The billions of dollars you sunk into the Su57 "Turkey" version is essentially of no use. You can't export the plane, you can't create a meaningful new version - and even if you somehow did, you still wouldn't be able to export THAT. It's just a huge pile of money and manpower wasted and thrown away.

I personally think we should ramp up production for the Hürjet with a Russian or maybe Chinese engine and use that plane as a stop gap measure instead. In the same timeframe, we'll have 4 - 5 times the number of SU57's on our hands that are cheaper to fly and maintain - while also furthering our own industry. It will more sense as a multi-role plane and it will serve as a stop-gap solution. Upgrade the engines to a capable ~20k lb one and you're basically on par with the Gripen.

I think this would work much better then going plane shopping for incredibly high amounts of money - then transforming those planes to fit your systems - THEN transforming how your airforce operates and maintains their birds so you can include this jet and end up with a squadron or two at best. Now you have incredibly high maintenance fee's with no export capability.

Nope, Hürjet is the way to go IMHO, the other options, while look good at first glance, will hamper us in the long run. Of course we need to speed up the jet engine and MMU projects immensely and ASAP - or the Hürjet won't make a difference either.

And finally, as impossible as it seems, we need to put high priority on developing VTOL capable engines (assuming we manage to create a proper jet engine first).
 
It's time to kick Turkey out of NATO, Turkey is an unreliable partner.
 
It's time to kick Turkey out of NATO, Turkey is an unreliable partner.


traitor and terrorist supporter the US is unreliable partner

-- the US support PKK/YPG terrorists to destroy Turkey's territorial integrity for Israeli interests
-- the US support FETO terror organization to destroy Turkish government and Turkish people for Israeli interests
-- the US support Israel-Egypt-Greece alliance to steal gas-oil reserves from the Turks in the Eastern Mediterranean
-- the US attack Turkish Economy and Turkish People since 2013 ...( if not Turkey would have $1,6-1,8 trillion of GDP Nominal today )

be yourself traitor and terrorist supporter country the US .. Turks are not stupid , Turks sees everything

Americans and TRUMP should stop being lapdog of Israel , Israel says jump and Americans -TRUMP says how long sir


NATO is not the US
and NATO Secretary General RASMUSSEN said that It is enough to take a look at the map to comprehend the strategic importance of Turkey for NATO

and there is no mechanism to kick any member out of NATO
 
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su-57 is another Russian garbage, its not a true 5th gen, i dont understand why Turkish buddies cheer with this news, would you like to see a US F22 instead of a greek f16 over Egean sea after quit Nato?
 
Russia lacks the fund, and Turkey needs the 5th-generation fighter. So it will be a win-win cooperation.
 
it not only buying a weapon its changing the direction of the country. it would harm Turkey deeply. US is sole super power of our time and stay some time like so. Turkey doesnt have rich oil or minerals, we cant survive under serious embargo.
 
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