Thunder Bravo Shows It's Claws

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Agreed. Frankly I would be surprised if the PAF isn't utilizing the B block as growlers or prowlers, especially when the potential is totally there and within achievable reach. One big functionality as we've seen deployed by the usaf/usn is to make the enemy waste their missiles on fake signals put out BY those growlers feeding the enemy radars with false targets...why WOULDN'T we do that?

I am a firm believer in "surprises" from the PAF....

Looks like this a/c isn't very "ejection" friendly!!! It means the PAF pilots get their Hak to be made Helal before boarding on the craft...

 

[GumNaam]

I am a firm believer in "surprises" from the PAF....

Well the good DGISPR called Feb 27th the "surprise" day for a reason.

 

[Windjammer]

Guys remember, from the first batch of 40 F-16s ordered, 12 were 'B' models or dual seaters.
These days the so-called trainer versions are as capable as the single-seat, as they say having four eyes is better than two....specially for night time operations.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Agreed. Frankly I would be surprised if the PAF isn't utilizing the B block as growlers or prowlers, especially when the potential is totally there and within achievable reach. One big functionality as we've seen deployed by the usaf/usn is to make the enemy waste their SAMs on fake signals put out BY those growlers feeding the enemy radars with false targets, like how the Syrian Army was claiming to have shot down american planes and cruise missiles with their S300s were convincing but fake targets...why WOULDN'T we do that?

That's a good question, but as any large institution, things can move slow. This is true for the PAF as it is for USAF and the USN.

For the PAF, the priority right now might be to train lots of pilots to a high standard on the JF-17, and make sure folks (from aircrew to ground crew) are fully adept at what's already there. You don't want folks freezing in the air or making mistakes; you'd much rather a balls-to-the-wall ready crew with OK equipment than fragile ones with better gear.

Once the basis is set, then they'll move towards perfecting niche roles, such as EA/EW (which is a big step, and it may branch into needing decoys, loyal wingman drones, etc too).

It's an issue of time.

 

[GumNaam]

That's a good question, but as any large institution, things can move slow. This is true for the PAF as it is for USAF and the USN.

For the PAF, the priority right now might be to train lots of pilots to a high standard on the JF-17, and make sure folks (from aircrew to ground crew) are fully adept at what's already there. You don't want folks freezing in the air or making mistakes; you'd much rather a balls-to-the-wall ready crew with OK equipment than fragile ones with better gear.

Once the basis is set, then they'll move towards perfecting niche roles, such as EA/EW (which is a big step, and it may branch into needing decoys, loyal wingman drones, etc too).

It's an issue of time.

right, agreed. Pilots properly trained on the platform should and will always take priority.

 

[Pakistan Space Agency]

So, do we know what is happening with this particular dual seater? Is it to be inducted into PAF or will it remain a test bed?

 

[GumNaam]

So, do we know what is happening with this particular dual seater? Is it to be inducted into PAF or will it remain a test bed?

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Does anyone else notice anything different about these flight helmets? Flattish from the top with bumps or bulges in the front?

 

[Gryphon]

@HRK

I recall PAF was once testing EW pods from Indra. But, those haven't been spotted for some years now.

Old pic of JF-17A with 2× EW pods - possibly under evaluation

Could it be the case that the pods were being tested for Block-3 as it has 1-2 extra hardpoints under intakes?

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

@HRK

I recall PAF was once testing EW pods from Indra. But, those haven't been spotted for some years now.

Old pic of JF-17A with 2× EW pods - possibly under evaluation

Could it be the case that the pods were being tested for Block-3 as it has 1-2 extra hardpoints under intakes?

Those two are C-802 missiles not any EW pod.

 

[HRK]

@HRK

I recall PAF was once testing EW pods from Indra. But, those haven't been spotted for some years now.

Old pic of JF-17A with 2× EW pods - possibly under evaluation

Could it be the case that the pods were being tested for Block-3 as it has 1-2 extra hardpoints under intakes?

Possibility but I believe blk-III would hold AESA radar so it would have AESA based integrated EW/SPJ system in this case requirement for additional EW pod for blk-III would be minimal

That pic with two EW pods indicates the purpose of these are more than just self protection, therefore if they were seeking escort jamming as well as the traditional standoff jamming mission capabilities then it is a specialized role which need specialized officer at the backseat.

This thing bring JF-17B in the picture and this idea gain more weight when we see initially PAF was reluctant to induct dual seat just for training purpose but now PAF have confirm order for 26 dual seat JF-17 almost equal to half of JF-17 blk-II initial order of 50 aircraft and 1/4 of of initial order blk-I and blk-II ..... eve if we include additional order of 12 JF-17 blk-II the dual seat JF-17B would form 23% of total fleet of JF-17 [excluding bk-III]

I mean what is so special about JF-17B which aroused this much love in PAF hierarchy that they are ready to induct this much number for an aircraft which they initially refused to even consider ....???

• In strike role dual seat offer no advantage over single seat in term weapon carrying ....
• Only training could not be a justifiable excuse for this new found love of PAF for this aircraft

BTW keep in mind we have rumorses that PAF is working on indigenous EW pod as well .....

 

[khanasifm]

I am just curious what is the max load for wingtip and number 2 and 6 hardpoint ? Meaning so far it’s around 550kg with block 3 are they now able to carry 600-700 kg c-802 ?? Or others heavy weapons ?

Looking forward to news about internal fuel increase in block 3 from 200-500 litres range min.

 

[ABBASIA]

Possibility but I believe blk-III would hold AESA radar so it would have AESA based integrated EW/SPJ system in this case requirement for additional EW pod for blk-III would be minimal

That pic with two EW pods indicates the purpose of these are more than just self protection, therefore if they were seeking escort jamming as well as the traditional standoff jamming mission capabilities then it is a specialized role which need specialized officer at the backseat.

This thing bring JF-17B in the picture and this idea gain more weight when we see initially PAF was reluctant to induct dual seat just for training purpose but now PAF have confirm order for 26 dual seat JF-17 almost equal to half of JF-17 blk-II initial order of 50 aircraft and 1/4 of of initial order blk-I and blk-II ..... eve if we include additional order of 12 JF-17 blk-II the dual seat JF-17B would form 23% of total fleet of JF-17 [excluding bk-III]

I mean what is so special about JF-17B which aroused this much love in PAF hierarchy that they are ready to induct this much number for an aircraft which they initially refused to even consider ....???

• In strike role dual seat offer no advantage over single seat in term weapon carrying ....
• Only training could not be a justifiable excuse for this new found love of PAF for this aircraft

BTW keep in mind we have rumorses that PAF is working on indigenous EW pod as well .....

I think Bravo can be added with AESA radar, that definitely gives it a big punch.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

Those two are C-802 missiles not any EW pod.

Do you even know how c-802 looks like?
It has distinctive fins with large surface that almost touches the wings!
The above picture with JF-17 has jammer pods not AShM.

 

[Ultima Thule]

Do you even know how c-802 looks like?
It has distinctive fins with large surface that almost touches the wings!
The above picture with JF-17 has jammer pods not AShM.

No sir look closely these were C-802, only one jammer can be carried by single jet not 2

 

[Myth_buster_1]

No sir look closely these were C-802, only one jammer can be carried by single jet not 2

No, YOU look closely! C-802 are only carried on inner wing pylon not on the outer because of weight.

So Twin engine fighter like Growler can carry 5 jamming pods and single can only carry 1?
PAF is trying to pull a JF version of Growler and I wont be surprised if they add two additional smaller pods on wing tips which would make a perfect platform for deep strike package.