The making of the Kargil disaster Excerpts from Nasim Zehra's book, 'From Kargil To The Coup: Events

[Jackdaws]

1. Anyone who is not Muslim first is not Muslim, simple as. The Quran and Hadees are very clear about this (I can bring up evidence later if you wish). Every single practicing Muslim, no matter what nationality, regards himself as Muslim first. Ask a religious Muslim if he values his country or his religion more, he will not say country unless he is either lying or simply not a religious Muslim. Saudi Arabia is irrelevant to this discussion, since being Saudi is also a nationality, not a religion.

2. If that's how you feel, fine. I am a proud Muslim before all else and therefore people like Qasim are my heroes where as I spit on the graves of those terrible creatures that acted against Islam and Muslims, this is how Muslims should view these Islamic conquerors.

3. Exactly, he has to write using Devangari rather than a Perso-Arabic script. His culture is literally being robbed from him. Pakistan doesn't have any language disputes, we all agree that Urdu and English are the national and formal languages whilst anything else is for provincial/personal use only. And I don't see why you are talking about fragmentation when you guys view Pakistan, Bangladesh and Afghanistan as lost land. You're also probably going to lose the rest Kashmir too.

4. We are well within our rights to sacrifice whatever we damn please, and should be able to do so without regarding your sensitivities (since you hardly ever extend the same courtesy).

5. Once you've actually completed your progress, then we talk.

6. Comparing Talaq to Sati is laughable, they are not even remotely similar.

7. Yes, Muslims are underrepresented, even the ones who are not practising:

https://www.aljazeera.com/archive/2003/12/200849155257613162.html

Kalam attempted to synthesise Hinduism with his religion, that's kufr. He aided in the development of weapons of mass destruction that would be primarily be targeted at other Muslims, again, that's kufr.

A practising Muslim doesn't have to hate Hindustan full stop, but he must value his religion over his nationality and any other identity he may hold, whilst also hating any haram things that his country does, whether he is Pakistani, Hindustani, Bangladeshi, Saudi Arabian, etc. It doesn't matter, the principle applies in all cases.



You're not Muslim, you cannot be Muslim whilst being a Secularist and hating Islamic heroes like Qasim or Ghaznavi.

You're a Kafir, just accept it and stop trying to be one of us.



Everyone has an agenda when it comes to this issue, let's just look at the facts. We went, and we took Point 5353. We made gains, where as Hindustan made none (in fact, they had to rely on political pressure to force Pakistan to evict most of the 20% of Kargil it held).

We won, they lost. Simple as.



Kashmir was never going to join Pakistan, get real. The ruler was clearly going to join Hindustan, hence why he was butchering Muslims long before Pakistan invaded (he wanted to cause a major demographic change). You lost land, we only gained it.

I don't care what we claimed, the fact is it was still originally yours but we took it. You lost 10% of Kutch that was yours, end of story.

Nope. He wasn't going to. He wanted to be independent which was his right.

You lost 90% of what you thought was yours and kept claiming. So India got what was your land.

Forget just the Rann. India also controlled 3600 sq km of West Pakistan for over a year and established a post office in Chachro. It was returned to Pak after Shimla as a Goodwill gesture.

As I said, read some history.

 

[Hamza913]

You are a mushrik and a traitor to your motherland. You support invaders

LOL "Mushrik", where did that even come from?

My motherland is Jannah, Earth is just a temporary abode.

If my ancestors were against Islam, I'd take up arms against them myself. I'm not so petty and backwards that I don't take someone as my hero if they aren't from my ethnic group, at the end of the day we are all Bani Adam and as a result we are all related to each other.

Also, no, my ancestors would have almost certainly either converted to Islam and fought alongside these invaders, or some of them might actually be descended from these invaders (most probably a mix of the two).

Nope. He wasn't going to. He wanted to be independent which was his right.

You lost 90% of what you thought was yours and kept claiming. So India got what was your land.

Forget just the Rann. India also controlled 3600 sq km of West Pakistan for over a year and established a post office in Chachro. It was returned to Pak after Shimla as a Goodwill gesture.

As I said, read some history.

If he was going independent he wouldn't have tried to commit mass genocide on the Muslim population (only reason it would have been needed would be so he could join Hindustan as a Kafir majority province), nor would he have signed the instrument of accession so easily.

Nope, no matter what we claimed, we still took 10% of land that was originally yours.

Just like we gave back roughly 4,000 square km of Hindustan after 1965.

Clearly you're the one that needs to do the reading.

 

[Corona]

1. Anyone who is not Muslim first is not Muslim, simple as. The Quran and Hadees are very clear about this (I can bring up evidence later if you wish). Every single practicing Muslim, no matter what nationality, regards himself as Muslim first. Ask a religious Muslim if he values his country or his religion more, he will not say country unless he is either lying or simply not a religious Muslim. Saudi Arabia is irrelevant to this discussion, since being Saudi is also a nationality, not a religion.

2. If that's how you feel, fine. I am a proud Muslim before all else and therefore people like Qasim are my heroes where as I spit on the graves of those terrible creatures that acted against Islam and Muslims, this is how Muslims should view these Islamic conquerors.

3. Exactly, he has to write using Devangari rather than a Perso-Arabic script. His culture is literally being robbed from him. Pakistan doesn't have any language disputes, we all agree that Urdu and English are the national and formal languages whilst anything else is for provincial/personal use only. And I don't see why you are talking about fragmentation when you guys view Pakistan, Bangladesh and Afghanistan as lost land. You're also probably going to lose the rest Kashmir too.

4. We are well within our rights to sacrifice whatever we damn please, and should be able to do so without regarding your sensitivities (since you hardly ever extend the same courtesy).

5. Once you've actually completed your progress, then we talk.

6. Comparing Talaq to Sati is laughable, they are not even remotely similar.

7. Yes, Muslims are underrepresented, even the ones who are not practising:

https://www.aljazeera.com/archive/2003/12/200849155257613162.html

Kalam attempted to synthesise Hinduism with his religion, that's kufr. He aided in the development of weapons of mass destruction that would be primarily be targeted at other Muslims, again, that's kufr.

A practising Muslim doesn't have to hate Hindustan full stop, but he must value his religion over his nationality and any other identity he may hold, whilst also hating any haram things that his country does, whether he is Pakistani, Hindustani, Bangladeshi, Saudi Arabian, etc. It doesn't matter, the principle applies in all cases.

1) I can appreciate the unifying effect your religion is trying to implement but reality is, two people separated by miles, continents and oceans will not see eye to eye in everything because of circumstances. Humanity hasn't achieved a level of consistency where someone in Africa has the same worries, fears and wishes as someone in Europe. Easy to write off someone as a bad Muslim when you have no clue about his circumstances.

2) You can be proud of whoever you want, but provoking others is an entirely different matter. If you can't be proud of someone without demeaning and vilifying others, then the person you're proud of must be lacking in merits on his own.

3) Correction, Pakistan hasn't had any language disputes after 1971. I've already explained the situation about languages in my previous post, but I'll try to make things a bit more clear.

We could theoretically give Muslims a common language. What'll it be?

• Urdu for the Muslims in Hyderabad?
• Malayalam for the Muslims in Kerala?
• Bengali for the worshipers in Bengal?
• Tamil for the folks in Tamil Nadu?
• Did you know 90% of the population of Lakshadweep Islands are Muslims and they only speak Mahl. So will it be Mahl?
• Gujarati for Muslims in Gujarat?
• Sindhi for the few folks that speak it?

Shall I go on? Know that the people in these states probably don't know any of the other languages I've listed here.

4) & 6) I might want to draw a pentagram on the floor, light candles and sacrifice a virgin for the glory of Satan, but I won't cause it's against the law. I can cry religion and unfair all I want, but saner heads will still stop me. The rules that stop me from doing something so stupid is not designed to infringe my personal religious views, but to protect other people, their views and their sentiments. Again, if I have to take a hit for the greater good, then so be it.

Maybe in Pakistan, the homeland for Muslims and only Muslims, you don't have to consider other's feelings. In India, you enjoy the same rights as everyone else and follow the rules. If the rules of a state say you can't kill an animal, then you don't. Besides, I never said Muslims are completely banned from killing cows. They probably do sacrifice cows in those states where killing cows are still legal.

5) It's not a switch you just turn on mate. Hopefully, we'll be able to talk sooner rather than later.

7) 'Aljazeera', wasn't that the news group that was banned and ostracized by the entire Muslim community of Middle East for harboring terrorist ideology, antisemitism and generally p*ss poor journalistic competency?

On topic, what you describe as synthesis, we describe as common courtesy, open mindedness and acceptance. They were the reasons he was so loved.

I can only deduce narcissism if you think those weapons were specifically tailored to you. Yes some of those weapons are aimed at Pakistan, but that's probably cause of all the wars we fought in the past and not because you're Muslims. But if I entertain your opinion for even a second, you're guilty of what you accuse Kalam of too. You guys have developed missiles and bombs that will kill 200 million Muslims in India. You said it yourself, "It doesn't matter, the principle applies in all cases"
Isn't that the pot calling the kettle kufr?

 

[Indus Priest King]

Who is the admin here? And wtf is he doing? This entire forum is a joke.

 

[Hamza913]

1) I can appreciate the unifying effect your religion is trying to implement but reality is, two people separated by miles, continents and oceans will not see eye to eye in everything because of circumstances. Humanity hasn't achieved a level of consistency where someone in Africa has the same worries, fears and wishes as someone in Europe. Easy to write off someone as a bad Muslim when you have no clue about his circumstances.

2) You can be proud of whoever you want, but provoking others is an entirely different matter. If you can't be proud of someone without demeaning and vilifying others, then the person you're proud of must be lacking in merits on his own.

3) Correction, Pakistan hasn't had any language disputes after 1971. I've already explained the situation about languages in my previous post, but I'll try to make things a bit more clear.

We could theoretically give Muslims a common language. What'll it be?

• Urdu for the Muslims in Hyderabad?
• Malayalam for the Muslims in Kerala?
• Bengali for the worshipers in Bengal?
• Tamil for the folks in Tamil Nadu?
• Did you know 90% of the population of Lakshadweep Islands are Muslims and they only speak Mahl. So will it be Mahl?
• Gujarati for Muslims in Gujarat?
• Sindhi for the few folks that speak it?

Shall I go on? Know that the people in these states probably don't know any of the other languages I've listed here.

4) & 6) I might want to draw a pentagram on the floor, light candles and sacrifice a virgin for the glory of Satan, but I won't cause it's against the law. I can cry religion and unfair all I want, but saner heads will still stop me. The rules that stop me from doing something so stupid is not designed to infringe my personal religious views, but to protect other people, their views and their sentiments. Again, if I have to take a hit for the greater good, then so be it.

Maybe in Pakistan, the homeland for Muslims and only Muslims, you don't have to consider other's feelings. In India, you enjoy the same rights as everyone else and follow the rules. If the rules of a state say you can't kill an animal, then you don't. Besides, I never said Muslims are completely banned from killing cows. They probably do sacrifice cows in those states where killing cows are still legal.

5) It's not a switch you just turn on mate. Hopefully, we'll be able to talk sooner rather than later.

7) 'Aljazeera', wasn't that the news group that was banned and ostracized by the entire Muslim community of Middle East for harboring terrorist ideology, antisemitism and generally p*ss poor journalistic competency?

On topic, what you describe as synthesis, we describe as common courtesy, open mindedness and acceptance. They were the reasons he was so loved.

I can only deduce narcissism if you think those weapons were specifically tailored to you. Yes some of those weapons are aimed at Pakistan, but that's probably cause of all the wars we fought in the past and not because you're Muslims. But if I entertain your opinion for even a second, you're guilty of what you accuse Kalam of too. You guys have developed missiles and bombs that will kill 200 million Muslims in India. You said it yourself, "It doesn't matter, the principle applies in all cases"
Isn't that the pot calling the kettle kufr?

1. Don't care, we were unified for quite a while under the first 2 Caliphates and for a significant portion of the 3rd one. Even after that, you had Muslims of multiple ethnic groups all fight together for the same cause, i.e to spread Islam (for example, Mahmud Ghaznavi employed large numbers of Turks, Pashtuns, Punjabis and Persians into his military).

2. I only vilify those who are villains, and these old rulers who fought against Muslims certainly count as villains, considering they burnt their wives and what not.

3. 1971 was far more than just language. Muslims can speak whatever language they like, but they shouldn't be using Devangari when a Perso-Arabic script is available. They only use Devangari because they live in Hindustan where they haven't been brought up to understand Islam is more than just a personal belief system (well, most of them anyway).

4. Irrelevant, Muslims shouldn't be banned from doing the halal, and if we are, we should stand up for ourselves.

5. Funny, you guys don't seem to remember that when you criticise us about treating minorities.

6. You skipped a number.

7. Al Jazeera is pretty decent, but they have their problems like all media companies. If you want another source you can easily find one for yourself.

That logic doesn't work, because Hindustan is still overwhelmingly a Kafir country, and we've welcomed Hindustani Muslims with open arms to come here, if they choose not to we have no other choice, we must defend ourselves and we take priority since Pakistan has more Muslims both in terms of raw numbers and as a percentage.

 

[Corona]

1. Don't care, we were unified for quite a while under the first 2 Caliphates and for a significant portion of the 3rd one. Even after that, you had Muslims of multiple ethnic groups all fight together for the same cause, i.e to spread Islam (for example, Mahmud Ghaznavi employed large numbers of Turks, Pashtuns, Punjabis and Persians into his military).

2. I only vilify those who are villains, and these old rulers who fought against Muslims certainly count as villains, considering they burnt their wives and what not.

3. 1971 was far more than just language. Muslims can speak whatever language they like, but they shouldn't be using Devangari when a Perso-Arabic script is available. They only use Devangari because they live in Hindustan where they haven't been brought up to understand Islam is more than just a personal belief system (well, most of them anyway).

4. Irrelevant, Muslims shouldn't be banned from doing the halal, and if we are, we should stand up for ourselves.

5. Funny, you guys don't seem to remember that when you criticise us about treating minorities.

6. You skipped a number.

7. Al Jazeera is pretty decent, but they have their problems like all media companies. If you want another source you can easily find one for yourself.

That logic doesn't work, because Hindustan is still overwhelmingly a Kafir country, and we've welcomed Hindustani Muslims with open arms to come here, if they choose not to we have no other choice, we must defend ourselves and we take priority since Pakistan has more Muslims both in terms of raw numbers and as a percentage.

1) The caliphates were pretty much unobstructed continuous landmass politically. It functioned as a single country. Most importantly, it was at the dawn of Islam and I don't think there were many Muslims outside the caliphates at that time. It's different now, we have multiple Muslim nations each with its own priorities.

2) You vilify those who are villains by your definition. Atrocities were committed by all sides involved.

3) You've answered your own question here, "Muslims can speak whatever language they like" and "They only use Devangari because they live in Hindustan". If you think Muslims should have the right to speak whichever language they want (a right that is available to them in India), shouldn't that include Devanagiri scripts? It's not like Islam says you have to speak one and only one particular language like your Perso-Arabic script. Seems to me it's a question of convenience rather than anything else.

4) Halal isn't limited to beef right?

5) Saner minds will. We all want to live good, prosperous, peaceful lives.

6) No I didn't, I combined 4) and 6) in my last post since they were on similar grounds.

7) Your argument here makes it look like you're just hurt they didn't accept your invitation. They may not be Muslims from your side of the border, but as far as the rest of the world is concerned, they are perfectly fine normal Muslims.

 

[Indus Priest King]

Let's discuss the ground realities of what happened here:

Kargil peaks captured by Pakistan in 1999

• Point 5353
• Point Aftab-I
• Point Saddle Ridge
• Point Bunker Ridge
• Shangruti
• Tiger Hill
  
• Dhalunag

Kargil peaks still under Pakistani control as of 2018

• 
  
  
  • Point 5353
  • Point Aftab-I
  • Point Saddle Ridge
  • Point Bunker Ridge
  • Shangruti
  • Dhalunag

Pakistan still occupies key Drass point
By Praveen Swami

PAKISTAN soldiers perched at peak 5353, on the strategic Marpo La Ridge had a grandstand view of this year's Vijay Diwas celebrations, marking the official end of the Kargil war. At least some of them must had wry smiles on their faces, for although peak 5353 metres is inside the Indian side of the Line of Control (LoC), Pakistani troops held the mountain through the Kargil war and continue to do so today.

Artillery observers on peak 5353 metres can direct accurate artillery fire on to up to 20 km of the National Highway 1A, and cripple Indian defensive positions from Mushkoh to Bhimbet. Indian troops are being forced to compensate for this tactical blunder by engaging in a series of operations in the Batalik sector.

Pakistani occupation of point 5353 means Operation Vijay's core objective in Drass, securing the highway, in effect failed. Officials in New Delhi attempt to argue that point 5353 is in an ambiguous location on the Line of Control, and that there are two peaks of the same height which are being confused, claims debunked by copies of the Army's own maps which are in Business Line's possession.

Senior Army commanders in Drass are just as evasive. Asked if Pakistan was indeed in occupation of the peak, 8 Mountain Division Commander Major General Satnam Singh replied that it was ''too early to say''. Asked again, Gen. Singh said he would ''provide authentic information'' during this correspondent's ''next trip''. The strange story of peak 5353 began with the end of Operation Vijay, and the proclamation of a national triumph at Kargil.

Point 5353, like the features around it, had been occupied by Pakistani troops at the start of the Kargil war. Indian soldiers, however, were nowhere near its summit when hostilities were pronounced to have ended. All that had been achieved was the occupation of two secondary positions on the Marpo La ridge line, Charlie 6 and Charlie 7. Pakistani troops also remained on point 5240, some 1200 metres as the crow flies from point 5353. 56 Brigade Commander Amar Aul, in charge of the operations to secure point 5353, responded by occupying two heights on the Pakistani side of the LoC, 4875 and 4251, just before the ceasefire came into force.

Com. Aul's tactics, evidently under political pressure to bring about as quick an end to hostilities as possible, were designed to secure a subsequent territorial exchange. In mid-August, 1999, his efforts to bring about a deal bore fruit. Extended negotiations between the Brigadier and a Pakistani interlocutor, who called himself Colonel Saqlain, led to both sides committing themselves to leave points 5353, 5240, 4251 and 4875 unoccupied.

Both Indian and Pakistani troops were now pulled back to their pre-Kargil position, leaving an arial distance of about a kilometre between the armies along most of the Marpo La ridge. The deal wasn't ideal, for point 5353 was of enormously more strategic importance to India than either 4251 or 4875 were for Pakistan, but it was better than nothing.

Towards the end of October, things began to go horribly wrong. Commander Aul tasked the 16 Grenadiers to take point 5240 and the 1-3 Gurkha Rifles to occupy 5353, choosing to violate the August agreement rather than risk the prospect that Pakistan might reoccupy these positions again. While the 16 Grenadiers attack proceeded as planned, despite bad weather, the 1-3 Gurkha Rifles, for reasons which are still not clear, never made their way up 5353. When Pakistani troops detected the Indian presence on 52 40, they promptly launched a counter assault on 5353. Seven days later, in early November, the Grenadiers unit on 5240 watched Pakistan take up positions on the more important peak.

Pakistan moved rapidly to consolidate its position on 5353. Concrete bunkers came up on the peak, and a road was constructed to the base of the peak from Benazir Post, Pakistan's most important permanent position in the area. In the meanwhile, Commander Aul considered plans to retake the peak. He didn't have much choice. India's positions on 5240 were under threat, along with positions of the 2 Naga in Mushkoh, the 2 Grenadiers in Drass, and the 8 Sikh in Bhimbet. Offensives were discussed in January an d February this year, and again in May and August, but had to be abandoned each time because of the risks involved.

With 5353 and its adjoining area now linked by road to Pakistan's rear headquarters at Gultari, and defensive positions heavily fortified, any frontal attack would mean a full-blown resumption of hostilities in Drass.

The Army's tactics in Kargil now appear to centre around forcing a territorial swap for 5353. The worst of the fighting has come in the Batalik area, to the east of Kargil, where Indian troops have been ordered to take any unoccupied positions they discover on the Pakistan side of the LoC.

In one such operation on April 8, a company of the 14 Sikh Regiment occupied point 5310, an unheld peak roughly one kilometre air distance on the Pakistan side of the LoC. Subedar Bhatnam Singh and one soldier were killed in an avalanche during the operation.

Pakistan retaliation has been prompt. On the night of July 27, a group of 24 porters and four soldiers carrying material for an offensive from Gol Tekri to Rock Fall, facing the key Chorbat La range, were ambushed by Pakistani troops or irregulars. One porter was killed, and three are still missing, presumed dead. There is little doubt that the Pakistani ambush was laid deep in Indian territory for Kalashnikov empties, with a short range, were recovered from the ambush site. The incident followed the destruction, in May, of a new Pakistani post with a shoulder-held missile.

While the Union Government's propaganda on the Kargil War has allowed it to score propaganda points, the end of the conflict is, clearly, not quite yet in sight.

Quotes

• "Pakistan is occupying at least six strategically located Indian peaks in the Kargil sector along the Line of Control" - Rajya Sabha member & senior criminal advocate R K Anand. (30 August 2000)

• "Point 5353 is very strategic. In 1992-93, the then corps commander (of India) decided to make a shift pocket on this point and sent personnel there by helicopter. The officers posted there successfully cut off the entire supply to the Pakistani pockets along the LoC for nearly two months."...he said the Indian Army then claimed that point 5353 is "within our LoC and that we have every right to patrol the area." - Rajya Sabha member & senior criminal advocate R K Anand. (30 August 2000)

• "Indian troops had tried to capture Point 5353 on May 18, 1999 when army operations were beginning in Operation Vijay in Kargil last year. But it failed...the operation was carried out by a team of soldiers led by Major Navneet Mehta."..."It is not possible to carry out an assault from the northwestern, western and south western approaches,"..."attack on 5353 called off due to bad weather" and that "13 OR (other ranks) injured in Maj Navneet's Pl (platoon) due to difficult trn (terrain)". - Rajya Sabha member & senior criminal advocate R K Anand. (30 August 2000)

• "If the army's argument that Point 5353 was never India's is to be accepted, then why did they launch the attack?" - Rajya Sabha member & senior criminal advocate R K Anand. (30 August 2000)

• "It looks like our army commanders are wrongly briefing the defence minister," he said when Fernandes' statement was pointed out. "The defence minister mislead Parliament on the basis of the briefing by army officers," Anand said, while demanding action against senior army commanders. - Rajya Sabha member & senior criminal advocate R K Anand. (30 August 2000)

Sources

1. 'Commander ordered capture of Point 5353 in Kargil war', By Praveen Swami. NEW DELHI, 29 June 2000 - THE HINDU
2. 'Pakistan still occupies key Drass point', by Praveen Swami. DRASS, 10 August 2000 - THE HINDU
3. 'Fact and fiction on Point 5353; The defence establishment's response to the controversy over Point 5353 plumbs new depths' by Praveen Swami. 30 September 2000 - FRONTLINE
4. ‘6 Kargil heights in Pak control’. NEW DELHI, 30 August 2000 - Tribune India
5. 'Pakistan occupying six Indian peaks, claims MP' by Josy Joseph. NEW DELHI, 30 August 2000 - REDIFF
6. 'Not convinced we won Kargil: Lt Gen Kishan Pal to NDTV' by Nitin Gokhale. NEW DELHI 31 May 2010 00:36 IST - NDTV
7. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/904482.stm
8. http://www.ipcs.org/event-report/3r...india-revises-time-frame-of-war/1/254326.html
9. https://www.telegraphindia.com/1020828/asp/frontpage/story_1144073.asp

 

[MSafir]

Point 5353 is exactly on the LOC on No man' line and under Pak control. I have spoken about this to many of my friends.
In retaliation, Indian army captured point 5310 which is not on LOC but our side of LOC and it gives them tactical advantage of controlling 12 sqkm on Our side.

Problem starts with pt 5070 and pt5240 which are also held by Indians just 1 km away from pt 5353 seeing the supply line to pt 5353. And we have no other peak in the surrounding held by or infantry. So in case of skirmish they can not only just cut off but also stop the way return.

Pt 5353 is held only because of one reason, that is to observe what Indians are upto . Tactically it can't carry out operations.

 

[Indus Priest King]

LOL here's another Sanghi posing as a Pakistani....

Point 5353 is exactly on the LOC and under Pak control. I have spoken about this to many of my friends. Even there exists wikipedia page on this peak

It's not on the LoC, it's within Indian territory and was captured by Pakistan. Did you even bother reading the sources I posted above? And I don't care about your friends. Who are you or your friends? Nobody. Provide evidence. Wikipedia isn't evidence either...it just claims what the Indians are saying that it lies on the LoC, despite the fact Parveen Swami has military maps from the 1970s which show that it was well within Indian territory

In retaliation, Indian army captured point 5310 which is not on LOC but our side of LOC and it gives them tactical advantage of controlling 12 sqkm on Our side

Wrong. Where's your evidence?

Problem starts with pt 5070 and pt5240 which are also held by Indians just 1 km away from pt 5353 seeing the supply line to pt 5353. And we have no other peak in the surrounding held by or infantry. So in case of skirmish they can not only just cut off but also stop the way return.

Point 5353 is the highest peak in Kargil you twit. What are you even talking about?

Parveen Swami writes "for point 5353 was of enormously more strategic importance to India than either 4251 or 4875 were for Pakistan, but it was better than nothing."

Pt 5353 is held only because of one reason, that is to observe what Indians are upto . Tactically it can't carry out operations.

Artillery observers on Point 5353 can direct accurate artillery fire on to up to 20 km of the National Highway 1A, and cripple Indian defensive positions from Mushkoh to Bhimbet. Indian troops tried to compensate for this tactical blunder by engaging in a series of operations in the Batalik sector but failed miserably.




Go eat a steak.

 

[MSafir]

LOL here's another Sanghi posing as a Pakistani....



It's not on the LoC, it's within Indian territory and was captured by Pakistan. Did you even bother reading the sources I posted above? And I don't care about your friends. Who are you or your friends? Nobody. Provide evidence. Wikipedia isn't evidence either...it just claims what the Indians are saying that it lies on the LoC, despite the fact Parveen Swami has military maps from the 1970s which show that it was well within Indian territory



Wrong. Where's your evidence?



Point 5353 is the highest peak in Kargil you twit. What are you even talking about?

Parveen Swami writes "for point 5353 was of enormously more strategic importance to India than either 4251 or 4875 were for Pakistan, but it was better than nothing."



Artillery observers on Point 5353 can direct accurate artillery fire on to up to 20 km of the National Highway 1A, and cripple Indian defensive positions from Mushkoh to Bhimbet. Indian troops tried to compensate for this tactical blunder by engaging in a series of operations in the Batalik sector but failed miserably.




Go eat a steak.

Behave!

I just googled. That's point 5353 and google says it's on no man's line. But does it matter whether it's on LOC or Their territory? We have it in our possession as an Observation post.

 

[Indus Priest King]

Behave!

I just googled. That's point 5353 and google says it's on no man's line. But does it matter whether it's on LOC or Their territory? We have it in our possession as an Observation post. View attachment 484356

I just googled it as well and found nothing. Why are you lying? How were you able to find Point 5353 if Google Maps doesn't even label it to begin with? Did you just randomly put in some coordinates you found at BoycottSteak.com?

Show me your source.

And if it's in India's control, why this news clip from 2011 then?

 

[SMC]

Who is the admin here? And wtf is he doing? This entire forum is a joke.

I think the logic is to let bharatis spew as much BS as they can in order to attract more bharatis to this forum and make this forum more popular. But it looks like a circus to someone looking at it for the first time.

 

[MSafir]

I just googled it as well and found nothing. Why are you lying? How were you able to find Point 5353 if Google Maps doesn't even label it to begin with? Did you just randomly put in some coordinates you found at ?

Show me your source.

And if it's in India's control, why this news clip from 2011 then?

Kid
search this 34°31′30.10″N 75°41′55.31″E
Pt5353 is on the LOC.

marker can be deleted but coordinates can't be are you deleting the maker on google maps to prove your point? HaHA you are caught manipulating.
.

Who are you or your friends?

my gf's cousin they are in army

 

[doorstar]

Point 5353 is exactly on the LOC on No man' line and under Pak control. I have spoken about this to many of my friends.
In retaliation, Indian army captured point 5310 which is not on LOC but our side of LOC and it gives them tactical advantage of controlling 12 sqkm on Our side.

Problem starts with pt 5070 and pt5240 which are also held by Indians just 1 km away from pt 5353 seeing the supply line to pt 5353. And we have no other peak in the surrounding held by or infantry. So in case of skirmish they can not only just cut off but also stop the way return.

Pt 5353 is held only because of one reason, that is to observe what Indians are upto . Tactically it can't carry out operations.

this is exactly what it says on wikibloodypedia, you're no better than his highness the googly king scholar

No
I found out the contours of that exact coordinate and that peak was the only one which which is above 5300m so its has to be pt5353 and which is well within the no man's land and on LOC. This only proves our illegal occupation to be honest. which I did not want to say.

@Horus @WebMaster @waz @The Eagle @Jungibaaz @Slav Defence I do realise that I am not the flavour of the month with the bosses here at the moment, but please do come and check out this new "Pakistani"

 

[Jugger]

My motherland is Jannah, Earth is just a temporary abode.

Got you ...!
I always thought that there is something odd in your posts, it’s like talking to a jihadi terrorist...LOL.!!
Now there is no doubt.
You end of world jihadis are the reason for the misery of the entire Muslim world including Pakistan.

Please go to jannah very quickly preferable alone..!
Leave earth (“temporary abode”) to us humans and get your angel A** to heaven ASAP.