The expanding Shiite Crescent

[Armstrong]

So you want to nuke Iran? Grow up and talk sense. Don't just keep blabbering.

And your Air Force, Army and Navy could take out Iran in 3 days Max??? Really? As I said you need to grow up and stop uttering baloney. It makes you look silly.

Okay maybe 3 & a half days !

 

[Dillinger]

Nahhhh...why waste our precious nukes on something that is already destroyed & another who seems hell bent on getting there.



A political difference that metamorphed into a doctrinal one; Shias think that there are 12 infallible Imams who were appointed by God to guide the Muslims after the Prophet (PBUH) 's death in all matters of religion & state, starting from Ali ibn Abi Talib (the 3rd Caliph of Islam & the First Imam for the Shias) & that Ali should have been the First Caliph & the other 3 are usurpers. Sunnis on the other hand think that Islam has no concept of Immate but that it teaches 'democracy' in matters of faith & state & no order of ecclesiastics never mind an infallible imam has a place in our spiritual or political discourse. Furthermore Sunnis think that the first 3 Caliphs should have been & were rightly the first 3 & they along with Ali were the 4 Caliphs who were worth anything at all & weren't the monarchs styling themselves as the Caliphs as it happened later.

Naturally both the Shias & the Sunnis think that the other is in error or has gone completely bonkers. Naturally both have their own set of Hadith & Scholarly works to support their point of view.

I've noticed that even in here the Sunnis and the Shias maintain distance..no violence but there always this divide. Even the sunni muslims in my CA class were unwilling to mix up with their Shia counterparts. Although the Shias here are marginally better of economically...mostly in the business community along with the Bohras.

Still makes no sense. You're still worshiping only Allah and following the words of Muhammad, or is it like a protestant catholic thing?

If you don't mind me asking, which one are you?

 

[KingMamba]

I know..too much love though can be restrictive and a turn-off.

What happens when Iran goes nuclear though? Americans are losing their touch bro, time was you guys would bomb any offending nation to bits..but now....remember agent orange IF there are tensions between the two nations then Iran will gain quite a margin of parity with Pakistan in relative terms.

Enhh...there have been wars over this and even you don't know the difference?

The people are tired of war here some are outright asking why the zionists dont go it alone and besides Iran wont make the bomb anyway I believe some compromise will be made on that front.

As for Pakistan if Iran went nuclear yes it would create parity but I am talking currently and currently Pakistan would beat Iran.

No I know the differences and it is complex. What @Armstrong has described is just 12er shiaism and only make up half the shias in the world. There are other doctrines as well. Bro half my family is shia these talks happen over dinner all the time although my immediate family is all Sunni.

 

[Dillinger]

Okay maybe 3 & a half days !

Bomb Persia and the Immortals will get you! YOU personally Butt sahib..your lard *** will make a big target.

Historically which side has Pakistan leaned to? Currently I see a Pak-Iran pipeline in the works so why the animosity?

 

[KingMamba]

Bomb Persia and the Immortals will get you! YOU personally Butt sahib..your lard *** will make a big target.

Historically which side has Pakistan leaned to? Currently I see a Pak-Iran pipeline in the works so why the animosity?

Pakistan had always been non sectarian until a certain general came along.

 

[Pakistanisage]

@ Dillinger what ^^^ he says is maybe 50% is right, we don't believe Imams are appointed by God. If you want to know the difference you should try to read neutral sources. You don't go to a Christian to learn Islam. why go to a Sunni to learn Shia Islam? Much of what is written about Shia Islam comes from Sunni Muslim with huge biased. There are numerous books about Shia Muslim but most of the authors got their education in Saudi Arabia or from Sunni muslims..! Why not go to source itself like Qom or Najaf?

Qom and Najaf, the true bastion of Neutral unbiased Opinions....

 

[iranigirl2]

I've noticed that even in here the Sunnis and the Shias maintain distance..no violence but there always this divide. Even the sunni muslims in my CA class were unwilling to mix up with their Shia counterparts. Although the Shias here are marginally better of economically...mostly in the business community along with the Bohras.

Still makes no sense. You're still worshiping only Allah and following the words of Muhammad, or is it like a protestant catholic thing?

If you don't mind me asking, which one are you?

Shias follow Prophet Muhammad and his family. It's clearly stated in the Quran and by many historical evidence that he designated his adopted son, son-in law and cousin named ALI to be the leader after his death.

 

[Dillinger]

The people are tired of war here some are outright asking why the zionists dont go it alone and besides Iran wont make the bomb anyway I believe some compromise will be made on that front.

As for Pakistan if Iran went nuclear yes it would create parity but I am talking currently and currently Pakistan would beat Iran.

No I know the differences and it is complex. What @Armstrong has described is just 12er shiaism and only make up half the shias in the world. There are other doctrines as well. Bro half my family is shia these talks happen over dinner all the time although my immediate family is all Sunni.

IF they aren't making the bomb then lift the damn sanctions...we need them to start up a trade transit route with the Russians. Promise we won't egg em' on to make nukes in the future. Oh man, I have friends who are shias and sunnis..I just get out of their vicinity whenever these talks start up since I am out of my depth..ergo my ignorance on the matter.

WHAT makes you so confident that they won't build nukes? I am a big Israel supporter and all and even KSA since our relations are improving vastly but its not as IF Iran will go all nuke holocaust the minute they go nuclear.

 

[Armstrong]

I've noticed that even in here the Sunnis and the Shias maintain distance..no violence but there always this divide. Even the sunni muslims in my CA class were unwilling to mix up with their Shia counterparts. Although the Shias here are marginally better of economically...mostly in the business community along with the Bohras.

Yup thats the case the world over not the maintaining distance thing because we all have Shia-Sunni friends & best friends and you'd find many Sunnis & Shiites intermarrying with one another but yes that un-said...un-written divide is there; its too bad that neither the Shias & the Sunnis grew up despite repeated attempts by so many people in the past to bring about a reproachment between the two & telling them how foOking deluded the both of them are. Even Jinnah & Iqbal tried to rectify this BS but did it happen - Hell no !

Still makes no sense. You're still worshiping only Allah and following the words of Muhammad, or is it like a protestant catholic thing?

Same God, same Koran, Same Ka'bah, Same Prophet....every thing's the same its the indirect sources of religious knowledge that created this schism.....everyone comes up with their own version of history, sayings & doings of the Prophet (PBUH) & refuses to believe the other - In the end the Koran gets sidelined whilst it becomes a duel about my Hadith & my Scholar versus yours.

If you don't mind me asking, which one are you?

Hate either label but Sunni would be technically correct if a label has to attached.

 

[iranigirl2]

Qom and Najaf, the true bastion of Neutral unbiased Opinions....

To understand Shia Islam you should go to their school.

If I wanted to learn Sunni Islam I would go to a Sunni school.

If I wanted to learn Christianity I would go to a Christian school.

If I wanted to learn Hinduism I would go to their school!

It makes sense! You are not a spokes person for Shia Muslims and your Wahhabi sources are Biased and almost genocidal towards Shia Muslims.

 

[KingMamba]

Shias follow Prophet Muhammad and his family. It's clearly stated in the Quran and by many historical evidence that he designated his adopted son, son-in law and cousin named ALI to be the leader after his death.

Wrong, no such reference in the Quran. The split is based on Hadith mostly.

 

[Armstrong]

Bomb Persia and the Immortals will get you! YOU personally Butt sahib..your lard *** will make a big target.

Historically which side has Pakistan leaned to? Currently I see a Pak-Iran pipeline in the works so why the animosity?

Let them Come...let the Immortals come....I'd make a wall out of them & some of my lard still !

Historically Pakistan has tried to stay neutral because historically we've been very well-integrated with each other, friends & families are often divided into Shias & Sunnis so, historically, it was never a problem. Until the Iranians & the Saudis started getting naughty after the Iranian Revolution & thats when the sh*t hit the ceiling - Between the Shia Militants like the SSM & the Tehreek-i-Jafriya & the Sunni Militants like the SSP & the LeJ scores of Shias & Sunnis were killed in the '90s & early '00s before it became more of a one-sided contest in the present. They did the same all over the Muslim world where the Government was an absolute sell-out & more than enough basteerd clerics could be found.

 

[Dillinger]

@Yzd Khalifa What's KSA's and your opinion on this?

 

[iranigirl2]

Wrong, no such reference in the Quran. The split is based on Hadith mostly.

Ahlul Bayt have been delineated in the Quran (Surah 33, Ayah 33) and purified by Allah (Most High) from sin, religious error, or forgetfulness (Ismah). Ahlul Bayt consist of Muhammad (pbuh), his daughter Fatima, his son-in-law and cousin Ali, and his two grandchildren Al-Hasan and Al-Husain. And of the progeny of Al-Husain are the nine designated Imams: Zainul Abideen, Al-Baaqir, Al-Saadiq, Al-Kadhim, Al-Ridha, Al-Taqi, Al-Haadi, Al-Askari, and Al-Mahdi —may peace be with them all.


QURAN PURIFIES AHLUL BAYT: التطهير

Al‑Ahzaab, Surah 33, Ayah 33.


إِنَّمَا يُرِيدُ اللَّهُ لِيُذْهِبَ عَنكُمُ الرِّجْسَ

أَهْلَ الْبَيْتِ وَيُطَهِّرَكُمْ تَطْهِيرًا

“Verily, Allah has decreed to purify you, O' Ahlul Bayt, and sanctify you in a perfect way”


Source:http://www.islamicbooks.info/H-21-Math'habs/Quran-Ahlul-6.htm

 

[Armstrong]

The people are tired of war here some are outright asking why the zionists dont go it alone and besides Iran wont make the bomb anyway I believe some compromise will be made on that front.

As for Pakistan if Iran went nuclear yes it would create parity but I am talking currently and currently Pakistan would beat Iran.

No I know the differences and it is complex. What @Armstrong has described is just 12er shiaism and only make up half the shias in the world. There are other doctrines as well. Bro half my family is shia these talks happen over dinner all the time although my immediate family is all Sunni.

Twelers & the Zaidis both believe in Immate & so do the Bohras & Ismailis & they'd probably constituted more than 90% of all Shiites everywhere with the Twelvers being in the overwhelming majority; the Zaidis are actually quite close to Sunni Islam & both the Bohras & Ismailis are very different than orthodox Islam whether Sunni or Shiite.