The enemy and Pakistan Army

[Rig Vedic]

From the day we are born to the day we die, we cry out for our Pak wattan, and support the Pakistani army.

Pak Fauj Zindabad!

from the day you are born to the day you die, are you ever going to think for yourself.

 

[vsdoc]

We have regimental battle cries for most of our regiments man.

 

[Joe Shearer]

I think I have hurt Joe Shearer's feelings.

Out of anyone else, he should realize that a jest is a jest.


So I would like to apologize to Mr. Shearer if he found any of my posts obscenely offensive.


Sorry Sir.


Although you are an Indian, You are still my senior.

My father, since you raised his memory in a very strange fashion, was born in a poor family and got into his imperial service due to excellent performance in the relevant competitive examination. Both General, later Field Marshal Cariappa and Col., later General Osmany were personal friends. Every GOC-in-C East from 'Bogey' Sen onward has been our guest, the last being 'Jake' Jacob, who was a close friend. When he died, the Governor came home to pay his respects, and he was given a service funeral with full honours.

No, he was not an Englishman. His English was perfect, and so were his manners. Among his civilian friends, he numbered Hasan Suhrawardy, who sought him out even when he was PM of your country, and Iqbal Athar Ali, your Ambassador to Belgium, who hosted my parents when they visited Bruxelles to see the battlefield at Waterloo. Khwaja Mohammed Kaisar, whom only those would know who are familiar with the history of Pakistan, the Nawab Family of Dhaka and the details of Kissinger's visit to Beijing, was perhaps among his closest friends, though drawn from diametrically opposite ends of the social scale: the son of an history professor did not rate with the Nawabs.

The way I was brought up by this man and his wife prevents me from doing more than recording these details. It is sad that he should be dragged into this discussion; to be honest, I do not believe that any member of the forum is entitled to question him or his life's work or his manners or upbringing. We are poor people, but you will be surprised to learn that even poor people have pride in their families and their honourable ancestors.

I am personally not offended, only surprised that someone, anyone, should so lose his sense of decorum and be so utterly boorish. Clearly, this is not a forum where I am wanted.

 

[kumarkumar1867]

^^^^^ Respect !

 

[vsdoc]

Joe he's a kid man. He said he's sorry.

To be fair parents, wives, sisters, daughters etc. are targeted less often today.

In 2009 it was still pretty common.

Recently I got banned for replying to a pretty senior Pakistani (over 7000 posts) who dragged my dad's racial origins into the discussion.

What are you going to do?

Our dads and who they are/were don't change by loose words.

But we can change those we can.

Hence I would like you to stay.

 

[Contrarian]

Joe, it is childish of you to get offended by what someone says on an online forum.

You contribute intellectually and i hope the forum serves some of that back to you! You also gain from others knowledge. That is about it.

 

[vsdoc]

Contrarian you left me hanging on the Blasphemy thread man.

 

[KRAIT]

God damn circular arguments with lots of trolling. I was expecting something interesting discussion.

 

[vsdoc]

Me too.

Joe was supposed to summarize.

Now he's left me waiting and watching.

Nuclear is too stunned or too officially disappointed to come back.

All we are left with is snakes, farmers, and Parsis.

 

[Contrarian]

Contrarian you left me hanging on the Blasphemy thread man.

Which post mate? Zarvan distracted me totally from my stream of thought.

 

[vsdoc]

Which post mate? Zarvan distracted me totally from my stream of thought.

The conversion stuff bro.

 

[Dubious]

Ab kisski kissay larai hogi?

 

[pk_baloch]

deleted----

 

[Developereo]

Nope. Donot confuse the issue. India has the will to be aggressive against the deep state of Pakistan. India will do what it takes to make sure the stranglehold that this deep state has on Pakistan gets released.

This can only be done by 2 ways simultaneously:
1. Incrementally chipping away at their powers - ie supporting the natural democratic evolution in Pakistan, something being done right now. The only way to do is is make sure that there is no threat from India. Nothing unites Pakistani's of all hue and colour behind their deep state like a threat(real or percieved) from India. Something used rather frequently by the deep state to keep in control of Pakistan.

This is being done. Pakistani's are being made to understand that we have no intentions or designs against any peice of territory lying in what is currently being held by Pakistan. This is currently becoming effective. More and more people in Pakistan are arguing that and knowing the correct history, that we have not attacked Pakistan, not attempted to take over any land held by Pakistan after 1971. We are content with what we call India but will not tolerate any attempt to change it.

Essentially this is about providing space to your political and social process to sort itself out and assert itself against the deep state.

This is being used by your polity to thumb at the PA and the political process is initself chipping away at what was once a very exclusive domain of the deep state. These are the beginnings of change in Pakistan in this sphere. The deep state will lose. The military will eventually have to content itself with the powers given and limited by the constitution only, as is the practice in every other modern democratic state.

I am touched by your naivete. For an Indian, you seem to have misjudged Pakistani domestic dynamics completely. What you advocate would work in a normal country but, sadly for both of us, Pakistan is not a normal country in this respect. Pakistanis support the army, not because we suffer from some genetic anomaly to love military dictators, but because the feudal charade of a civilian setup is so utterly corrupt. If India thinks it will drive a wedge between the people and the army by supporting the feudals, I say please do it loudly and with utmost fanfare.

2. Making the deep state understand that the good old days of Pakistan matching India in every sphere including intelligence is long gone. We are no longer equal. We are much more capable now, much further ahead than them. And so they will be punished for taking actions against India - by making sure what they desire doesnt come to fruition among other things. Making our military conventionally so strong that their deep state understands that a conventional war will not last beyond 3 days.

This argument has been debated earlier in the thread by notorious and others who are military men, hence far more capable than I to rebut these claims.

Yes, it does. And it is in the process of doing just that as we speak.

So, once again, you agree with the premise of the OP that India is engaged in hostile actions against Pakistan!

 

[vsdoc]

Well, Persians were worshipping eartly stuff and celestrian bodies like the sun....Not exactly call from the same god...

Ab kisski kissay larai hogi?

We were worshiping Ahura Mazda, our God.

We were following the teachings of Zarathushtra, our Prophet.

And the holy Atash (Fire) as a symbol of Ahura Mazda's purity.

Regardless Talon.

What business was it of your Prophet and his General led armies to attack Persia?

He was the first (and only) Prophet who followed the path of worldly politics and war.

The path of spread by military conquests.

Unrelenting.

That path more than anything during his lifetime set the tone for the religion and its followers for the 14 centuries to follow.

Do you guys truly believe the Religion of Peace thing or simply pay lip service to it because that's the way its written somewhere?