The Criticism LCA Tejas

[El Sidd]

It will fly by 2050

 

[Ultima Thule]

I was trying to say same in previous posts that PL15 with long range does not make Tajes crash before take off

how that's possible, Is PL-15 is air to ground stand off missiles

 

[sms]

how that's possible, Is PL-15 is air to ground stand off missiles

Understand sarcasm!
Let me know if you need help.

 

[HalfMoon]

LCA = Late Coming Aircraft

 

[sms]

LCA = Late Coming Aircraft

Ironic, but true!
Der aye durust aye!

 

[Khan vilatey]

All you talk just BS....

Assembling is just another things, Indian is doing from many years and Pakistan started with jf 17 and not alone, Chinese are making also and dilivering to PAK.

Jf 17 is = to su30mki when comes to indigenous product with OEM attached.

About Hal tejas gives different level of infrastructure to india. Now we can develop and make new aircrafts with such as value work experience.

Example - you need a time to make a software but upgrade version of software are easily can be available. Hal tejas mk1a is just upgrade of basis Hal tejas mk1. 2-3 years will be more than enough for that.

And new aircrafts will be easy to make once you have such a experience by making 4th generation fighter aircraft from the scratch.

Wherein Pakistan yet to start from design, wing testing tunnel etc and other inportant infrastructure for developing a new aircraft....

yes wishful thinking...... as I said these discussions are beyond your years, these are your days to go out and play, why get involved in this boring adult conversation.

See with age one gains the ability to call ones own bullshit. Like Pakistan can take over India by its military might Comparing software lifecycle to development of sophisticated cutting edge systems......

Having the ability to self reflect helps understand and provide a better debate.

Here is a taste of a coherent argument, LCA has been in development for over 40 years and 60 if you take the hf-24 Marut experience. India is having significant issues recruiting for her armed forces there is a shortage of 15000 officers in the army air force is even worse.... India’s sortie rate is poor due to mismanagement of spares..... need I go on..... this will mean that the specifications of the LCA MK XX is already obsolete. If you are to invest money into a project why not build a better aircraft from the so called experience in your argument why waste finite resources?

LCA = Late Coming Aircraft

more like never coming aircraft. If they were serious about this induction they would not have orders more su-30s, mig -29 and Rafale.

They will probably induct another 30 Rafael and call it a day.

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

yes wishful thinking...... as I said these discussions are beyond your years, these are your days to go out and play, why get involved in this boring adult conversation.

See with age one gains the ability to call ones own bullshit. Like Pakistan can take over India by its military might Comparing software lifecycle to development of sophisticated cutting edge systems......

Having the ability to self reflect helps understand and provide a better debate.

Here is a taste of a coherent argument, LCA has been in development for over 40 years and 60 if you take the hf-24 Marut experience. India is having significant issues recruiting for her armed forces there is a shortage of 15000 officers in the army air force is even worse.... India’s sortie rate is poor due to mismanagement of spares..... need I go on..... this will mean that the specifications of the LCA MK XX is already obsolete. If you are to invest money into a project why not build a better aircraft from the so called experience in your argument why waste finite resources?



more like never coming aircraft. If they were serious about this induction they would not have orders more su-30s, mig -29 and Rafale.

They will probably induct another 30 Rafael and call it a day.

What makes Hal Tejas MK1 absolute and Jf 17 block 2 is not?

Because I don't find any technical advantage of Jf 17 over HAl Tejas Mk1. If you are telling that Tejas is absolute then it also means, Jf block 2 is also absolute.

Real game changer will be Hal Tejas MK1a and Jf 17 block 3. Both yet to come....

Hal Tejas MK1a - between from2023/24
Jf 17 block 3 - from 2021.

 

[halupridol]

Ironic, but true!
Der aye durust aye!

Where is der aye,,,,even first 20 r not completely delivered,,, with trainers to be delivered later.
How many FOC aircrafts delivered. If "ironing" out kinks takes this much time for dpsu for transition from tejas IOC to FOC,,,,, thn one can imagine how much "ironing" time dpsu need for mk1a.
If mk1a was durust,,, thn neither IAF nor GOI wud have been reluctant on signing orders for the proposed 83 jets.Six years is plenty of time.
So either GOI n IAF know nothing about capabilities of proposed mk1a Or very corrupt n undermining it.
But more plausible reason cud be incompetence of dpsus to deliver on promises.
If the proposed mk1a was so durust thn dpsus wud not be hyping mk2(mwf) at all. Which is gud 10-15 years away from induction.
One guy said mk1a will come in 2024,,,,i can only laugh at this.
Going by the track record of dpsus even a min of 5 yrs seems overoptimistic,,,3-4 yrs from signing of order thn trials for IOC,, thn FOC. only after tht induction.

 

[Aasimkhan]

Hal tejas does not come under failure category.

Half tejas mk1 = jf 17 block 2

Hal tejas mk1a = jf 17 block 3

Not sure, how it count to be failure because it's open a gate for new aircrafts.

HAl Tejas mark 2
ORCA
Etc...

How can you compare those models of Tejas which are not in the air with those jf17s which are already in service for more than 10 years. Tejas is in dreams, JF17 is actual reality, how can you compare a dream with reality ?

Few country only manage to purchase only 12-15 latest aircraft. But still more than 18 Hal tejas you find sitting on the trucks.

Totally depends on requirements of both air forces.

PAF was needed a aircraft on a urgent basis because they were only a decent aircraft (f16 fighter) in their inventory.

Other hand, definitely Hal tejas is delayed around 5 years but even IAF did not a aircraft on a urgent basis and improve later at the stage.

Now, real game changer will be Hal tejas mk1a and jf 17 block 3.

Jf 17 block 3 from 2022
Hal tejas mk1a from 2024 (max)

I don't count earlier version's..

Tejas is 5 year delayed ? Its 40 years delayed sir

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

How can you compare those models of Tejas which are not in the air with those jf17s which are already in service for more than 10 years. Tejas is in dreams, JF17 is actual reality, how can you compare a dream with reality ?


Tejas is 5 year delayed ? Its 40 years delayed sir

Why should i count years of service? If years of service is so countable then MIG 21 would be a best figher aircarft in the world. Service of years definitely matters but I responded about technological absolute claim.

I am just talking about technical advantage and, I don't find any technical advantage of JF 17 block 2 over HAL Tejas Mk1. and upcoming Jf 17 block 3 over Hal Tejas Mk1a.

Tejas is in dreams, JF17 is actual reality, how can you compare a dream with reality ?

Don't know, if more than 18 fighters are flying but still you say dreams then I don't have any words. Thanks

40 years delayed sir

You kidding with me! right? Was Pakistan having any 4th generation fighter plane before 40 years?

 

[sms]

Where is der aye,,,,even first 20 r not completely delivered,,, with trainers to be delivered later.
How many FOC aircrafts delivered. If "ironing" out kinks takes this much time for dpsu for transition from tejas IOC to FOC,,,,, thn one can imagine how much "ironing" time dpsu need for mk1a.
If mk1a was durust,,, thn neither IAF nor GOI wud have been reluctant on signing orders for the proposed 83 jets.Six years is plenty of time.
So either GOI n IAF know nothing about capabilities of proposed mk1a Or very corrupt n undermining it.
But more plausible reason cud be incompetence of dpsus to deliver on promises.
If the proposed mk1a was so durust thn dpsus wud not be hyping mk2(mwf) at all. Which is gud 10-15 years away from induction.
One guy said mk1a will come in 2024,,,,i can only laugh at this.
Going by the track record of dpsus even a min of 5 yrs seems overoptimistic,,,3-4 yrs from signing of order thn trials for IOC,, thn FOC. only after tht induction.

Halu Sir Ji, No need to be grumpy. It's a mix bag of reasons/ cause.
But remember, knowledge and experience gain never follows a linear path. Things will speed up with every successful attempt.

 

[The Maverick]

The highlights of vedio.
1. Block one thunder has nothing in it not even basic bvr or hms and very basic single axis fbw. Only did bvr.and stand off arrive in second batch of 50 thunders
The full Monty took 10 years to deliver and China is finishing this now ie full triples fbw composite airframe irst and hms.

2nd all fighters go from basic to maturity and full integration even gripen even f18 superhornets.

3rd tejas is Indian second tier fighter for now behind mki Rafale mig29 etc. Thunder is Pakistan first tier they have no other options financially the other options are just dreams and if only be it block 70 falcons or typhoons etc. They are banking on j31 but it's a decade away .

4th tejas mark 1 basic is generation ahead of mig21 and mig27 and jaguar and has developed a full.eco system.to grow and mature into Indian gripen ng and Rafale eventually .5th Indian biggest challenge is the slow progress.

 

[halupridol]

Halu Sir Ji, No need to be grumpy. It's a mix bag of reasons/ cause.
But remember, knowledge and experience gain never follows a linear path. Things will speed up with every successful attempt.

You can keep believing that. And you maybe right,,,,corruption and Mediocrity is kind of our national character.
Haven't we been manufacturing fighter jets for decades now. Were they unsuccessful.What knowledge n experience have dpsus gained frm tht other thn screwdrivering.
So I have little hope about knowledge, experience they gain frm lca.

Btw I'm Not saying tht we shud abandon the project but we shud definitely disconnect it from national security and pursue it purely for acquiring skills and gaining knowledge.
and of course to continue providing jobs through our JAWAHAR ROJGAR YOJNA,,,i.e. our dpsus.

And perhaps that is what is happening.
Dpsus have declared LCA tejas as successful a decade back(world class, top class, game changer n what not) but IAF still flys mig21s,, orders a meager 20+20 aircrafts,,, that too after being coerced by GOI.
If you notice, After delivery of the mk1 began even GOI became silent and is dragging it's feet on signing further mk1a orders.And this is not congress govt,, mind u.
Why do u think tht happened,,,, definitely not becoz lca is DURUST like u said.
GOI maybe considering if it has any realistic hope of being durust in time for practical purpose at all. Thts why mk2(mwf), ORCA n other pies in the sky r being constantly proposed by our Jawahar rojgar yojna guys.

 

[Figaro]

India not continuing with the FGFA program and trying to fix the problems with the Russians will probably be the remembered as one of the worst decisions made by the IAF. To splurge almost a quarter billion dollars on each Rafael, which is at best a 4+ generation fighter and to waste money on the LCA, which has absolutely no combat value against the Pakistanis or Chinese aircraft really makes me worry about the Indian air force's procurement plan. Do you guys really think that a Rafael (I won't even mention the Tejas) will survive an engagement with the Su-57? Come on

 

[Chhatrapati]

Good ol vs thread. Why compare it to JF-17 at all, what's next start comparing with F-7 or J10? Move on...