Talks for Su-35, Mi-35 sales to Pakistan are underway: Russian Deputy FM

[GURU DUTT]

Do you know what MLU block 50/52 standard means?. PAF have customize MLU of F16

F-16 Versions - F-16 MLU



That is our problem i guess, so we will resolve it by our self.

great for you with F-16 MLU but what if i told you your F-16s cant fly without american experts(permanentlli styationed on PAF bases) putting new source coads in them after every sortie and yes no pakistani expert is allowed to do that ... but im sure you wont understand what i mean

as for resolving the money issue well my friend thats the crux of the matter first do it then dream of flying su-35 russia, USA, Britain, germany or france all of them now work onli on one principal and thats hard cash... there is nothing for free and you better know what are the costs pakistan had paid and still paying for the yamrican wepons

 

[My-Analogous]

Ruskies junk suddenly become wonderful war machine for Pakistan .

Because now we realize that in the hand of Indian every thing become Junk and here are some example

Air Force's new C-130J aircraft crashes near Gwalior, five killed

IAF fighter jet crashes in Rajasthan; no casualties reported

Air Force's Sukhoi-30 Fighter Jet Crashes Near Pune, Pilots Safe

Air Force Unmanned Aerial Vehicle, Cost 80 Crore, Crashes in Gujarat

AND many many more(if you want)

great for you with F-16 MLU but what if i told you your F-16s cant fly without american experts(permanentlli styationed on PAF bases) putting new source coads in them after every sortie and yes no pakistani expert is allowed to do that ... but im sure you wont understand what i mean

as for resolving the money issue well my friend thats the crux of the matter first do it then dream of flying su-35 russia, USA, Britain, germany or france all of them now work onli on one principal and thats hard cash... there is nothing for free and you better know what are the costs pakistan had paid and still paying for the yamrican wepons

Well its seems that you are misinformed, we didn't buy to showcase them

great for you with F-16 MLU but what if i told you your F-16s cant fly without american experts(permanentlli styationed on PAF bases) putting new source coads in them after every sortie and yes no pakistani expert is allowed to do that ... but im sure you wont understand what i mean

as for resolving the money issue well my friend thats the crux of the matter first do it then dream of flying su-35 russia, USA, Britain, germany or france all of them now work onli on one principal and thats hard cash... there is nothing for free and you better know what are the costs pakistan had paid and still paying for the yamrican wepons

Do you have a hobby to change the topics?

 

[GURU DUTT]

FGFA which will be based on PAK FA prototype being developed by Russia and partially funded by India is still on designed phase and the designed is not still frozen. HAL will be prime contractor-cum manufacturer. Prototypes PAK FA is flying in Russian and testing and R&D is going on with the different Engine since the main prime engine haven't ready yet. Regarding F-35 Indian Navy is showing interest in F-35B for its future carriers and send enquiry for the same. No it was never offered to India officially in any Public domain but don't see any problem in its acquisition. There is a long list of the future customer including US, USN, UK, Australia, Turkey and Israel so India have to wait for the long time after the full scale production starts up.

Nothing is cooked up dreams you can get all the information from the newspapers

way the things are going im pretty sure IAF will buy at least 4 squads of FGFA and rest of PAKFA when it comes as for F-35 if EMALS & AAG are coming from USA make sure F-35C will be there to no question about it

Because now we realize that in the hand of Indian every thing become Junk and here are some example

Air Force's new C-130J aircraft crashes near Gwalior, five killed

IAF fighter jet crashes in Rajasthan; no casualties reported

Air Force's Sukhoi-30 Fighter Jet Crashes Near Pune, Pilots Safe

Air Force Unmanned Aerial Vehicle, Cost 80 Crore, Crashes in Gujarat

AND many many more(if you want)



Well its seems that you are misinformed, we didn't buy to showcase them



Do you have a hobby to change the topics?

saeen ji im not bluffing dont trust me ask any PAF personnel you know who is anywhere near those 18BLK52s of PAF and ask them what i just said im sure you ganna find it pretty revolutionarry .... cheers mate

 

[Ultima Thule]

Ruskies junk suddenly become wonderful war machine for Pakistan .

Which means your SU-30MKI and MIG-29 are also junk

 

[GURU DUTT]

Which means your SU-30MKI and MIG-29 are also junk

or is it a case of "sour grapes"

 

[My-Analogous]

way the things are going im pretty sure IAF will buy at least 4 squads of FGFA and rest of PAKFA when it comes as for F-35 if EMALS & AAG are coming from USA make sure F-35C will be there to no question about it


saeen ji im not bluffing dont trust me ask any PAF personnel you know who is anywhere near those 18BLK52s of PAF and ask them what i just said im sure you ganna find it pretty revolutionarry .... cheers mate

So you mean to say Pakistan have only 18 F16?. By the way our relationship with US is very deep and they always impose sanction on us and we always broke that.

or is it a case of "sour grapes"

Read post # 628 again

 

[gau8av]

The Russians have already clarified that no such sale is happening, time to lock this thread ?

 

[araz]

There is no scenario I can envision in which, any of the expensive war toys will be used in India - Pak conflict. There are multiple safeguards built in at multiple level in India- Pakistan relationship to prevent precisely the conditions which would necessitate their usage which would preclude a Nuclear War. Rest is all gravy for the masses.

If Pakistan is buying SU-35 with a non India specific role like bombing the crap out of Talibanis and other scum inside their borders then it's good, however I have limited understanding of how well these jets are suited for that role.

With respect to build-up on India side I have a sneaking suspicion that it is smoke and mirrors. Year after year high proportion of defense money is returned to Finance Ministry unspent. Deals drag on for years, projects are being perpetually extended. Whatever actual acquisition you see are not even Pakistan specific. Now it can all be due to immense and unprecedented in-competence and complete lack of interest in National Security or it can be a very clever dis-information war at the expense of poor French and likes to force Pakistan into an arms race.

Clearly Pakistan is not taking the bait as evidenced by it's similar lack of high profile acquisition for years. These SU-35 plans are in clear response to India's forward momentum towards Rafale Deal, when that stops any news of SU35 will stop too.

I think, not enough credit is given to the governments on both sides. That is just my contrarian view though.

Spectre.
On the contrary there is a very big opportunity of war coming up in the region.. It will be triggered by water and I would go out on a limb to say that it is entirely Pakistani stupidity and lack of development of storage facilities which will lead upto it.You can have all the safeguards in the world that you like but one little spark and with the lack of trust between the two countries will result in an exchange with disastrous outcome. This is precisely why it is imperative that the reasons for the mistrust are extinguished now and the stupidities of both neighbours interfering with each others internal matters should stop post haste.
You maybe right about the smoke and mirrors but the problem remains that this policy goes down the drain as soon as some money comes into the coffers of either state. The only reason why things have not gone out of hand is because pakistani economy is in such a dire state that it simply cannot afford to escalate its defence expenditure. As a matter of compromise we have started looking at internal development/ manufacturing/label changing of weapons systems to fulfil our needs . India on the other hand seems outwardly focused on the acquisition from outside.
The Rafale deal served its purpose in preventing access to EU for Pakistani imports. However, the Chinese factor is preventing the acquisition blockade which India wanted to strategically put around Pakistan. Russia is just trying to see whether it can kill 2 birds with one stone by either enticing India into placing an order or selling to pakistan and opening up the market there. The problem for india is that it has a genuine need to replace its Migs but cant find a suitable plane as Rafale, EFT and Gripen NG would all be expensive to acquire and maintain.

Lol :lol :
Use some common sense dude.
You can undrdtand basic business .
Russians need our money to maintain that Pak Fa.
We also have our own parallel program like AMCA .
They simply cant ignore a 150 billion $ market.

We have a lots of other option for buying weapons .But for Russia , thry cant just replace Indias place with sme other nation.

Buyers never dictate to the seller who they sell to. Contrary to your assumptions I think it is India which will find severing its umbilical cord with mother Russia impossible whether Mother Russia suuckles another baby or not. There is far too much weaponry to be replaced if you decided to walk away.
For whatever it is worth I still think the SU35 sale talk to PAF is ungrounded in fact. I would need to see news of a signed contract before I believe this one. It is simple. It is too much too quickly and things dont work like this in the aviation industry except when you are arabs( and even for arabs it is highly debatable). You dont just go and say"Yallah I will have 3 dozens of this and 2 dozens of that and can you send 45 women for my King's and my harem while you are at it Habeebi"

 

[GURU DUTT]

So you mean to say Pakistan have only 18 F16?. By the way our relationship with US is very deep and they always impose sanction on us and we always broke that.



Read post # 628 again

pakistan has onli 18 proper Blk52 F-16s rest(42) all are second or third hand F-16s which dont have either the engine or radar or avionicks to support the clain that they are Blk52s at best they can be termed Blk40 but even your Blk-52s are seaverlli "sanctioned/bugged" and worse thing is we indians are practising on them as singaporean F-16Blk52s are sationed permanentlli in india (and they are not bugged nor they need US experts to put new source codes after every sortie)

as for russian hardware bieng junk well thats what pakistanies always made fun of it till china decided to buy a few su-35s themselfs and then came roumours as pakistan was interested but then ... i know im always wrong

 

[My-Analogous]

The Russians have already clarified that no such sale is happening, time to lock this thread ?

yeah similar one like RD93 and MI35. We know how you feel but can't help you out

 

[batmannow]

FGFA which will be based on PAK FA prototype being developed by Russia and partially funded by India is still on designed phase and the designed is not still frozen. HAL will be prime contractor-cum manufacturer. Prototypes PAK FA is flying in Russian and testing and R&D is going on with the different Engine since the main prime engine haven't ready yet. Regarding F-35 Indian Navy is showing interest in F-35B for its future carriers and send enquiry for the same. No it was never offered to India officially in any Public domain but don't see any problem in its acquisition. There is a long list of the future customer including US, USN, UK, Australia, Turkey and Israel so India have to wait for the long time after the full scale production starts up.

Nothing is cooked up dreams you can get all the information from the newspapers

Here we go ,again nothing concrete ?
How long the proto types being done in Russia PAK FA ?
more then 10 years or so ?
What you think , within coming one year Pakistan having at least a sqd of SU-35 & India still checking more proto types in Russia ?
For the next 10 years more ?
You only think about the Indian navys interests but you forgot , that US may not be interested in that ?
When USA would complete its customers , for the F-35, then it will be like 2040 ?
Will you b waiting then ?

 

[araz]

pakistan has onli 18 proper Blk52 F-16s rest(42) all are second or third hand F-16s which dont have either the engine or radar or avionicks to support the clain that they are Blk52s at best they can be termed Blk40 but even your Blk-52s are seaverlli "sanctioned/bugged" and worse thing is we indians are practising on them as singaporean F-16Blk52s are sationed permanentlli in india (and they are not bugged nor they need US experts to put new source codes after every sortie)

as for russian hardware bieng junk well thats what pakistanies always made fun of it till china decided to buy a few su-35s themselfs and then came roumours as pakistan was interested but then ... i know im always wrong

Prove it!!! You mean to say that the MLUed 16s still retain their old avionics and radar suite? ? Man you are a senior poster for heavens sake. Prove your point but dont resort to outright lying or downright idiocy to prove your points. We are willing to accept IAFs numerical and material superiority but it is not so verwhelming that PAF will buckle under and lie down to let IAF do whatever it wants.
Secondly rest assured that the safeguards in place for the 52s are the same for every foreign vendor so your assumptions about the Singaporean AFs fighters is incorrect.
A

 

[GURU DUTT]

Here we go ,again nothing concrete ?
How long the proto types being done in Russia PAK FA ?
more then 10 years or so ?
What you think , within coming one year Pakistan having at least a sqd of SU-35 & India still checking more proto types in Russia ?
For the next 10 years more ?
You only think about the Indian navys interests but you forgot , that US may not be interested in that ?
When USA would complete its customers , for the F-35, then it will be like 2040 ?
Will you b waiting then ?

1.russian FGFA prototypes are already in last leg of fininshing there flight testings and sonn wepons intigration phase will commence and the first FGFA are sheduled to be in RSAF by 2018 while 2020 for IAF

2.no russian su-35s are coming for PAF as PAF is in no position to buy them off the shelf let alone pay for there maintainence and spares

as for F-35 well USA has already made a formal offer to sell F-35 to india and is already in talks for that along with o wants them for its IAC-2 EMALS, AAG and E2D/E for indian navy and indian navy also

have some patience

Prove it!!! You mean to say that the MLUed 16s still retain their old avionics and radar suite? ? Man you are a senior poster for heavens sake. Prove your point but dont resort to outright lying or downright idiocy to prove your points. We are willing to accept IAFs numerical and material superiority but it is not so verwhelming that PAF will buckle under and lie down to let IAF do whatever it wants.
Secondly rest assured that the safeguards in place for the 52s are the same for every foreign vendor so your assumptions about the Singaporean AFs fighters is incorrect.
A

OK TT sir whatever you say is right im wrong happy now .... cheers mate

 

[abdulbarijan]

pakistan has onli 18 proper Blk52 F-16s rest(42) all are second or third hand F-16s which dont have either the engine or radar or avionicks to support the clain that they are Blk52s at best they can be termed Blk40 but even your Blk-52s are seaverlli "sanctioned/bugged" and worse thing is we indians are practising on them as singaporean F-16Blk52s are sationed permanentlli in india (and they are not bugged nor they need US experts to put new source codes after every sortie)

as for russian hardware bieng junk well thats what pakistanies always made fun of it till china decided to buy a few su-35s themselfs and then came roumours as pakistan was interested but then ... i know im always wrong

What's funny is that only 2-3 days ago, we were having a discussion about the IAF potentially getting used Mirage 2000's from UAE-- you were all up and going about how it was economical etc etc. and I brought the same point to your attention that Indians use the same "ohh you have used F-16's etc." all the time -- yet somehow the same standard never applies to Indian procurement even if its potentially for second hand equipment ... You can refresh your memory if you like though ..and thanks for proving my point ...

Open Debate l Ex-UAE Mirage 2000-9s for PAF, aye or nay ? | Page 17

Secondly, do read a little in to what MLU upgrades that the falcons of ours got ... before you go out on how they are just "barely block 40" aircrafts ...

PAF F-16 mlu specifications and 36 blk 52+ prospects

Lastly, your not the only one with a friend that fields similar equipment to your enemy that you can use to practice against ....

 

[My-Analogous]

i know im always wrong

Add: US are so stupid that they stated that our F16 is MLU (50/52 standards) and they should asked you before making any comments