Sukhoi PAK-FA / FGFA: Updates,News & Discussions

[sancho]

Upgraded Su-35/34 tech ? I don't recall nether Su-35 or 34 of having AESA radar, L-band radar on its wings or another dozen feathers that i could list.

- 117 engine
- IRST
- MAWS
- SATCOM

 

[Arzamas 16]

- 117 engine
- IRST
- MAWS
- SATCOM

117 is only used on the PAK FA prototypes, and you just proved me right because nether Su-34 or Su-35 have AESA radar, or L-band radar.


and all the items you just posted are available on this aircraft.

ÎÀÊ :: Íîâîñòè OAK :: Êîðïîðàöèÿ «Èðêóò» ïåðåäàëà ÂÂÑ Ðîññèè ïåðâûå äâà ñàìîëåòà Ñó-30ÑÌ

 

[Water Car Engineer]

 

[Sergi]

117 is only used on the PAK FA prototypes, and you just proved me right because nether Su-34 or Su-35 have AESA radar, or L-band radar.


and all the items you just posted are available on this aircraft.

ÎÀÊ :: Íîâîñòè OAK :: Êîðïîðàöèÿ «Èðêóò» ïåðåäàëà ÂÂÑ Ðîññèè ïåðâûå äâà ñàìîëåòà Ñó-30ÑÌ

For Bolded part, you mean to say Indian MKIs getting super-Sukhoi upgrade to bring them to SU-35 standard will have better radar than the standard 35 ???
I am assuming MKI upgrade consists of AESA

 

[Arzamas 16]

For Bolded part, you mean to say Indian MKIs getting super-Sukhoi upgrade to bring them to SU-35 standard will have better radar than the standard 35 ???
I am assuming MKI upgrade consists of AESA

MKI upgrade includes first generation Russian AESA radar called Zhuk-AE, while PAK FA will get second generation AESA radar.

 

[Gessler]

MKI upgrade includes first generation Russian AESA radar called Zhuk-AE, while PAK FA will get second generation AESA radar.

Zhuk-AE is too small and too weak for the mini-AWACS type roles MKI needs to perform, isn't it?

Super-MKI may get an AESA version of BARS or Irbis-E with 400km range,Zhuk-AE is aroudn 200km only.

 

[Sergi]

MKI upgrade includes first generation Russian AESA radar called Zhuk-AE, while PAK FA will get second generation AESA radar.

Zhuk-AE is too small and too weak for the mini-AWACS type roles MKI needs to perform, isn't it?

Super-MKI may get an AESA version of BARS or Irbis-E with 400km range,Zhuk-AE is aroudn 200km only.

Negotiations for MKI upgrade radar are still undertalk. So we can't say which Radar we are going to get yet. May be after Putin's visit more things will be cleared.

 

[Arzamas 16]

Zhuk-AE is too small and too weak for the mini-AWACS type roles MKI needs to perform, isn't it?

Super-MKI may get an AESA version of BARS or Irbis-E with 400km range,Zhuk-AE is aroudn 200km only.

Well, you guys want a AESA radar for the upgrade, and Irbis-E is PESA radar so thats marked off the list, Tikhomirov Scientific Research Institute of Instrument Design is the company that makes bars radar, and they have stopped developing bars line now and their concentrating all their efforts on making a AESA radar for PAK FA.

so if you guys want AESA radar for Super-MKI upgrade you either get Zhuk-AE or you have wait another 4 years PAK FA's AESA to be ready, probably much longer because RUAF will get all
the production examples first.

 

[sudhir007]

 

[sancho]

117 is only used on the PAK FA prototypes, and you just proved me right because nether Su-34 or Su-35 have AESA radar, or L-band radar.

That's what you claim, but so far I take the statements of Russian officials as more reliable. Btw, I never stated anything about AESA radar or so, that's what you did. I pointed out the systems the early Pak Fa will have as modernised parts of the Su 35 and 34.

and all the items you just posted are available on this aircraft

Not really, it neither have the 117 engines of the Su 35, but the same AL 31 with TVC that MKI has as well, neither does it have the IR MAWS, nor the SATCOM of the Su 34, if at all, it has the same IRST, but that's it.

Zhuk-AE is too small

The size of a radar is not fixed, additional AESA modules can be added to a bigger nose, that's why the Russians integrated 3 x different Zhuk AEs into Mig 35 prototypes, to reach the promised 200Km detection range, by increasing the nose diameter. The problem is, that weight will be increased as well and the radar turned out to be too heavy and they had to stick to smaller versions, with less range again.
Zhuk AE in MKI would have a diameter of around 900mm, while it had 688mm in the Mig, so much space for more modules and more power.

Well, you guys want a AESA radar for the upgrade, and Irbis-E is PESA radar so thats marked off the list, Tikhomirov Scientific Research Institute of Instrument Design is the company that makes bars radar, and they have stopped developing bars line now and their concentrating all their efforts on making a AESA radar for PAK FA.

Wrong, they have developed an AESA version of BARS, which is not that complicated anyway and it is on offer for IAF as well, but so far there is no decision made about which radar IAF will procure. BARS AESA will be an easier upgrade for IAF and sticking with Tikhomirov is the better option for the future too, since they will develop the radar for Pak Fa / FGFA as well.

 

[Arzamas 16]

That's what you claim, but so far I take the statements of Russian officials as more reliable. Btw, I never stated anything about AESA radar or so, that's what you did. I pointed out the systems the early Pak Fa will have as modernised parts of the Su 35 and 34.

Your previous post

Yes, but they won't have the type 30 by then, because it still will remain in test and trial stage. The official statements that I showed are clear, Russian air force gets an early version of Pak Fa, with upgraded Su 35/34 techs, while the real 5th gen Pak Fa and FGFA will come only at the end of the decade.

Upgraded or modernized both your terminologies are wrong, at best PAK FA avionics are an
a evolution of the Su-35s, in fact the very presence of an second generation AESA radar on the PAK FA makes your whole argument wrong, and only thing that might not be developed on time for early PAK FA is the Type 30 engine, while everything else will be ready and tested.

Not really, it neither have the 117 engines of the Su 35, but the same AL 31 with TVC that MKI has as well, neither does it have the IR MAWS, nor the SATCOM of the Su 34, if at all, it has the same IRST, but that's it.

You got your engine's mixed up, Su-35 uses 117S , while 117 is only used on PAK FA prototypes.

Saturn AL-31 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[sancho]

Upgraded or modernized both your terminologies are wrong, at best PAK FA avionics are an
a evolution of the Su-35s,

Your denial gets really boring! An evolution will be the newly developed AESA radar, the newly developed type 30 engine and the design in general, but the early Pak Fas as shown, will used upgraded techs from Su 35 too, like the engine for example, which are upgraded AL 31s. That makes it easier for Rusian air force to get an early induction and not wait for the fully developed 5th gen Pak Fa, while IAF rejected this early version and will wait for the final one.

 

[Arzamas 16]

Your denial gets really boring!

Your lack of knowledge is getting disturbing.

An evolution will be the newly developed AESA radar

2015 PAK FA will be carrying this radar


Tikhomirov new AESA

Irbis-E

Upgraded Su-35 radar riiiiiiiiiiiight

the newly developed type 30 engine and the design in general, but the early Pak Fas as shown, will used upgraded techs from Su 35 too, like the engine for example, which are upgraded AL 31s.

This is about the only thing you got right.

That makes it easier for Rusian air force to get an early induction and not wait for the fully developed 5th gen Pak Fa, while IAF rejected this early version and will wait for the final one.

Their is no such thing early PAK FA or final PAK FA, you guys made that made term up, Like I said hundred times before the only thing that might not be ready by 2015, is type 30 engine everything else will that its it.

 

[sancho]

 

[anant_s]

There is no definitive information on RCS of T-50 and i'm searching for the same for quite some time. I found a graphic showing RCS for T-50 at 0.3 wavelength.

Now whats interesting to note here is that there is a significant area of plane that has RCS in positive dBsm range which makes it VLO but not truly stealthy.
Also i'm not sure how does the RCS look from bottom of plane the belly is depressed and not smooth as J-20 or F-22A.