String of Samosa

[navtrek]

This is a logic trap.

If you bring China-Tibet up as an example of illegality, and draw parallels to the MacMahon line then you are automatically ceding the point because if such claims are illegal by your definition, India would be breaking her own laws by conspicuously taking up Britain claim verbatim.

All beside the point, no future border negotiations between India and China will reference China's reestablishment of central control in Tibet. (I really prefer this term over invasion)

ha ha ok ill accept that even though i know it will be difficult to base my claims by accepting that fact ill still accept the fact.

Ill accept that it was reestablishment of central control (even tough its very biased and tilted heavily towards you). But reality coz India has accepted it to be so.

But still i can prove your claims on Arunachal Pradesh and Aksai Chin wrong and misguided.

 

[CardSharp]

http://www.defence.pk/forums/china-defence/36037-indian-land-chinese-land.html

You must go through this thread to understand more

Oh I'm not disputing you previous post by facts but merely point out the contradictions in logic in the statement.

Again I do not profess to being knowledgeable about the subject.

 

[CardSharp]

ha ha ok ill accept that even though i know it will be difficult to base my claims by accepting that fact ill still accept the fact.

Ill accept that it was reestablishment of central control (even tough its very biased and tilted heavily towards you). But reality coz India has accepted it to be so.

But still i can prove your claims on Arunachal Pradesh and Aksai Chin wrong and misguided.

I just found the name of the historian that Maxwell accused of making up India's claim on Aksai Chin. Maxwell suggests that Sarvepalli Gopal amongst other fabricated territorial claims in Aksai Chin for Nehru to use against China as leverage in a tit for tat sort of way.

It seems that there is at least some support for this from other western historians

Ambiguity and India's claims to the Aksai Chin
Author: Steven A. Hoffmanna

Affiliation: Associate Professor in the Government Department, Skidmore College, Saratoga, New York

Ambiguity and India's claims to the Aksai Chin - Central Asian Survey

 

[navtrek]

I just found the name of the historian that Maxwell accused of making up India's claim on Aksai Chin. Maxwell suggests that Sarvepalli Gopal amongst other fabricated territorial claims in Aksai Chin for Nehru to use against China as leverage in a tit for tat sort of way.

It seems that there is at least some support for this from other western historians

Ambiguity and India's claims to the Aksai Chin
Author: Steven A. Hoffmanna

Affiliation: Associate Professor in the Government Department, Skidmore College, Saratoga, New York

Ambiguity and India's claims to the Aksai Chin - Central Asian Survey

Yes i agree another point of view but even that can be disproved. i just feel that the current LAC will be the permanent border.

China gets Aksai Chin and India gets Arunachal Pradesh. But i dont know why the agreement has not been reached.

This is the only way out

 

[CardSharp]

Yes i agree another point of view but even that can be disproved. i just feel that the current LAC will be the permanent border.

China gets Aksai Chin and India gets Arunachal Pradesh. But i dont know why the agreement has not been reached.

This is the only way out

Politicians what can you do...

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

I apologize for any perceived anger and please allow me to say

You don't have to apologize,infact i thought i had offended you.

 

[CardSharp]

You don't have to apologize,infact i thought i had offended you.

You are way too nice Why do you not rub off on the other members here.

 

[whocares]

i don't mind the border disputes with china to remain unsolved for eternity as long as they don't mind the status quo.

unlike kashmir, there simply are no people at stake here in the status quo, just land. useless land at that.

 

[CardSharp]

i don't mind the border disputes with china to remain unsolved for eternity as long as they don't mind the status quo.

unlike kashmir, there simply are no people at stake here in the status quo, just land. useless land at that.

There's all the world at stake here if China and India decide to go to war.


India is speeding its military build up at the borders with two mountain divisions and the Indian media report plays up "constant intrusions" by PLA border guard as Beijing flexing its muscles.

All the while Chinese people don't even know that India is so worried about China. No one has talked about India as a threat, and there is little media reporting in China about India. If China is to attack, wouldn't the state media (CCTV, people's daily, Xinhua, Global times etc) start building public support and rationale for aggression against India?

And where are statistics like this coming from?

Chinese "transgressions'' into these sectors in Eastern Ladakh this year have registered "a sharp jump'', ranging from 27% to 52%, as compared to the same timeframe in 2009. "Just in Trig Heights area, for instance, almost 30 Chinese transgressions have already been witnessed this year,'' said a source.

Chinese intrusions become frequent - India - The Times of India


I just think things are going end very badly for both countries if we don't work something out.

 

[Hafizzz]

The Answer is complexity of the issue and variables involved.

China has solved border disputes well by mostly "give and take" principle,however the same can't be applied to India so easily.

First lets consider Aksai Chin.

Aksai Chin is desert with almost no population.
This can be solved by simply asking China to accept Arunachal Pradesh as Indian territory in return for India's recognition of Aksai Chin as Chinese territory.But unfortunately,it not so easy because Aksai Chin is considered a part Kashmir,which itself is a disputed territory,the people of Kashmir themselves aren't comfortable being under India.So we only end up angering Kashmirs even more.leading to greater local support for the insurgency over there.

Second,Arunachal Pradesh

There can be no or never compromise on this for the following reasons.
1.people of Arunachal Pradesh consider themselves to be Indians,We can't sell our citizens under any circumstances.
2.Strategic value as it neighbors Assam(another Indian state) where most of India's oil wells are.
3.There is some animosity towards India in the North-east,as the consider that they are under Indian colonial rule.hence the Insurgency there will get even more local support and erupt.

Third,Other variables
1.Many Indian leaders when considering border issues with China,consider recognition of Tibet as a mistake,also responsible for the 1962 blunder,as Tibet was buffer between the 2 nations.
2.General Indian public feeling that we have lot enough during the partition of our country in 1947.

Any change or progress can happen when Indians have complete confidence over their Govt and I don't see that happening before 2030(for the least),hopefully by then condition of all Indians might improve.

Like i said before,the border dispute will continue to remain a blemish on our ties for a long time.

PS:I didn't even read the article,since its from a blog.That too 3 years old

Aksai Chin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Aksai Chin is part of the Tibetan Plateau. Aksai Chin was historically part of the Himalayan Kingdom of Ladakh[citation needed]until Ladakh was annexed from the rule of the local Namgyal dynasty by the Dogras and the princely state of Kashmir in the 19th century. However the Chinese never accepted British negotiated Boundary in the north east area of the princely state of Kashmir.[3]

Very true and i think India's stand is pretty clear on that and we are ready to give and take without unsettling already populated areas.

I just want to know how China can claim the whole of Arunachal pradesh as belonging to Tibet. Want to know the reasons and historical links behind it ?

Arunachal Pradesh is actually South Tibet. The British forced the Dalai Lama to "give" it to India.

 

[Guynextdoor]

Indian leaders all silently and eagerly commit to India superpower doctrine which aims to establish once hegomonis India from border of China to heart of South Asia streching upto middle wast and Southeast asia. Their doctrine, like the colonial mentality is very much shaped by the british experiment which relied on population growth to achieve power status. The soviets has very low population so they relied on spreading their doctrine into locals for garnering sympathy. India on other hand encourages population growth to natrually people seek to immigrate for better economic prospect. The colonisation by population growth will increasingly speak into Indian favour once forigen born Indian generation start occupying key positions in Canada, USA, UK & europe.

And why did you let go of Europe and America. We want to impose our hegemony on them too. In fact Pakistan is the only people we haven't been able to cow down- but that's probably because you are smart enuf to see through our conspiracies when the rest of the world can't. It also helps that you eat meat.

 

[Dash]

Phabere phabera mood kharab kar diya!!!...haha

Arunachal Pradesh is actually South Tibet. The British forced the Dalai Lama to "give" it to India.

Where do you get these information from??

 

[navtrek]

Aksai Chin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Aksai Chin is part of the Tibetan Plateau. Aksai Chin was historically part of the Himalayan Kingdom of Ladakh[citation needed]until Ladakh was annexed from the rule of the local Namgyal dynasty by the Dogras and the princely state of Kashmir in the 19th century. However the Chinese never accepted British negotiated Boundary in the north east area of the princely state of Kashmir.[3]

Arunachal Pradesh is actually South Tibet. The British forced the Dalai Lama to "give" it to India.

Justify ur statement ?

 

[navtrek]

Cow meat is nice and tasty.

Why are u so anti India and why do you keep trolling in every thread ???

Come on lets maintain the standard and talk sense

 

[Hussein]

Is this a chinese conspiracy against India or India's unwillingness to settle the border reasonably like all of China's other neighbours?

This article is so symptomatic of India's obsession with China. Every move China makes is closely watched and interpreted as some grand design against India. China is developing better relationships with all countries, African, SE Asian, European, S. American, and it has little to do with India.

Yet you talk yourselves into huge arms purchases, creating new mountain divisions, militarizing borders. I am really at a loss here, yours may be a self-fulfilling prophecy.China is not your nemesis but if you treat her as your nemesis, she will become one.

why "she"?
you're feminist (i am kiding) or in your language your country is female?