Soldiers killed in action are not martyrs. ‘Martyr’ has religious overtones, writes Karan Thapar

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Its called "Veergati" in Hindi. The concept has been since the Kings of pre Islamic times.

So called veergati is an entirely different from the concept of shahadat, an Islamic word u use for your dead.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

How you render the meaning of ancient words or translate ancient names is open to subjective bias. Tell me how the hell do you equate Hindsa with the modern day Indian Republic? Do tell me please? Like I said before, it is like Roma gypsy beggers from Romania claming Roman civilization all because of the similar sounding name.

@Sinopakfriend Hoping you enjoying the fantastic weather in Netherlands. Take it easy and don't forget the suncream. You Dutch burn easy. Have a nice evening.

@PAKISTANFOREVER Stay cool. Don't get banned. And remember. The only good Indian is a >beep< Indian. And finally make love not war with Gangias.

Bro, I agree with you on everything but will take a MASSIVE pass at your final sentence......lol.........

How you render the meaning of ancient words or translate ancient names is open to subjective bias. Tell me how the hell do you equate Hindsa with the modern day Indian Republic? Do tell me please? Like I said before, it is like Roma gypsy beggers from Romania claming Roman civilization all because of the similar sounding name.

@Sinopakfriend Hoping you enjoying the fantastic weather in Netherlands. Take it easy and don't forget the suncream. You Dutch burn easy. Have a nice evening.

@PAKISTANFOREVER Stay cool. Don't get banned. And remember. The only good Indian is a >beep< Indian. And finally make love not war with Gangias.

Lol........It's like indians claiming English heritage because Britain conquered and ruled over them............

 

[gslv mk3]

All I am going to say about that picture is that I now understand why they hate Pakistan and Pakistani people so much

I am rather surprised.

The only good Indian is a >beep< Indian.

Your frustration is showing.

 

[halupridol]

Hinduism doesn't have the concept of Shahadat, it's a purely Islamic concept.

Yes,,dying for religion isnt part of hinduism,,its an alien concept,probably frm middle east.
But dying for homeland n for the rightful is called achieving veergati.

If you take away the Islamic influence from Ganga India, take away the genetic print from the invaders from the West (mostly Muslim) what are you left with? The true shining India. The aboriginals Adivasi who make 10% of India. All you Indian's should thank us for giving you a culture, clothing, architecture, civilization and some with faces that don't crack the mirror.

The real Indians before Islam came - the Adivasi.

Lol,,martial bhayya logic
Adivasi means tribal,,,n yes India has a lot of tribals,,so what?

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Our "Shaheed" is "Veergati" one not islamic one. Word is used interchangebly in Hindi like many persian and arabic ones. But the meaning we convey is the hindi one.

It's not interchangeable nor just an Arabic word.

It's a Quranic word (mentioned in Holy Quran), having an Islamic definition and meaning.

 

[halupridol]

@zootinali @bhutjolokia
Come here pakistani bhayyo ko adivasi ka matlab batate hai

 

[A.P. Richelieu]

You have no knowledge of the concept so better leave it.

And we do say "shaheed" .. it's only for English speakers that the word "martyr" is used.

There are different categories of shaheed or shahadat.

You know nothing about.

It is enough to read this thread to understand that shaheed and shahadat does
not translate well into martyr.
English speaking persons see the talk about Martyrdom as ridiculous, and degrading to the concept.
Better then to chose Your own term to get respect.
I do not claim to know what those terms should be, I leave this to You.
US patriots honour those in Military Service but use a completely different terminology.

 

[halupridol]

It's not interchangeable nor just an Arabic word.

It's a Quranic word (mentioned in Holy Quran), having an Islamic definition and meaning.

I dont know wht shaahid means,,i assume it means dying for the love of god/religion.
Veergati literally means dying on battlefield bravely

 

[Dhara]

What is even funnier is Hindu-stanis calling their dead as "shaheed"

Which is an Arabic word, and of strictly Islamic heritage.

Please brother don't disrespect fallen men in uniform, As i said many times soldiers don't hate soldiers, they gave their life for their country in the line of duty.

Condemn those who force them to kill innocent either in Kashmir or in Punjab.

@Icarus

It's not interchangeable nor just an Arabic word.

It's a Quranic word (mentioned in Holy Quran), having an Islamic definition and meaning.

You should be happy that non-Muslim have to use word Shaheed since there is no concept in Hinduism of martyr.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

I dont know wht shaahid means,,i assume it means dying for the love of god/religion.
Veergati literally means dying on battlefield bravely

Shaheed doesn't mean "dying for XYZ".

According to Islam there are several types of Shahadat each having its own status.

And according to Islam, a Shaheed is not to be considered "dead", because they do not "die".

Shahadat in simple means, sacrificing ones life for righteous cause. Or in Allahs path.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Please brother don't disrespect fallen men in uniform, As i said many times soldiers don't hate soldiers, they gave their life for their country in the line of duty.

Condemn those who force them to kill innocent either in Kashmir or in Punjab.

@Icarus


You should be happy that non-Muslim have to use word Shaheed since there is no concept in Hinduism of martyr.

Those fallen men are oppressors, murderers, thieves and rapists. They are pure evil by nature. That fact should never be forgotton.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

It is enough to read this thread to understand that shaheed and shahadat does
not translate well into martyr.
English speaking persons see the talk about Martyrdom as ridiculous, and degrading to the concept.
Better then to chose Your own term to get respect.
I do not claim to know what those terms should be, I leave this to You.
US patriots honour those in Military Service but use a completely different terminology.

Your bias is getting the best of you.

And we do use that word to describe our "martyrs".

The "Martyrs" list on Pak Army is called "Shuhada".

We have memorials commemorating our "Martyrs" called "Shuhada memorials".

In Islam there are several types of "Martyrs". Having different "status".

A child who dies going to school for education is a Shaheed, with a different status..

A soldier who dies in war is a Shaheed & has a different status.


You don't know nothing about Islam or about "Shahadat". (And frankly you are embarrassing yourself.)

Instead you are moaning about the word "Martyr" which isn't a "biblical" word rather an English word.

Similiar to "God".. a word used by "ALL RELIGIONs"..

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

^^^
@zootinali
Looks like dhattpunjabi is back wid a new id
well,,veergati is also sacrificing oneself anyway,
I presume,'Rightful' as it is defined by god n well 'allahs path' pretty mch makes it religious,,whereas veergati isnt religious(as far as i know)

You are using "shahadat" which has a different concept for a word basically meaning a "dignified" death?

Oh dear bhayye,,they will be forgotten,,believe me
Memory of bhayya ppl is pretty short.
Just like the rape n plunder of qasims,ghuaris n ghaznavis has been forgooten by modern day pakistanis.well kashmiris may even name thr roads after Indian army gernails,,is it possible,offcourse

You suck at history.

Pak isn't just panjab (which itself is diverse,unlike eastern or Indian panjab).

And at the time of ghori (most of his kin are "Pakistanis" too) Panjab was "already" Muslim and most evil "panjab is" were already aligned with either the "Pashtuns" or "Mughals"... both of whom ruled Delhi...

But how would a north East Indian, discriminated by his own "north" Indian countrymen know of such complicated history.

At that time, you people were living in jungle and head hunting each other over stupid jungle wars.

 

[Dhara]

Those fallen men are oppressors, murderers, thieves and rapists. They are pure evil by nature. That fact should never be forgotton.

I disagrees with you, they are just doing their duty.

Those who refuses orders like me sent to hell in I.A.

I refuse my C.O to go undercover as Punjab Police officers to hunt down freedom fighters, I refused, they court martial me and since then I am out of Indian after prison term, My family snatched away by them, feed them that i am terrorist supporter, snatched my passport and Made me to leave India on my cousin passport, he died few years back and now I am in Japan living illegally since my passport expired and there is no chance to renew it.

Soldiers can risk their lives but can't risk their families, I did but now I am homeless no family, sleeping living in a warehouse and may be buried in unmarked grave or possibly sent back to India where I would died or executed as traitor.

^^^
@zootinali
Looks like dhattpunjabi is back wid a new id

@Icarus

Kindly take care of Sanghi troll kids.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

I disagrees with you, they are just doing their duty.

Those who refuses orders like me sent to hell in I.A.

I refuse my C.O to go undercover as Punjab Police officers to hunt down freedom fighters, I refused, they court martial me and since then I am out of Indian after prison term, My family snatched away by them, feed them that i am terrorist supporter, snatched my passport and Made me to leave India on my cousin passport, he died few years back and now I am in Japan living illegally since my passport expired and there is no chance to renew it.

Soldiers can risk their lives but can't risk their families, I did but now I am homeless no family, sleeping living in a warehouse and may be buried in unmarked grave or possibly sent back to India where I would died or executed as traitor.


@Icarus

Kindly take care of Sanghi troll kids.

Are you being serious?......are you actually an indian soldier?