Should Kashmir get a chance to decide their future through Referendum?

[INDIC]

UP, Bihar, Gujarat & Hyderabad had many Muslims spread across. Although they might not have majority areas but still they had sizable populations. Hyderabad and Junagarh were ruled by Muslims but had Hindu majority whereas Kashmir was ruled by Hindu but had Muslim majority.

So funny, your leaders even wanted to sacrifice the two nation theory(that Hindu and Muslims can't live together) when it came to claim Hyderabad and Junagadh with 85% Hindu majority. Moreover, UP, Bihar and Gujarat had 85% Hindu majority, its only day dreaming to even think about it when you even struggled for East Punjab and West Bengal.

 

[Jackdaws]

everything you said `is irrelevant… referendum will be held in IOK and azad kashmir.

Nope. It won't.

And that's where the notion of a plebiscite falls flat on the ground, because if there was a choice, an independent country is what most would seek within the Valley. The belief by many of my Pakistani friends here that the entire troubled region of Kashmir is clamouring to join Pakistan is quite mistaken.

Jammu is Hindu majority (65%) and Ladakh has a sizeable Buddhist population (45%-50%). Any strife and feeling for 'azadi' is very much Valley-centric. However, I have a close Pakistani friend who visited Srinagar from the UK in July, with his wife and family. His wife's uncle is in the judiciary in Srinagar.

I asked him what it was like, what he came across, what did the locals say to him. He said that almost everyone he spoke to said that if they were to get azadi, that would mean independence. No one desired to join Pakistan, nor was there any love for India. The anger towards India was apparent when they mentioned the sacrifices they'd made, the men and women they'd lost.

What he did also mention is that India is investing considerable amounts within J&K, micro-financing and credit agreements to help with business creation are in full throttle, and infrastructure and expenditure is something the GoI hopes will win over Kashmiris.

Our infatuation with Kashmir despite the desperate troubles and problems we face continues to boggle the mind. I spoke to my cousin in Pakistan earlier and he was complaining about the load-shedding (1 hour on, 1 hour off). We're at the end of September, and load-shedding is still a daily cancer. Is that what we're waiting to bless those of Srinagar with?

LoC as the permanent border is the only realistic solution. Let's work to implement that, and let's close this sore chapter once and for all.

LoC as border with free movement of goods and people. I am sure the Irish have that kind of arrangement.

 

[Dubious]

Wow!! I didnt know democratic India thought their citizens how not to give people their rights!

Really shameful act on the word democracy!

Even they are not so confident enough so much that they prefer taking rights away! Death of democracy the rights of whole ethnic group is not allowed...

And those whose argument is its India's land...then that is such a sad argument....It is the Kashmir ppl's land I am not sure how hard is it to say that like Scotland is the land of the Scots though it maybe under UK but it still doesnt kill the fact that it is the land of the Scots...Likewise Catalan is the land of the Catalan people though that is under Spain but no one can say it is NOT THEIR LAND

Their land their choice....they rights that is what democracy is! EQUAL RIGHTS!

 

[DGMO]

LoC as border with free movement of goods and people. I am sure the Irish have that kind of arrangement.

I agree on that arrangement in principle. The only concern is enforcing stringent security checks so that rogue elements from Pakistan don't take advantage of such a solution for their own evil goals.

A lot of work remains to be done on our side from eliminating and dismantling extremist networks which feed off the 'destroy India' narrative. Sadly, it's not a quick fix.

 

[shuntmaster]

UP, Bihar, Gujarat & Hyderabad had many Muslims spread across. Although they might not have majority areas but still they had sizable populations.

They all have Pakistan if they wish to live in an Islamic state.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Referendum seems too idealistic if it ever happened all those weapons that were piled for decades would be useless

 

[Joeblow]

I'm sorry if i'm drawing the wrong conclusion here but you seemed to imply Junagadh wasn't a princely state which is absolutely wrong. The state of Junagadh was ruled by Mohammad Mahabat Khanji III (1911 - 1948) like Kashmir was ruled by Hari Singh (1925-1947).
Now since both Kashmir and Junagadh were princely states, why did India treat each of them differently? If you're state policy is to take the say of rulers of the state to be final, then Kashmir belongs to India and Junagadh belongs to Pakistan. But if you believe that people of princely state should have the right to decide their future then why don't you grant Kashmiris their right of self-determination as you gave this right to people of Junagadh?
See, this is the hypocrisy i'm talking about.

India didn't treat them differently Pakistan did. On the one hand, they gladly accepted the accession of hindu majority Junagadh BEFORE anything had happened with Kashmir but then whine about Hari Singh's decision to accede to India.

The UN resolution requires that Pakistan remove all your troops from J & K which includes G-B and AK. Once you've met the requirements of the resolution, call us and we can have that plebiscite that Pakistan is always talking about.

 

[Joeblow]

If a referendum was held asking whether to join Pakistan or India, Kashmir would opt to join Pakistan. If given chance of independence they would opt for that (maybe). Most Kashmiris hate India and that is fact no one can ignore nor deny. Both Pakistan and India should make an agreement, of holding a plebiscite/referendum in whole of Kashmir to solve the issue peacefully. Only people who reject a democratic referendum are those small-minded, selfish, immature, and fanatical people who don't want peace for the region.

If given a choice the Kashmiris of the valley would chose freedom. Jammu and Ladakh would choose India. There are some comprehensive polls out there by Peace Polls. You should take look at them before making blanket statements. India has majority support in Jammu and Ladakh. Even in the Kashmir valley, 69% of the muslims said it was unacceptable to join Pakistan. In fact, even after all that has happened in the last 25 years, India enjoys more support than Pakistan. If that doesn't tell how little the Kashmiris think of you, I don't know what will.

 

[A1Kaid]

If given a choice the Kashmiris of the valley would chose freedom. Jammu and Ladakh would choose India. There are some comprehensive polls out there by Peace Polls. You should take look at them before making blanket statements. India has majority support in Jammu and Ladakh. Even in the Kashmir valley, 69% of the muslims said it was unacceptable to join Pakistan. In fact, even after all that has happened in the last 25 years, India enjoys more support than Pakistan. If that doesn't tell how little the Kashmiris think of you, I don't know what will.

You delusional Indian, contrary to your imagination and fabricated polls. Reality is quite the opposite.


Nov. 2010

Srinagar 2009

March 2013 Srinagar

 

[Joeblow]

You delusional Indian, contrary to your imagination and fabricated polls. Reality is quite the opposite.


Nov. 2010

Srinagar 2009
View attachment 95243


View attachment 95244



March 2013 Srinagar
View attachment 95245

Unless that's the entire population of Kashmir hoisting the Pakistani flag, my post stands. The valley wants freedom, not a union with Pakistan. There's a Pakistani poster who says the exact same thing as me. I may be biased. How about him? He goes a lot further than me and asks what Pakistan has to offer the Kashmiris. I was too polite to ask the that question. So really it is you who is delusional here to think that Kashmiris are going to accept being in a worse situation than their current one i.e a union with Pakistan.

 

[Kabira]

If given a choice the Kashmiris of the valley would chose freedom. Jammu and Ladakh would choose India. There are some comprehensive polls out there by Peace Polls. You should take look at them before making blanket statements. India has majority support in Jammu and Ladakh. Even in the Kashmir valley, 69% of the muslims said it was unacceptable to join Pakistan. In fact, even after all that has happened in the last 25 years, India enjoys more support than Pakistan. If that doesn't tell how little the Kashmiris think of you, I don't know what will.

This is bs, you know it very well pahari/nepali types of Jammu hindus will join India. But Kashmiris would rather be with their dardic brethren across the border. Pakistani will not mind independent Kashmir, in that case nepali types will probably have to move to Nepal. Thats why Chenab formula is best one, hindu majority Jammu city stays with India. And muslim majority areas join Pakistan.

 

[Joeblow]

This is bs, you know it very well pahari/nepali types of Jammu hindus will join India. But Kashmiris would rather be with their dardic brethren across the border. Pakistani will not mind independent Kashmir, in that case nepali types will probably have to move to Nepal. Thats why Chenab formula is best one, hindu majority Jammu city stays with India. And muslim majority areas join Pakistan.

Believe whatever you want, the reality is that Kashmiris don't want to join Pakistan. They want freedom. Its not just me saying it. There's a Pakistani poster on this very thread saying exactly the same thing as me albeit a lot more bluntly than me. He asked the question, what does Pakistan have to offer these people?

 

[Kabira]

Believe whatever you want, the reality is that Kashmiris don't want to join Pakistan. They want freedom. Its not just me saying it. There's a Pakistani poster on this very thread saying exactly the same thing as me albeit a lot more bluntly than me. He asked the question, what does Pakistan have to offer these people?

Which harami **** said that? Please tag him. Anyway we don't mind independent Kashmir at all. As long as IoK is also free. But in that case nepalis will have to move out, do you want that? Or better solution is Chenab formula?

Think logically and for your nepali kin.

 

[Joeblow]

Which harami **** said that? Please tag him. Anyway we don't mind independent Kashmir at all. As long as IoK is also free. But in that case nepalis will have to move out, do you want that? Or better solution is Chenab formula?

Think logically and for your nepali kin.

Right now, India has no incentive to do anything. There is nothing any of the interested parties can do to them to make them change there mind. So status quo will prevail. You just need to deal with that

 

[American Pakistani]

They all have Pakistan if they wish to live in an Islamic state.

By that logic Hindus in Punjab & Bengal had India to live in and both of those states should've been merged with Pakistan.