SAC FC-31 Stealth Fighter: News & Discussions

[Akasa]

I think it's overly optimistic to have the FC-31 (assuming it has already won the tender) to be operational on the first 003 carrier, which is set to launch in 2020. Maybe on later variants, but given PLAN conservatism and the developmental obstacles likely to come, I highly suspect J-15 CATOBAR variant will be the mainstay of carrier aviation for years to come. For the FC-31 to become the next generation carrier fighter, it needs to have suitable engines ... which the WS-13/RD-93 currently does not offer.

Assuming that the enlargement of its wings and addition of catapult-compatible landing gear takes until 2019 (it'll probably be sooner), the FC-31 would be good to go by the early 2020s, when the first Type 003 will likely be commissioned. The SAC development team has almost half a decade to modify the existing FC-31 design, which is already quite mature at this point, with technologies that have already been built and tested.

We don't have any evidence of that yet. Heck, we don't even have evidence the FC-31 has the edge in the naval tender. Last I heard, it seems that the J-20 has the edge ... unless the FC-31 finds suitable engines in time, I doubt its prospects. Besides, we have only seen the J-15 CATOBAR variant conducting tests on the steam and EM catapult ... no FC-31 yet.

There is no evidence suggesting that the PLAN has assessed the J-20 to have an "edge"; in fact, commentary from virtually all PLAN personnel suggests that they're heavily favoring the FC-31 over the J-20 (at least in their personal opinions). The prototype of the WS-19 engine (EJ200 equivalent) is under construction, with an expected entry-into-service date of 2022, which happens to be the projected commissioning date for the Type 003 and the IOC date for the FC-31 program.

 

[帅的一匹]

Why? The J-20 can indeed be modified for carrier aviation ... and its developmental cycle is definitely more mature than that of the FC-31. We don't even know much about the latter's subsystems or stealth at all ...

FC31 is for type 003 carrier, still has five years to test. J20 fuselage is designed for high speed and air superiority, not for low speed landing and take off on carrier. More importantly, J20's canards is not close coupled like Rafale, it means it will perform no good in low speed. Further modification on fuselage will destroyed J20's advantage.

J20 is too big to have it in numbers on our new carrier.

If you shorten the J20, it will ruin it's canards/strake/delta wing aerodynamics configuration, which means it loose it's advantage.

 

[Deino]

No sir @Deino sir is absolutely on the spot, it has no wing folding mechanism, need to increase wing span/area, and rear of the fuselage should be redesigned according to carrier ops

You are indeed correct and sorry for the confusing post. I did not mean that the V2 in its current form is carrier-capable (that's for sure) but maybe its centre fuselage has already all necessary structural features to be carrier-capable so that a true V3-variant only needs larger wings and so on?

It was just an idea...

Deino

 

[Akasa]

You are indeed correct and sorry for the confusing post. I did not mean that the V2 in its current form is carrier-capable (that's for sure) but maybe its centre fuselage has already all necessary structural features to be carrier-capable so that a true V3-variant only needs larger wings and so on?

It was just an idea...

Deino

I wouldn't be surprised if that were the case; even its landing gears have twin wheels which suggest potential carrier use in the future. It would still require extensive modification of the wings but perhaps not to the extent of F-35A vs F-35C.

 

[ozranger]

The so called FC-31 was selected news comes from 2 paid hype makers as I know. I don't know what their purpose is but they could deeply embarrass SAC fans later on. The major flaw in this story is that they stated FC-31 was also selected by PAF.

Official source from AVIC recently revealed that CAC has just started the design work on JF-17 Block III. While there is no sign that India will acquire F-35 or Su-57 very soon, why PAF would invest that big on such an immature aircraft together with ongoing hard work on JF-17 Block III at the same time?

Any Pakistani friends with credible information can correct me if I am wrong on it.

Further down the track, assuming PAF really picks FC-31, SAC would need to work on a land based version and a carrier based version simultaneously. In that case, what would be the priority for SAC?

Think about this, by the moment, FC-31 has only ONE prototype flying on each version respectively. Only an extremely low IQ would say its land based version is mature enough.

That means, Pakistan might need to pay big or even full for further development of this land based version. Does it sound financially reasonable?

I would rather bet on a JF-17 Block III with significantly reduced RCS instead of that FC-31 wins all shit. I think CAC is further modifying the fuselage now with strong stealth elements incorporated. That's why the importance of the new design work was stressed in the media.

Just like this one (photo from an event for CP members on the JF-17 project)

 

[ozranger]

I also noticed an interesting thing which shows some sign of relationship between PLAAF and SAC.

We all know that J-20 had gone through stealth tests in open space at 2 different places with stealth test facilities as there are clear satellite photos of it.

Recently SAC has published a public report which says they have completed building their own open space stealth test facilities in their own stealth test center.

The biggest question is why they can't just reuse those existing ones for J-20 testing, at most with some modification or improvement.

I guess all those existing facilities don't belong to AVIC. They should be solely owned by PLAAF. For some reason SAC just doesn't want to reuse them even though it should not be hard as they are a state owned company.

So at least we can know that PLAAF is not endorsing FC-31 at all.

 

[Akasa]

The so called FC-31 was selected news comes from 2 paid hype makers as I know. I don't know what their purpose is but they could deeply embarrass SAC fans later on. The major flaw in this story is that they stated FC-31 was also selected by PAF.

Official source from AVIC recently revealed that CAC has just started the design work on JF-17 Block III. While there is no sign that India will acquire F-35 or Su-57 very soon, why PAF would invest that big on such an immature aircraft together with ongoing hard work on JF-17 Block III at the same time?

Any Pakistani friends with credible information can correct me if I am wrong on it.

Further down the track, assuming PAF really picks FC-31, SAC would need to work on a land based version and a carrier based version simultaneously. In that case, what would be the priority for SAC?

Think about this, by the moment, FC-31 has only ONE prototype flying on each version respectively. Only an extremely low IQ would say its land based version is mature enough.

That means, Pakistan might need to pay big or even full for further development of this land based version. Does it sound financially reasonable?

I would rather bet on a JF-17 Block III with significantly reduced RCS instead of that FC-31 wins all shit. I think CAC is further modifying the fuselage now with strong stealth elements incorporated. That's why the importance of the new design work was stressed in the media.

Just like this one (photo from an event for CP members on the JF-17 project)
View attachment 445747

Instead, I think that a low-RCS JF-17 Block III is a truly rudimentary mistake and quite an inappropriate idea. The JF-17 is inherently too small to incorporate internal or lateral weapons bays, which makes any significant RCS reductions to its airframes irrelevant. Furthermore, airframe constraints mean that any significant changes to it, such as during a RCS-optimized redesign, would essentially render it a new aircraft. The JF-17 is also unlikely to carry external stealthy weapons pods since the Chinese haven't developed any.

The news of PAF purchasing the FC-31 comes from a recent statement by a PAF official stating that they're planning the procurement and potential production of a 5th generation fighter, with many observers suspecting that the FC-31 is involved. A few notable PAF observers also claimed that Pakistani officials visited SAC factory during the 2016 Zhuhai Airshow.

I don't think developing both a land-based and carrier-based variant is out of the question since the bulk of the fuselage would be common between the two. In fact, Lockheed Martin had no problem manufacturing three different variants of the F-35.

 

[ozranger]

Instead, I think that a low-RCS JF-17 Block III is a truly rudimentary mistake and quite an inappropriate idea. The JF-17 is inherently too small to incorporate internal or lateral weapons bays, which makes any significant RCS reductions to its airframes irrelevant. Furthermore, airframe constraints mean that any significant changes to it, such as during a RCS-optimized redesign, would essentially render it a new aircraft. The JF-17 is also unlikely to carry external stealthy weapons pods since the Chinese haven't developed any.

The news of PAF purchasing the FC-31 comes from a recent statement by a PAF official stating that they're planning the procurement and potential production of a 5th generation fighter, with many observers suspecting that the FC-31 is involved. A few notable PAF observers also claimed that Pakistani officials visited SAC factory during the 2016 Zhuhai Airshow.

I don't think developing both a land-based and carrier-based variant is out of the question since the bulk of the fuselage would be common between the two. In fact, Lockheed Martin had no problem manufacturing three different variants of the F-35.

Well the thing is there seems to be a V-tail JF-17 Block III now. The photo is so much more credible than those rumors and hypes you just mentioned.

The shape of the aft fuselage looks highly detailed and genuine.

 

[Akasa]

Well the thing is there seems to be a V-tail JF-17 Block III now. The photo is so much more credible than those rumors and hypes you just mentioned.

When have these images accurately reflected how an aircraft actually turned out to be? Take these PR photos with a grain of salt.

 

[waja2000]

I think it's overly optimistic to have the FC-31 (assuming it has already won the tender) to be operational on the first 003 carrier, which is set to launch in 2020. Maybe on later variants, but given PLAN conservatism and the developmental obstacles likely to come, I highly suspect J-15 CATOBAR variant will be the mainstay of carrier aviation for years to come. For the FC-31 to become the next generation carrier fighter, it needs to have suitable engines ... which the WS-13/RD-93 currently does not offer.
....

agree, i think FC-31 if want become navy version need slightly increase wing size to accommodate more fuel and folder wings.

 

[Deino]

 

[Imran Khan]

View attachment 449051

seems like f-15 parked hehehe cool

 

[Blue Marlin]

seems like f-15 parked hehehe cool

what kind of f-15's are you looking at?

 

[Rank]

View attachment 449051

Surprised to see the built quality... rough and hard... looks similar to Knight Hawk

 

[Beethoven]

@Deino how true are the rumours that the second prototype of FC-31 is powered by the WS-19 and if it is true then can the same be used to power the JF-17 block 3??????