Russia and Saudi Arabia form alliance against insurgents in Syria

[The SiLent crY]

That Caliph is not recognized by the Muslim world. To be a Caliph you have to be democratically chosen by representatives of almost every tribe, if he was recognized as a Caliph; there would be a world-wide Muslim revolution aimed at toppling the current Muslim governments. A Caliphate is very unlikely until 2023, when the treaty of lausanne's restriction of forming a caliphate, officially ends.

As far as I know caliphate is exactly what Mr Baghdadi is doing . Even the first three caliphates did not peacefully and democratically take power and used force .

 

[gangsta_rap]

Even the first three caliphates did not peacefully and democratically take power and used force .

Lets not go there...

 

[The SiLent crY]

Can I claim myself as a caliph with my caliphate being my house and garden?

Im not religious but it seems a good way to attract idiots to do your bidding.

Why not ? , We have more stupid people in history who actually became real caliphates .

Don't underestimate yourself .

 

[Falcon29]

Why not ? , We have more stupid people in history who actually became real caliphates .

Don't underestimate yourself .

Always looking for trouble sectarian asshat.

 

[Saif al-Arab]

Contrary to popular belief that some ignorants here have propagandized recently and in the past KSA-Russia relations are not that bad at all. They have improved a lot in recent months evident of the significant KSA-Russia deals signed.

The main difference in Syria solely involves the future of the Al-Assad regime. KSA rightly (IMO) is of the opinion that the Al-Assad regime has no future in Syria. Russia on the other hand fears that they could lose Syria as a future partner if the Al-Assad regime collapses fully. One of the very few partners in the Arab world that they have left. Contrary to the times during the Cold War where half of the Arab world was under the Soviet sphere of influence. Today only Algeria is left and partially Iraq and nowadays Egypt although the US is still the main player in those two countries.

Russia sees itself as a superpower and like every superpower it has imperialistic ambitions contrary to speeches made by Putin who criticizes the US for acting like an imperialistic power.

What there is 100% agreement on is the danger of ISIS and similar groups in Syria. There have never been any differences there. In fact no single state/current regime supports ISIS as that would be/is a direct threat to their own rule.

What I could very well see happening down the line is some kind of deal that would either remove the Al-Assad regime or heavily reform it depending on the situation on the ground.

In any case there is no way that the Al-Assad regime will ever regain full control of Syria let alone have any legitimacy left to rule a future Syria for another 4 decades. I think that the Al-Assad regime is bound to end when Bashar dies regardless of what happens on the ground. Similarly with ISIS, Al-Nusra etc. obviously.

A future democratic Syria and in fact a future democratic Arab world is inevitable down the road. The sooner it happens the better. Regimes, organizations, external foreign players etc. can delay it all they want to. Time will do its job. Tunisia has shown the light. Others will follow in our lifetime.

 

[ultron]

Contrary to popular belief that some ignorants here have propagandized recently and in the past KSA-Russia relations are not that bad at all. They have improved a lot in recent months evident of the significant KSA-Russia deals signed.

The main difference in Syria solely involves the future of the Al-Assad regime. KSA rightly (IMO) is of the opinion that the Al-Assad regime has no future in Syria. Russia on the other hand fears that they could lose Syria as a future partner if the Al-Assad regime collapses fully. One of the very few partners in the Arab world that they have left. Contrary to the times during the Cold War where half of the Arab world was under the Soviet sphere of influence. Today only Algeria is left and partially Iraq and nowadays Egypt although the US is still the main player in those two countries.

Russia sees itself as a superpower and like every superpower it has imperialistic ambitions contrary to speeches made by Putin who criticizes the US for acting like an imperialistic power.

What there is 100% agreement on is the danger of ISIS and similar groups in Syria. There have never been any differences there. In fact no single state/current regime supports ISIS as that would be/is a direct threat to their own rule.

What I could very well see happening down the line is some kind of deal that would either remove the Al-Assad regime or heavily reform it depending on the situation on the ground.

In any case there is no way that the Al-Assad regime will ever regain full control of Syria let alone have any legitimacy left to rule a future Syria for another 4 decades. I think that the Al-Assad regime is bound to end when Bashar dies regardless of what happens on the ground. Similarly with ISIS, Al-Nusra etc. obviously.

A future democratic Syria and in fact a future democratic Arab world is inevitable down the road. The sooner it happens the better. Regimes, organizations, external foreign players etc. can delay it all they want to. Time will do its job. Tunisia has shown the light. Others will follow in our lifetime.

IMO Saudi Arabia should ally with Assad against Israel. Saudi Arabia hates Israel. Assad hates Israel. Win win for both.

 

[Falcon29]

Contrary to popular belief that some ignorants here have propagandized recently and in the past KSA-Russia relations are not that bad at all. They have improved a lot in recent months evident of the significant KSA-Russia deals signed.

The main difference in Syria solely involves the future of the Al-Assad regime. KSA rightly (IMO) is of the opinion that the Al-Assad regime has no future in Syria. Russia on the other hand fears that they could lose Syria as a future partner if the Al-Assad regime collapses fully. One of the very few partners in the Arab world that they have left. Contrary to the times during the Cold War where half of the Arab world was under the Soviet sphere of influence. Today only Algeria is left and partially Iraq and nowadays Egypt although the US is still the main player in those two countries.

Russia sees itself as a superpower and like every superpower it has imperialistic ambitions contrary to speeches made by Putin who criticizes the US for acting like an imperialistic power.

What there is 100% agreement on is the danger of ISIS and similar groups in Syria. There have never been any differences there. In fact no single state/current regime supports ISIS as that would be/is a direct threat to their own rule.

What I could very well see happening down the line is some kind of deal that would either remove the Al-Assad regime or heavily reform it depending on the situation on the ground.

In any case there is no way that the Al-Assad regime will ever regain full control of Syria let alone have any legitimacy left to rule a future Syria for another 4 decades. I think that the Al-Assad regime is bound to end when Bashar dies regardless of what happens on the ground. Similarly with ISIS, Al-Nusra etc. obviously.

A future democratic Syria and in fact a future democratic Arab world is inevitable down the road. The sooner it happens the better. Regimes, organizations, external foreign players etc. can delay it all they want to. Time will do its job. Tunisia has shown the light. Others will follow in our lifetime.

So you're basically saying even if 5 million Syrians are killed, it wouldn't matter as the primary goal is preserving rule of local regimes. In other words Assad is here to stay, so stop demanding he step down if you acknowledge that this is all about retaining thrones. Which will stay that way as long as the 380 million non-Palestinian, non-Syrian Arabs continue worshiping their regimes if it means Palestinians and Syrians face genocide and suffering. That's not to say ISIS is positive for development. ISIS's focus isn't on development it's on fighting to uproot all forms of rule that's not religious 'divine' Caliphate. But to say Arabs only oppose ISIS is misleading, they literally mean every single rebel group in Syria, maybe with a couple exceptions because people that pursue freedom scare Arab regimes.

 

[Saif al-Arab]

So you're basically saying even if 5 million Syrians are killed, it wouldn't matter as the primary goal is preserving rule of local regimes. In other words Assad is here to stay, so stop demanding he step down if you acknowledge that this is all about retaining thrones. Which will stay that way as long as the 380 million non-Palestinian, non-Syrian Arabs continue worshiping their regimes if it means Palestinians and Syrians face genocide and suffering. That's not to say ISIS is positive for development. ISIS's focus isn't on development it's on fighting to uproot all forms of rule that's not religious 'divine' Caliphate. But to say Arabs only oppose ISIS is misleading, they literally mean every single rebel group in Syria, maybe with a couple exceptions because people that pursue freedom scare Arab regimes.

What I am saying is that every regime in the world agrees with the need to remove groups like ISIS and Al-Nusra as those groups and their ideology are direct threats to them. There is no surprise in that. Both KSA and Russia can agree with each other on this front. Not only them but every state somehow involved in the civil war.

That's not to say that countries like the US, KSA, other GCC states, Turkey, Iran etc. share the same opinions in regards to the future of Syria.

My opinion which matters nothing just like yours and every ones else's here has not changed and will not change. I am against the Al-Assad regime and ISIS, Al-Nusra etc. Different sides of the same coin to me and all are an obstacle for a future hopefully strong, peaceful and democratic Syria and Arab world.

Also let's be honest here. This is mostly an internal Syrian conflict and this conflict would never have occurred in the first place had Syria been a successful country. Same story with Iraq and every other failed country in the Muslim world. Locals in those countries need to take responsibility and fight for their rights. No states have any moral obligations to help them. Those are only morals that we as individuals based on our religious or political beliefs create. I am starting to understand why most people only worry about their domestic affairs nowadays especially in the Muslim world. Too much trouble and too little responsibility taken by locals in conflict zones.

 

[Falcon29]

What I am saying is that every regime in the world agrees with the need to remove groups like ISIS and Al-Nusra as those groups and their ideology are direct threats to them. There is no surprise in that. Both KSA and Russia can agree with each other on this front. Not only them but every state somehow involved in the civil war.

That's not to say that countries like the US, KSA, other GCC states, Turkey, Iran etc. share the same opinions in regards to the future of Syria.

My opinion which matters nothing just like yours and every ones else's here has not changed and will not change. I am against the Al-Assad regime and ISIS, Al-Nusra etc. Different sides of the same coin to me and all are an obstacle towards a future hopefully strong, peaceful and democratic Syria and Arab world.

Also let's be honest here. This is mostly an internal Syrian conflict and this conflict would never have occurred in the first place had Syria been a successful country. Same story with Iraq and every other failed country in the Muslim world. Locals in those countries need to take responsibility.

My point is the Palestinians and Syrians are the only two Arab peoples leading uprising. The rest of you aren't. Instead you're justifying the continued repression of both peoples since them achieving their freedom is somehow interlinked with your monarchs/military dictatorships collapses. The blame lies on non-Syrian/Palestinian Arabs.

 

[Saif al-Arab]

IMO Saudi Arabia should ally with Assad against Israel. Saudi Arabia hates Israel. Assad hates Israel. Win win for both.

The Israel card is outdated and won't work. Besides the Al-Assad regime is not against Israel or vice versa. Nor will KSA ever ally with the Al-Assad regime. It makes no sense. If that happens I will completely stop following events in the ME/Muslim world.

 

[SALMAN F]

What I am saying is that every regime in the world agrees with the need to remove groups like ISIS and Al-Nusra as those groups and their ideology are direct threats to them. There is no surprise in that. Both KSA and Russia can agree with each other on this front. Not only them but every state somehow involved in the civil war.

That's not to say that countries like the US, KSA, other GCC states, Turkey, Iran etc. share the same opinions in regards to the future of Syria.

My opinion which matters nothing just like yours and every ones else's here has not changed and will not change. I am against the Al-Assad regime and ISIS, Al-Nusra etc. Different sides of the same coin to me and all are an obstacle for a future hopefully strong, peaceful and democratic Syria and Arab world.

Also let's be honest here. This is mostly an internal Syrian conflict and this conflict would never have occurred in the first place had Syria been a successful country. Same story with Iraq and every other failed country in the Muslim world. Locals in those countries need to take responsibility and fight for their rights. No states have any moral obligations to help them. Those are only morals that we as individuals based on our religious or political beliefs create. I am starting to understand why most people only worry about their domestic affairs nowadays especially in the Muslim world. Too much trouble and too little responsibility taken by locals in conflict zones.

Hazzy the glorious is gone now we have Falcon the great the agnostic

 

[ultron]

Hazzy the glorious is gone now we have Falcon the great the agnostic

What happened to Hazzy?

The Israel card is outdated and won't work. Besides the Al-Assad regime is not against Israel or vice versa. Nor will KSA ever ally with the Al-Assad regime. It makes no sense. If that happens I will completely stop following events in the ME/Muslim world.

Israel annexed Golan from Syria. Of course Syria will always be enemy of Israel.

 

[Saif al-Arab]

My point is the Palestinians and Syrians are the only two Arab peoples leading uprising. The rest of you aren't. Instead you're justifying the continued repression of both peoples since them achieving their freedom is somehow interlinked with your monarchs/military dictatorships collapses. The blame lies on non-Syrian/Palestinian Arabs.

Which uprising? Is half of Syria not fully in the control of Al-Assad? Are millions of Syrians not supporting status quo (Al-Assad regime)? They are. Is the West Bank (almost all of Palestine) not ruled by the same party that has ruled Palestine since forever? Also how do they differ from Tunisians who actually initiated the "Arab Spring" and have something successful to show for it? Or all the other countless uprisings, protest movements that you can find at different levels in every Arab country? I don't buy that notion at all.

The same fundamental core problems are seen in every country. Of course the potency of those problems differ.

The reality is that not all Arab regimes are the same and that they differ in terms of popularity and success. It makes no sense for the average GCC citizens to make any uprisings when they live 100 times better lives than most other Arabs/Muslims and people in the world for that matter.

The average person in the Muslim world is not politically active but is worried about day to day events and making their lives and families as successful (well-off) as possible. Basic stuff that most of the world worries about. West, East, South and North.

Most people have lost the hope in any political reforms or progress in the current state of affairs (wars and conflicts engulfing too many countries) and frankly I don't blame them. It's easy for us to sit in the West and criticize. Try to live in that environment or try to change things in those countries. Speaking about such matters openly is a danger for you.

That's not to say that significant reforms are not needed.

Also I am not sure why you discuss this with me when I have always been against the status quo. You should discuss such topics with the regime supports across the Muslim world.

I am pro-KSA for obvious reason and pro-Arab. That does not mean being pro-regime (s).

I don't think that we disagree with the fundamentals anyway so no point discussing this topic. Even before you turned into an agnostic that was the case.

In any case I am starting to lose interest in the politics of the region and will just let time do it's cause. I won't be able to change anything either way and I am just wasting my time. As you are and everyone else "involved".

Hazzy the glorious is gone now we have Falcon the great the agnostic

I don't care about people's personal beliefs. Never did. Only what they write if I have a discussion with them.

 

[SALMAN F]

What happened to Hazzy?




Israel annexed Golan from Syria. Of course Syria will always be enemy of Israel.

Hazzy is falcon29 who was a radical Islamist but became agnostic recently

 

[Falcon29]

Which uprising? Is half of Syria not fully in the control of Al-Assad? Are millions of Syrians not supporting status quo (Al-Assad regime)? They are. Is the West Bank (almost all of Palestine) not ruled by the same party that has ruled Palestine since forever? Also how do they differ from Tunisians who actually initiated the "Arab Spring" and have something successful to show for it? Or all the other countless uprisings, protest movements that you can find at different levels in every Arab country? I don't buy that notion at all.

The same fundamental core problems are seen in every country. Of course the potency of those problems differ.

The reality is that not all Arab regimes are the same and that they differ in terms of popularity and success. It makes no sense for the average GCC citizens to make any uprisings when they live 100 times better lives than most other Arabs/Muslims and people in the world for that matter.

That's not to say that significant reforms are not needed.

Also I am not sure why you discuss this with me when I have always been against the status quo. You should discuss such topics with the regime supports across the Muslim world.

In any case I am starting to lose interest in the politics of the region and will just let time do it's cause. I won't be able to change anything either way and I am just wasting my time. As you are and everyone else "involved".

The Palestinians who support status quo in West Bank are asshats. Unlike most parties in the Middle East, I am not a hypocrite and will call all people in the wrong out. But in the ME, all parties whether Muslim Brotherhood, ISIS, Iran, GCC, Israel all hold double standard with Iran, GCC and Israel being the worst hypocrites. They and their supporters are heartless people who support cruelty. My beef is that instead of coming out, saying we want progress and to be left alone and no change in status quo, they go out giving people some hope. And the Syrian people fell victim to this, they thought they had something standing behind them only to now realize that is totally not the case and now they're getting killed by everybody and their nation has become playground for world powers and their cruel supporters who have no humanity.

Hazzy is falcon29 who was a radical Islamist but became agnostic recently

Radical? What are you talking about? All I was an honest/good person who had some hope in Islamist movements, still an honest/good person that no longer has hope in any of you or religion.