Russia All set to lose the Indian defense market

[Ticker]

India now has other sources available to purchase her arms from. However, it will take a lot more time for them to completely shift from existing Russian origin weapon systems and platforms to the western available systems. India though would still retain the alternative and the lure for the Russians, till Russian geopolitical imperatives force them to stop selling arms and equipment to India. It will be a cat and mouse game which is likely to continue for quite some time.

 

[sancho]

Mr. Sancho sir,
The Russians have been giving/selling some tech to us which are not generally avalable, how do you think the Russians are going to react when it comes to those requirements?

They did and continue to do so, because we will remain their biggst partner in terms of defence, all that changes is, the way we deal with each other in these procurements and developments!
India is not only a simple buyer anymore for them and we have plenty of alternative options. That means they either have to offer us more quality weapons, which can compete with western counterparts (which wasn't the case for Mig 35 or Mi28 for example), or jointly develop them with us (Brahmos, FGFA, MTA, offers for join tank and helicopter development are on as well). By offering us co-development we get more access to techs, spares and indigenous production, but also more say on design and customisations for Indian specific requirements. At the same time, they will get a reliable and financially strong partner and don't have to fear western competition anymore, because no western country freely offers us such high techs as Russia does. That's why we constantly rejects F35, because we benefit way more from FGFA, while Russia still will get it's 200 - 300 exported fighters, like they did with MKI.

People also don't see that Russia itself is changing it's defence industry and their policies in these fields in a big way! In Soviet times they developed and produced everything on their own, just like China does. But times are changing and Russia today has access to western arms, as well to western industries as well. They don't want to remain with low quality arms, nor with low quality civil techs as well, that's why they now join with Europeans and even US companies to procure techs (engines avionics...), to procure arms (LHDs, helicopters, armoured vehicles), or even to jointly develop them, just like we do as well. In the long term this will improve Russian forces, but also Russian industry, because they get increased quality and more exports as well.

So Russia today and India are doing the same in terms of diversifying arms, techs and industrial options, while both still remain comitted to eachother, because they need our big market and we need their technological knowledge.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Why are so many saying Russians are goin to get annoyed and or or look elsewhere for customers? The Indian defence spending is large enough for multiple players to easily coexist. Ongoin def fe deals with Russia already amount to in excess of $50 BN in the next 8 years- this is FAR more than thaey will get from ANYONE else for sure. The Russians have no right to be angry at India hey should be angry at themselves as all these deals are open tenders and are conducted on a technical and life cycle basis. Hence it is only because the Russians can't deliver comparably capable machines at affordable prices that they keep losing out. They surely can not begrudge a customer looking for the best they can get? Yes Russia no longer has a monopoly on the Indian defence market but this should be a catalyst for them to produce better products not sell any old cr@p. if the oppose competition that is 100% on them- no fault can be laid at India's door as all it is doing is asking for the best.

 

[somebozo]

The FGFA numbers have been cut to a third for the same precise reason of delay - we were to have a total of 3 prototypes of the FGFA one each in 2013, 2015, 2017 and the first roll out in 2018, now it's been pushed to 2020 which again is tentative.

This has been done owing to perpetual delays that has become synonymous with Russian manufacturing and R&D.

There is one more logical reason to it and that is - unmanned 5th generation drones/ aircrafts will be the norm in the 20'/30's and this delay will mean India having 5th generation manned crafts in those time frames.

There is definitely some slackness in Indo Russian defense programs and the Russians need to pull themselves together if they want the Indian market, the other option for them would be China and they are not comfortable with that plus the Chinese have started building their own systems.

Russia needs to buck up and come up to speed or else their defense global export pie will shrink considerably.

Everytime you guys bring this FGFA - ever heard about the delays on F22 and F35-Lightning II?? Making a 5th gen is not easy and Indians are already hurting the economic sources of Russia by procuring from West. Russian hardware is designed to face western threats and India is not going to face anything like the Russians.

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

Everytime you guys bring this FGFA - ever heard about the delays on F22 and F35-Lightning II?? Making a 5th gen is not easy and Indians are already hurting the economic sources of Russia by procuring from West. Russian hardware is designed to face western threats and India is not going to face anything like the Russians.

You do realize Russian is an energy power, main source of their income is not defence exports.

 

[illusion8]

Everytime you guys bring this FGFA - ever heard about the delays on F22 and F35-Lightning II?? Making a 5th gen is not easy and Indians are already hurting the economic sources of Russia by procuring from West. Russian hardware is designed to face western threats and India is not going to face anything like the Russians.

How come China is able to field 5th Gen fighters within couple of years - they claim to have a couple of them now - J20 and I think J16 under development..right? also they claim J 20 will be in production in what... 2016-17?




We should have collaborated with the Chinese on the 5th Gen program - we would have got a few prototypes by now.

 

[OrionHunter]

iTS BELIEVED even the FGFA will be russian only in airframe and engines

The pilots will be Indians of course!

 

[tvsram1992]

If one compares to delivery schedules of the US and Israel then on all counts Russia sucks, they consistently miss each and every delivery date.

but at the time of war russian support rocks , the other sucks ...

 

[illusion8]

but at the time of war russian support rocks , the other sucks ...

You cannot discount Israel and France.

Those were the times of the SU too.

 

[jha]

In your dream only....where is your friend in 1962?

Its 2012. Soviets were still taking the communist propaganda very seriously... BTW search " Cho La incident"... may be you will get a dose of reality. Dont reply with one liners if you dont know Jack.

 

[Audio]

Indian Russian friendship is not going anywhere. it is the strongest alliance in the world. so chillx and have fun. India and Russia trust each other like a child would trust his mother - unquestioned and total

you just cant admit it to yourself you are getting milked with that carrier, can you? So deluded.....

 

[asad71]

Russians have a lot of clout in India which will take few decades to erode. Russians know the way Indians do business. They take a share in the graft. During Soviet era, some portion had to be paid to Indian communists. Now the Russians collect themselves. Russians need the huge Indian outlet to finance their arms industry. And India is a ready dumping ground for surplus stores or eqpt that Russia is replacing or has replaced for her own use. Vikramaditay is a good example. No one except India would have acquired her.

 

[kurup]

Russians have a lot of clout in India which will take few decades to erode. Russians know the way Indians do business. They take a share in the graft. During Soviet era, some portion had to be paid to Indian communists. Now the Russians collect themselves. Russians need the huge Indian outlet to finance their arms industry. And India is a ready dumping ground for surplus stores or eqpt that Russia is replacing or has replaced for her own use. Vikramaditay is a good example. No one except India would have acquired her.

Please show some equipments that Russia is dumping in India .

As usual jamati with his brain fart$ ..........

 

[illusion8]

Russians have a lot of clout in India which will take few decades to erode. Russians know the way Indians do business. They take a share in the graft. During Soviet era, some portion had to be paid to Indian communists. Now the Russians collect themselves. Russians need the huge Indian outlet to finance their arms industry. And India is a ready dumping ground for surplus stores or eqpt that Russia is replacing or has replaced for her own use. Vikramaditay is a good example. No one except India would have acquired her.

Are you trying to equate Viki procurement to something on the lines of the F7's you bought? or the other random old era stuff that gets dumped on Bangladesh?

 

[Ammyy]

Russians have a lot of clout in India which will take few decades to erode. Russians know the way Indians do business. They take a share in the graft. During Soviet era, some portion had to be paid to Indian communists. Now the Russians collect themselves. Russians need the huge Indian outlet to finance their arms industry. And India is a ready dumping ground for surplus stores or eqpt that Russia is replacing or has replaced for her own use. Vikramaditay is a good example. No one except India would have acquired her.

For your knowledge even china dnt have any thing like Viki...

so this logic of your is just a example of small brain nothing else