Raymond Davis Case: Developing Story

[Areesh]

well this is what these Indian guys are doing in the posts above.. they have tottaly dragged the discussion off topic and talking hypothatically now
what does an Army General have to do with a shooting by an American of 2 Pakistani civilian? I really wonder why they cant keep their venom under control they really have to express their hate towards our army on regular bases

Well that's exactly I was talking about earlier. They won't shut up or behave sensibly until someone grabs them by neck and throw them out of this forum. Now hopefully mods will overcome their laziness and throw some guys out so the thread can gain it's sanity back. Genetics problems don't go that easy, so the best thing is to kick them out of this forum.

 

[ashok321]

Hahaha... Please don't flatter yourself, that self inflated ego might burst and the fall will be indeed a painful one. Now swallow that pride and move on...

I never was one, never am, never will be...
Keep on keeping though......
Truth fears no questions.

 

[Guest01]

well this is what these Indian guys are doing in the posts above.. they have tottaly dragged the discussion off topic and talking hypothatically now
what does an Army General have to do with a shooting by an American of 2 Pakistani civilian? I really wonder why they cant keep their venom under control they really have to express their hate towards our army on regular bases

Irfan Bhai, let me put it differently. What has Zardari or even in the short term Nawaz to gain by this predicament where the situation has come to a head? Let us not selectively trust some information and disqualify other from the same source at the same time. It was a "lovely game of cat and mouse" as the generals call it that happened that day in the RD case. The precursor had been not just the revelation of the CIA station head's name but before that the acceptance of the suit by the US court against ISI Chief in the 26/11 case. Rajaon ki jung mein pyade mar gaye. And much more can go wrong if the stupid obstinacy continues. You also know who will suffer in a situation when the relations between US and Pakistan will sour. All these jingoistic statements are as far from the realization of the impending difficulties for the common man as men are from women.

Re your comment about the hatred towards the Pakistani Generals, in my individual case, yes, I totally believe that the Pakistani Army leadership has been repeatedly and consistently been the sole reason of the sad situation of the affairs not only in Pakistan but also a worrisome situation in this whole region. I will not just leave it at that. If you would like, then Irfan Bhai, I will surely present the facts and the logic behind my thinking so. However, in the interest of the focu of the discourse on this thread, I yield to you.

 

[Imran Khan]

good jani he is better then many if he decide to do it for RD case

 

[ashok321]

Your darkness is full of patrol if i light the candle you will explode

Same old curse from you - back to square one ¿¿¿

What a habitual offender you are!

 

[RescueRanger]

I find the Statement from our Ex FM very interesting. As we all know, not everything is hugs and kisses in Awan E Sadar at the moment. In the corridors of power in Islamabad, things are ever fluid, but this government it is a bit iffy...

A little something i heard often when studying at Fazel-E-Haq:
کانړې به پوست، او دښمن به دوست نه شي

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Tareen's remarks left open the possibility that the man with the empty pistol had still pointed the gun at the American. The police chief said the issue of diplomatic immunity was a government matter but that the police have sent a preliminary charge sheet recommending Davis face a murder trial.

Hi,

Thank you Mr Tareen---your statement released some of the pressure---now we know that a gun wass pointed at Davis---who can comment on there being a bullet in the chamber or not---. Just the gun being pointed is a death sentence.

That statement does not suggest that the gun was pointed at Davis, just that the possibility cannot be ruled out. The only way to establish it now would likely be through eyewitnesses.

As I stated earlier----the police should have done due dilligence and made a raid on the two dead peoples houses immediately to see if there were any stolen merchandise laying at home or in use of any house member---if they would have found some stolen items----the case would have lost steam----if not----they would then fall back on circumstantial evidence.

Whether or not the two were criminals has little to do with this case from a legal perspective. Davis could not have possibly known they were criminals, so the case essentially boils down to the actions of the two men and Davis in that confrontation that led to the death of the two men.

 

[RescueRanger]

That statement does not suggest that the gun was pointed at Davis, just that the possibility cannot be ruled out. The only way to establish it now would likely be through eyewitnesses.

Whether or not the two were criminals has little to do with this case from a legal perspective. Davis could not have possibly known they were criminals, so the case essentially boils down to the actions of the two men and Davis in that confrontation that led to the death of the two men.

Indeed i have to agree with your assessment here sir, the background of the two deceased in this case is immaterial. However there are cases in Criminal Law, Specifically the consideration of Mens Rea: R_v_Woollin and R_v_Nedrick.

 

[Patriot]

I totally agree with Agnostic Muslim but honestly some Pakistanis are going over the top like saying America can't do - We should teach America a lesson.Guys please get a grip.Not sure what you guys are smoking over there.International Diplomacy is not run by emotions - The rule is Might is Right - Jis ke lathi us ke bhens.

 

[[Pakistani]-evilX]

Pakistani police: US man committed 'murder'
By BABAR DOGAR, Associated Press – 33 mins ago
LAHORE, Pakistan –
," Tareen told a news conference.
The police chief said Davis told interrogators that one of the Pakistani men had pointed his pistol at him.
However, Tareen said the slain man's pistol had been examined and officers found that all the bullets were in the magazine and no bullet was found in the chamber. Police also determined that the American shot and killed the second Pakistani as he tried to flee, hitting him in the back, Tareen said.[/B][/U]
Tareen's remarks left open the possibility that the man with the empty pistol had still pointed the gun at the American. The police chief said the issue of diplomatic immunity was a government matter but that the police have sent a preliminary charge sheet recommending Davis face a murder trial.



Hi,

Thank you Mr Tareen---your statement released some of the pressure---now we know that a gun wass pointed at Davis---who can comment on there being a bullet in the chamber or not---. Just the gun being pointed is a death sentence.

So----that solevs one problem---one down and one to go---the details will come out regarding the other one soon.

As I stated earlier----the police should have done due dilligence and made a raid on the two dead peoples houses immediately to see if there were any stolen merchandise laying at home or in use of any house member---if they would have found some stolen items----the case would have lost steam----if not----they would then fall back on circumstantial evidence.


The interview by pak police was PATHETIC AND OF VERY POOR QUALITY---there was no cohesiveness in questions----there were too many people in the room talking at the same time---and interfering as well---which gave time to Davis to compose himself---. It really is a sorry state of condition---.

The man should have been interviewed without a mob---.

are you nuts? what an idiot on earth would point a gun which doesn't even have a bullet in the chamber? especially when they have intentions of robbing someone in the broad daylight in the busy market....evem a normal citizen keeps his gun loaded and chambered with spare mags let alone the robbers,

one thing am still confused or might have missed but does RD has Diplomatic immunity or not? i mean whats the reply from FO?

 

[ashok321]

one thing am still confused or might have missed but does RD has Diplomatic immunity or not? i mean whats the reply from FO?

Thats the crux of the matter, cream of the coffee cup, but GOP deliberatly lingers on this issue as they have not made up their mind how to solve this issue with face saving exit.....(hint, Pak awam danda???)

If they declare RD`s status as diplomatic, then he has no buisness to be in Pakistan by default and he flies out of Pak with his collar up.

And this is what GOP does not want to happen in hurry, possibly they are trying to make a deal with Yanks through back channels.......

GOP is walking a tight rope - balancing act...

But a advice to them on thier slow motion:

A grasshopper that sleeps about will be soon awake in a lizard's mouth

Amen!

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I suppose one possible positive outcome of this episode could be a more cautious approach on the part of US embassy/consulate employees in Pakistan.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I totally agree with Agnostic Muslim but honestly some Pakistanis are going over the top like saying America can't do - We should teach America a lesson.Guys please get a grip.Not sure what you guys are smoking over there.International Diplomacy is not run by emotions - The rule is Might is Right - Jis ke lathi us ke bhens.

Continued US aid could also possibily be contributing to the lack of interest in economic and political reforms.

 

[arun]

I suppose one possible positive outcome of this episode could be a more cautious approach on the part of US embassy/consulate employees in Pakistan.

True, this will be one good effect of this whole unsavoury drama.

One thing that strikes me is that while people are calling for the blood of Raymond Davis, why are the calls for action against the ones who killed the innocent bystander so muted? I mean, in the Davis case, there is a possibility that they were actually criminals and/or they threatened him. However, in the "accident" (more like manslaughter) case, the victim was clearly innocent. These "diplomats" just went all James Bond style, on the WRONG side of the road, and killed him (NOTE - AN AMERICAN LIFE IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN OTHERS, ESPECIALLY IF THE OTHER IS NOT A FIRANGI). In my view, that is a far clearer case of criminal activity.

There have been cases in the past where proper diplomats involved in such happenings have been tried in the host country (after lifting of immunity) or in their home country, and then jailed. It would be a travesty of justice if ALL of these guys go scot free. Diplomats have been punished in the past for less serious cases, and they were proper diplomats.

Of course, as an Indian, it would also please me in a way if the relations between the US and Pakistan become frozen. But I am quite miffed with the arrogance of Americans in the David Headley and Anderson (Bhopal Gas) cases and it would probably please me more if Pakistan actually stood up to the Americans in this case. From past experience, however, this is not likely to happen.

 

[Cynic Waheed]

Jana, given u r a journalist, do u have any inside info on what potential stand FO is likely to take? I have read in many places that FO is not going to manipulate the real status RD. Is that a suggestion that FO is convinced that he isnt a diplomat. Thanks.