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Proof of RAW involvement in terror acts given to India

Hmm the India foreign office clearly denies receiving the dossier but the Pakistan FO says "we do not react to media reports." Well I guess it doesn't take a genius to figure this one out. I am disappointed in Dawn News. I think its the best news publisher in Pakistan, but this was a poor job.

Hi SecularHumanist,

that's is what i have been saying, please get solid proof before we Pakistani speak about anything specially Indians.

The problem is our politicians are playing games with our public.

Lets go one step backwards and think, Why would US take causalities on their army when they know that Indian are funding this terror act. Can some one explain that?

why is it that our GOP not making any moves on it Why??

I would rather look into the present situation and try and rectify the issue first within our country and then get going on Indian and their policies.

H
 
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Here is an article on him and his views on kashmir issue:

Pakistan News Service - PakTribune

paktribune and asiantribune.com articles are written by the same people who write for brasstacks.pk (i.e. Zaid hamid and Co.). So you can hardly expect it to be objective

2. Address to the UN by Mir Waiz Mohammad Umar Farooq

UN Address by Mirwaiz Umar Farooq

Mir Waiz Umar's father was killed by HuM militants for opposing joining Pakistan and he too is against joining Pakistan. He belongs to the Independance faction.

Maybe you should look at the latest (2009) UNHCR reports on Pakistan and India Kashmir in which Indian Kashmir has better Politcal rights and civil liberties score than Pakistan Kashmir (as found out by the UNHCR)
UNHCR | Refworld | Freedom in the World 2009 - Kashmir [Pakistan]
UNHCR | Refworld | Freedom in the World 2009 - Kashmir [India]

It even mentions Indian Kashmir as Partly free while Pakistan Kashmir as not free.

But then again, you must visit Indian Kashmir to know the reality. I have friends and distant cousins there and you will be surprised to know the sentiment there about Pakistan
 
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Mir Waiz Umar's father was killed by HuM militants for opposing joining Pakistan and he too is against joining Pakistan. He belongs to the Independance faction.

Independance is still better than being with india.

BTW if you had read my post correctly,you would have had seen that the american has said the same thing in the congressional hearing.I am sure the american congress does not belong to brasstacks.

I know how "free" is IOK,this is why you have so many freedom struggles. I can quote hundreds of kashmiris on where the freedom really lies.Come to mirpur and see for yourself.

I really can't argue with you guys any more.You guys ask for neutral sources.I quote an american and you say that he is biased. You guys just don't accept the facts.
 
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Independance is still better than being with india.

Have you even bothered to read the UNHCR reports ....

Let me help you....

The reports clearly states who is free and who is not....India Kashmiri People have civil rights ....under Indian constitution where as Pakistani Kashmiris dont even have those....


So who is free and who is not.....:undecided:

I know how free is IOK,this is why you have so many freedom struggles. I can quote hundreds of kashmiris on where the freedom really lies.Come to mirpur and see for yourself.

An armed insurgency against Indian rule gathered momentum after 1989, when militant groups linked to political parties assassinated several NC politicians and attacked government targets in the Kashmir Valley. The militants included the Jammu and Kashmir Liberation Front (JKLF) and other pro-independence groups consisting largely of Kashmiris, as well as Pakistani-backed Islamist groups seeking to bring Kashmir under Islamabad's control.

As the violence escalated, New Delhi placed Jammu and Kashmir under federal rule in 1990 and attempted to quell the mass uprising by force. By the mid-1990s, the Indian army had greatly weakened the JKLF, which abandoned its armed struggle in 1994. The armed insurgency has since been dominated by Pakistani-backed extremist groups, which include non-Kashmiri fighters from elsewhere in the Muslim world.
 
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Independance is still better than being with india.

BTW if you had read my post correctly,you would have had seen that the american has said the same thing in the congressional hearing.I am sure the american congress does not belong to brasstacks.

I know how "free" is IOK,this is why you have so many freedom struggles. I can quote hundreds of kashmiris on where the freedom really lies.Come to mirpur and see for yourself.

I really can't argue with you guys any more.You guys ask for neutral sources.I quote an american and you say that he is biased. You guys just don't accept the facts.

Mian Asad bhai, I read the post, Its 2004, five years ago, and it might have been true then. But things have improved and changed (at least in India) since then. So you need to look at the situation in 2009. I never said that American was biased.

Mirpur is in Pakistan, so what do you expect. People there will be brainwashed against India so that they would be easily recruited in the militant groups. Besides Mirpuris are more closer to Punjabis and Jammu region than the Kashmiris.

Most of your posts are intelligent, so I guess you can read and make your own assesments from the "facts". Here another website that has done "On the ground" opinion polls from an Irish expert on both India and Pakistan Kashmir which makes it more credible.
Peace polls, an effective approach in helping resolve conflict

At the end of the day, its about the Kashmiris and improving their quality of life as fellow human beings
 
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There is no point on debating.We both are going to stick to our guns.Only time will tell that who is free and who is not.
 
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India denies receiving dossier, Islamabad evasive


The Hindu News Update Service


New Delhi/Islamabad (PTI): India on Thursday flatly denied having received any dossier from Pakistan about its alleged involvement in terrorist acts there slamming Pakistani media reports in this regard as "entirely wrong" even as Islamabad remained evasive on the matter.

"No such dossier was given in Egypt...It is entirely wrong," the Minister of State for External Affairs Preneet Kaur said in New Delhi.

Sources in the Prime Minister's Office (PMO) told PTI "We have not received any such dossier," a day after media reports in Pakistan claimed that a dossier was given to India on its alleged involvement in terrorist acts including one on the Sri Lankan team in Lahore as well as in the unrest in the south-western province of Balochistan.

The dossier with proof of "India's involvement in subversive activities in Pakistan" was handed over by Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani to his Indian counterpart Manmohan Singh during their recent meeting at the Egyptian resort of Sharm el-Sheikh, The Dawn, a leading Pakistani English daily, reported yesterday quoting sources.

Minister of State for External Affairs Shashi Tharoor described the charges as "preposterous" and said "it is not wise for us to react to media reports.

"But we don't believe that deflecting responsibilities for things that are happening in the disfunctioning of the state to their neighbours who have conducted themselves very differently is a very healthy practice," he said.

In Islamabad, Foreign Office spokesman Abdul Basit did not confirm or deny the media reports saying the issue involved intelligence matters which cannot be discussed in public.

Mr. Basit evaded several pointed questions on the matter saying only that Pakistan's position was amply reflected by the Joint Statement.

"All I can say is that whatever was discussed and handed over is contained in the Joint Statement," Mr. Basit told a weekly news briefing, responding to a question on whether Mr. Gilani had handed over to Dr. Singh a dossier on India's alleged involvement in unrest in Balochistan

The issue involved intelligence matters and Pakistan does not discuss such issues in public as a matter of policy, he said.

Asked about the issue, Foreign Minister Shah Mehmood Qureshi told reporters in Phuket where he is attending a ASEAN meeting that if there are any unwanted problems being created in Balochistan Pakistan has "tabled" them in the spirit of solving them.

"It is important for us to make Balochistan stable. It is an important area for us. Pakistan is concerned about Balochistan. We only want to solve issues, not complicate them," Mr. Qureshi added.
 
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Balochistan blunder: Indo-Pak talks in a spot

Pakistan Foreign Minister Shah Mehmood Qureshi told CNN-IBN’s sister channel - IBN 7 - that while the issue of Balochistan was raised during last week’s Indo-Pak talks in Sharm-al-Sheikh he had no knowledge of any dossier being handed on the issue.

On Wednesday, Pakistan newspaper Dawn had carried a report saying that a full dossier showing that India is carrying out terrorist activities in Pakistan had been handed over to Prime Minister Manmohan Singh in Sharm-al-Sheikh.

According to the report, Manmohan Singh had agreed to include the anti-India reference.

And that brings us to the question of the day asked on CNN-IBN show Face the Nation: Did India make a diplomatic blunder by including Balochistan in the joint statement?

On the panel of experts to debate the issue were leader of the Opposition in the Rajya Sabha Arun Jaitley, senior Congress leader Mani Shankar Aiyar and former diplomat KC Singh.

We have nothing to hide: India

India says it has nothing to hide and its foreign policies are an open book. The Government has said that the Indo-Pak joint statement is simply a way to reconcile differences with Pakistan.

Opening the debate Jaitley said, “I think the joint statement was also about ‘give’. There was no ‘take’ in it. That is because Balochistan is not the only objectionable reference in the statement. Also, this reference to Balochistan cannot be out of context. In any document of this kind only agreed statements can be put in. Now in the context of Balochistan, obviously an invisible finger is being pointed at India. Pakistan PM Gilani’s statement two days later substantiates the fact that the whole suggestion is to insinuate that India is fermenting trouble in Balochistan and it is India that is indulging in cross-border terrorism rather than Pakistan. And the incorrect news in Dawn further substantiates this.”

The Opposition has argued that the Government has downgraded India’s concerns on the nature of terrorism. It is more like one country’s word against the other. So has India’s moral high ground on terrorism been diminished?

“It is not about high ground. I don’t see any anti-Indian statement in the document. I want to quote from the statement. PM Gilani mentioned that Pakistan had some information on threats in Balochistan and other areas. It does not say threats from India,” Aiyar clarified.

He however said, “What the Opposition is doing is one of the most anti-Indian things that I can think of.”

To which Jaitley said, “Where is the question of being anti-Indian? There is something that is compromising India’s position by this Government document. The entire country is outraged by this.”

But Aiyar argued that “it is a discredited report in Dawn newspaper and just because it has been printed in Dawn does not make it true. Let me make it completely clear that no dossier was handed over to us and to the best of my knowledge no government of India has been upto any funny business in Balochistan. Therefore, if the PM of Pakistan wishes to mention to our PM that there are unnamed threats from unnamed sources in Balochistan and other areas of Pakistan then he is free to say so.”

Experts say there are thousands of NATO troops there and they wouldn’t even let India do anything even if they wanted to, so what is the issue about?

“And that is precisely the reason why there should have been no reference to Balochistan,” said Jaitley.

“If there is nothing to hide or do there then there should have been no reference to it in the statement, not even a unilateral reference from Pakistan’s point of view. This has never been referred to any joint statement in the past,” he added.

“So what?” asked Aiyar and then added, “I object to BJP unnecessarily twisting this line for the benefit of Pakistanis.”

The other objection that many are bringing up is why call it a joint statement. It could just have been a summary of the discussions between the two countries. By calling it a joint statement it seems that India is endorsing Pakistan’s statement.

“The difficulty in dealing with Pakistan is when you introduce these words they come back to haunt you. In ’65 we handed over the Haji Pir Pass despite the military objections. It was a critical pass to dominate the Line of Control. In ’72 Shimla Summit we allowed two words to be retained in the document “outstanding issues”. That became the reentry of issues and Pakistan used that as a ledge to put things on. Here also if you read the document then this is not how joint declarations come out. If you disagree on something then you don’t include it there. This point sticks out like a sore thumb. So why is it there?” KC Singh asked.

Another contentious issue about the statement was the delinking of terror from the composite dialogue. Does it means the composite dialogue will continue irrespective of whether terror continues or not?

Quoting from the statement, Aiyar said, “Action on terrorism should not be linked to the composite dialogue process.”

“We are saying action on terrorism must continue. Pakistan cannot say that because the composite dialogue process is still to arrive at a conclusion they need to take action on terrorism only then,” he added.

Not satisfied with Aiyar’s stance Jaitley said, “The whole country has understood it one way, forget the Pakistani media. The Foreign Secretary has said that it is a case of bad drafting. Now I don’t know whether it is bad drafting or bad policy.”

Was there a lack of a political judgement on the part of the Prime Minister in this particular joint statement?

“There are enough words in English to simply say that we will have a caliberated dialogue. We shall restart the talks but we will not go to the composite dialogue till we have satisfaction on 26/11, which is what the PM said later. Why doesn’t that reflected in the document?” KC Singh asked.

To which Aiyar said, “The larger objective is to arrive at a viable relationship with Pakistan. And in that process there are hiccups.”

But KC Singh said that it is a problem of tactics. “Twice it happened to the NDA and now it happened with the UPA. How do you continue a dialogue with terrorism becoming graver and it is being traced back to the Pakistani government,” He said.

As the debate neared conclusion, Jaitley said, “Pakistan has taken some steps but it has to go all the way to take action against terror. I agree with Mani that the larger objective is to have a composite dialogue but we have to finish terrorism too. We must have dialogue without terror rather than having dialogue with terror.”

And closing the debate, Aiyar said, “I request all to understand that there is a tremendous forward movement. A huge number of outstanding issues have been resolved in principle and are waiting to be brought to the front-burner.”

Link- FTN: Balochistan blunder: Indo-Pak talks in a spot : Single Page View
 
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