Featured Project Azm: Pakistan's Ambitious Quest to Develop 5th Generation Military Technologies.

[Trango Towers]

I should wait for something official.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

the near future course of developments, in the eyes of Kaiser Tufail as

Author, analyst, and former air force pilot Kaiser Tufail suggested in 2018 that Turkey and Pakistan could build an interim jet “rather than jumping straight to a full-capability fifth generation fighter.”

He even suggested that cooperation “could well take the shape of a ‘Block-4’ JF-17 Thunder developed by Turkey and Pakistan.”

Will Turkey Seek Chinese Or Korean Fighters If F-16 Request Is Denied?

If Turkey continually refuses to compromise with the U.S. and NATO on the S-400, its F-16 fleet will inevitably suffer the consequences.

www.forbes.com

Yes, he's right in one sense. TFX block 0 is not a full fledged 5th generation fighter. It's as good as the F16 block 70 at the minimum....

 

[dBSPL]

Yes, he's right in one sense. TFX block 0 is not a full fledged 5th generation fighter. It's as good as the F16 block 70 at the minimum....

Can you describe the 5th generation fighter jet? And under what criteria will TFX not fit, and what is the current situation with the already existing fifth-generation fighter jets on that criterias?

What is TFX block 0? If you are talking about the IOC phase, which document do you refer to regarding the targeted capabilities, can you share?

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Can you describe the 5th generation fighter jet?

What is TFX block 0? If you are talking about the IOC phase, which document do you refer to regarding the targeted capabilities, can you share?

And under what criteria will TFX not fit, and what is the current situation with the already existing fifth-generation fighter jets on that criterias?

It's as per the recent programs at the CNN-Turk where Ismail Demir, Temel Kotil etc. attended...

 

[dBSPL]

It's as per the recent programs at the CNN-Turk where Ismail Demir, Temel Kotil etc. attended...

Temel Kotil makes simple statements in his speeches on national channels that people of all ages can understand. It's something we see all too often that he uses similes from time to time. There are two extensions in the MMU project that will come into play later. The first is the new generation engine problem. In this regard, the situation in the world is not very clear yet too, two or three aircraft in the world have passed this technical stage. The second issue is the crucial part of the stealth operation, which is not discussed much in the forums, the new generation communication and data links. The ability of stealth cruising aircrafts to operate in conjunction with other generation jets and other operational elements. Apart from these, the aircraft will have supercruise capability, internal weapon stations, Aesa radar, sensor fusion and decision support systems, stealth structure and appropriate coating, from the IOC stage.

The first 3 prototypes will be used in processes such as ground, structural durability, aerodynamics, meteorology, software and navigation tests. These aircraft are part of the project development process and will not be delivered to the air force. The first aircrafts to be delivered to TAF will be next 10(as i remember) aircraft to be produced after these prototypes that some defense industry researchers defining these aircrafts as Blok-1. In other words, these 10 aircraft will take place in the IOC process(while other productions continue) and will meet most of criterias in terms of class definitions and some not met, as I try to explain above. As long as the aircraft can carry BVRM at the internal weapons station and can supercruise in stealth, it will be ahead of the F-16s, even in IOC phase.

 

[TigerOfMysore]

Sorry but it doesn't makes sense neither there is anything in regard to what you claim. Let's not share something beyond understanding that can lead of bigger brain drain and even people getting wrong view of institute.



Alas, you have been looking at things so wrongly. Busy bees are never into AZM alone. That tells me that you totally missed where they remains busy. Very less people know that and personally I am happy that you have no idea.

Pakistan's Azm program was more about building an industrial base to enable Pakistan to develop advanced military aviation. Bringing in collaboration from other countries speaks more to the right sense that distribution of areas is perhaps a faster path to an actual product.

Pakistan Azm ecosystem is more focused in areas like radars and avionics. Pakistan is also developing a full indigenous capability around UAVs and UCAVs. Whereas a 5th plus gen will be a collaborative endeavor which it should always have been. So I for one think this is a good step in the right direction. I only hope however that Amz gives rise to a robust commercially viable private sector involvement.

 

[CrazyZ]

If the decision is made to produce a combat variant for Hürjet, it will have all the capabilities of the JF-17. Hürjet prototypes are currently in production. The assembly activities of the first ready-to-fly aircraft will be completed in a few months. The aircraft will make its maiden flight in the first quarter of 2023 (March 18), and deliveries to the air force will begin from 2025.

Turkiye and Pakistan's starting a new project over the JF-17 infrastructure may be possible with the coordination and permission of China. Aside from dozens of technical difficulties for TuAF, what mentioned mean that a minimum period of 6-8 years. TuAF's medium and long-term plans are already clear. The current discussion is about stop-gap/filler solutions. Here, too, the most expected solution is to increase the current F-16 fleet to the B70/72 level.

What happens if the most logical path is blocked? A- Turkiye runs its own F-16 modernization program without permission, ignoring license agreements. B- Hurjet could be reconfigured with a ready-made engine with higher thrust, possibly of Ukrainian origin, giving priority to the combat variant. C- looks for an EF or another similiar aircraft (possibly second hand) in that permissions given to can use its own missiles and munitions at the maximum level. In this option, Pakistan's JF-17 can be opened to Turkish avionics and supplied in this way. However, there is no technical infrastructure in TuAF, especially the JF-17 engine. If such an investment will to be made, the Hurjet-Ukrainian engine would come to the fore. D- The USA can gives the green light for TR's F-35's due to the Ukraine crisis, and may be TAF would take 2-3 squadrons of F-35. This is already the old plan to supply the F-35 and modernize the F-16 squadrons. And then,gradual decommissioning of F-16s and commissioning of the MMU in the 2030s.

I think the most logical way at the moment would be to bring up the Hürjet combatant variant immediatly. Yes, it can be a painful process. In fact, some risk factors will be dangerous in the very short term, but they will create huge gains in the long run.

IMO, Pakistan should work Turkey on gas turbines. Its a critical technology both countries will need to advance their aerospace industries. The JF-17 platform still has room to grow. Boosting its engine power to the 100KN range with super cruise would enhance the platform immensely. If Pakistan continues to invest on the gains its made with JF-17 project, while boosting its level of indigenous components.....This will help build a foundation for more ambitious projects in the future.

 

[Indos]

Can you describe the 5th generation fighter jet? And under what criteria will TFX not fit, and what is the current situation with the already existing fifth-generation fighter jets on that criterias?

What is TFX block 0? If you are talking about the IOC phase, which document do you refer to regarding the targeted capabilities, can you share?

So what happened between 2011 until 2018 ? Since as far as I know the program started in 2011, which is quite similar with phase 1 of KF21/IFX program.

 

[dBSPL]

So what happened between 2011 until 2018 ? Since as far as I know the program started in 2011, which is quite similar with phase 1 of KF21/IFX program.

Between 2011 and 2018, an unnamed revolution took place in the Turkish aerospace industry. If you ask in particular for MMU, I tried to summarize the important milestones of the project as follows:

TF-X Turkish Fighter & Trainer Aircraft Projects

The TFX project is actually about to leave 10 years behind. Many people, who cannot get info on the subject from the right sources, saw it as a political move to create leverage against the US when problems begin to arise regarding Turkey's participation in the F-35. Or at least they found it...

defence.pk

In the past 10 years,

• Roles and road maps about which companies will have sufficiency were determined.
• Strategies to accelerate the project were realized through international collaborations.
• The project was secured legally and financially by government and presidential decrees.
• Thousands of more white collar from Turkiye and around the world were recruited to TAI. The aviation industry grew more than 30% overall.
• Huge infrastructure and technical investments worth billions of dollars have been made for MMU, both for project phase and for the mass production process in the future.
• The MMU program has approximately hundred different sub-studies areas, sectoral coordination has been established in this regard and these related projects have been structured.
• In addition to all these studies; Although it is not as conservative a project model as the MMU, there are details about the Hurjet project, which is positioned as the predecessor of the MMU.

As a result, today the project is in the first prototypes production process and the first part productions have started. If there is no delay in the project schedule, the roll out ceremony from the hangar will be held on March 18, 2023.

I couldn't follow Korea's fighter aircraft project closely, but as far as I know, it has a wider international support and the project has an older history than the MMU. My best wishes to Korea, and especially Indonesia, which will benefit greatly from this project. We desperately need all these initiatives to break the aviation monopoly around the world.

 

[Zarvan]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1493242280072957960

 

[HarisMalik]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1493593537958629380

Could this be related to AZM?

 

[Chak Bamu]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1493593537958629380

Could this be related to AZM?

No. Read the headline "....beyond 2050". Plus, rudderless design points to 6th gen.

 

[sparten]

I would like to point out that when the nuclear program was ongoing, there were lots of “leaks” which “quoted knowledgeable sources” saying that the program “was dead” “put on the back burner” “people quietly leaving, reassigned”.
@JamD @Bilal Khan (Quwa)

 

[Indos]

I would like to point out that when the nuclear program was ongoing, there were lots of “leaks” which “quoted knowledgeable sources” saying that the program “was dead” “put on the back burner” “people quietly leaving, reassigned”.
@JamD @Bilal Khan (Quwa)

No country in the world that is not part of already nuclear power will say publicly they are currently developing nuclear bomb.

 

[Chak Bamu]

I would like to point out that when the nuclear program was ongoing, there were lots of “leaks” which “quoted knowledgeable sources” saying that the program “was dead” “put on the back burner” “people quietly leaving, reassigned”.
@JamD @Bilal Khan (Quwa)

Deflections, misinformation, & other types of tactics; in short anything to ensure that the program emerged as a success. And it did. What is your point?