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Porsche's Chief Designer is a Chinese??!!

However, things in China operate a bit differently. If you speak ill against the government, you are unpatriotic. Because a good citizens always obey their government. As long as the citizens concern, the government can do no wrong, so if things goes wrong, you are in the wrong, not the government.

You're such a liar. :lol:

I JUST said in the past few posts that I get along really well with Sonyuke, faithfulguy and Okemos even though they are very anti-CCP, because they are still pro-China.

I consider them to be patriotic to their motherland, which is China. I also consider you to be patriotic, but to America.
 
Not when it comes to national security issues, particularly defense.

When the Soviets collapsed, China lost the only source of defense related technologies. Even worse, the former Soviet satellites sold US a still secret amount of Soviet defense hardware. They needed cash to keep their countries going. They called US and we painted black a still secret amount of transport vehicles, from ships to trucks to aircrafts, to go shopping. When I was stationed at MacDill in a previous life, there were a few nights when we were ordered to go inside the squadron building, close all doors and windows, and no one was allowed to leave for a couple hrs. Then we heard the distinctive whine of C-5 Galaxy engines and wondered WTF was going on. Years later it was revealed that we bought tanks, fighters, computers, chunks of fissionable grade uranium, and even ICBMs from these former Soviet satellites. So now not only did China lost the only source of defense related hardware, whatever China bought from the Soviets stopped being mysteries to US.

China effectively was defenseless.

That vulnerability was not completely realized among the PLA's top leadership. Most of them were still thinking in the Korean War mindset, mirrored here by the Chinese members as how often they brought that up as 'proof' that China 'defeated' the US. Laughable an argument as it is. When Desert Storm came around, the PLA predicted that even though the US led alliance would win, the US military being the bulk of the offensive will pay the heaviest price for that victory, something close to the Vietnam War casualty figures.

We know how that turned out...Do we?

Finally, China's defenseless status sunk into the thick skulls of the PLA's leadership. They stood in front of the Politburo with eggs on their faces trying to explain why their predictions were so egregiously wrong. Many, if not most, of the Politburo have revolutionary backgrounds. Some even marched with Mao at his lowest hours. They knew what war involves. All the medals festooned on the generals' uniforms instantly became either ebay baubles or toys inside those arcade parlor machines. A US Marine's rifleman badge awarded at the end of Basic is worth more than all the medals worn by a PLA general. It turned out a US Army captain was a better practitioner of Sun Tzu than a PLA general. Not just Sun Tzu but also Von Clausewitz.

Reform was inevitable. Not just in hardware but also in intellect. China had no choice but to resort to thievery in order to modernize the PLA quickly. Not just the PLA but also in everything else. Modern capitalism and its institutions and methods were adopted. Marx and Mao must be spinning in their tombs. At least Marx because Mao is pickled in an oversized jar for the public to gawk at during daylight hours, but he probably spins at night when no one is around to see his distress. The price of access to low cost Chinese labor will be one's own intellectual and physical achievements. Ethics be damned -- on both sides.


Sounds like someone just came out of their primary school history class and has no idea about how the Cold War went. :omghaha: Soviet Union? Selling and supplying defence technology to China during the Sino Soviet split? :omghaha: Does gambit have any idea where China obtained its defense technology or why an arms embargo was placed on China after Tiananmen square? Your hero in the White House who said "tear down this wall" sold defense technology to China, not the guy with the pot-wine stain on his head.


China doesn't care where the defense technology originates. It has been reverse engineering weapons ever since it captured breach loading cannons from the Portuguese in 1522, and quickly duplicated them. China used inferior cannon technology to first defeat the Portuguese with their advanced weapons and reverse engineer the Portuguese ones. It began using the Portuguese cannon in battle.

Portuguese at Macau were also used by the Ming again to manufacture new cannon to fight the Qing. They were successfuly at defeating the Qing at the Battle of Ningyuan and killing their leader Nurhaci. However the Qing captured some of the Portuguese cannon and replicated more on their own.

After the Dutch were defeated in Taiwan in 1662 by Ming Chinese loyalists, the captured Dutch cannon were reversed engineered and reused against other enemies.

The Qing used Jesuits to manufacture even newer types of cannon and these were used to defeat the Russians at the Battle of Albazin.

During the 19th century many arsenals were built by the Qing throughout the country and equipment brought from western countries to reverse engineer and manufacture western style weapons en masse. Repeater rifles, bullets, artillery shells, mortars, artillery and machine guns were made. The only problem lied in the artillery shells and not anything else, because corrupt officials would fill the shells with non explosive material.

Technology doesn't always win battles. A bunch of tribal aboriginals wielding spears and muzzle loading muskets first slaughtered an entire crew of American sailors in the Rover Incident and then clobbered and humiliated a following American military expedition in 1867.

The French were defeated in their attempt to capture Taiwan in the Keelung campaign. Mind you, this was with the Chinese army using outdated Dutch and Spanish colonial era muzzle loading cannon and non exploding artillery shells against the French's fully functioning explosive artillery and modern equipment. The spear wielding aboriginals again inflicted defeat on the French and chopped their heads off to be put on display.

In the Boxer Rebellion, the Imperial army was armed with repeating rifles, machine guns, mines, and artillery thanks to reverse engineering of western arms and then mass producing them at arsenals in China. Thanks to this the Eight Nation Alliance suffered alot of casualties

The force besieging the legations was equipped with German originated krupp artillery and could have leveled the legations had their not been deliberately ordered to hold back. Chinese artillery managed to kill 172 allied forces on their ships at Dagu forts. The Allies were attacked by Imperial army forces with repeating rifles and artillery in the Seymour Expedition and were defeated and driven back with heavy casulaties. The allies suffered heavily from Chinese sniping and artillery at the Battle of Tienstin. The American officer commanding the 9th infantry regiment and the flag bearer were both killed and many were shot by the snipers. At the Battle of Yangcun and Battle of Beicang Chinese forces inflicted heavy casualties upon the Allies for such brief battles and the Allies casualties at Beicang were higher than the Chinese. Dozens of allies were killed at Beijing by Chinese rifle fire. Most casualties were inflicted upon the Japanese.

Do you think any of those allied soldiers who were killed or wounded screamed "its not fair, you stole the technology!" before they passed on to the afterlife?
 
so no freedom of xpression:undecided:
smileys-smiley-with-sign-547611.gif
smileys-smiley-with-sign-274798.gif
:girl_cray3:

you do, but you will probably went to jail for it..............

Depending on the expression in your mind...
 
Sounds like someone just came out of their primary school history class and has no idea about how the Cold War went. :omghaha: Soviet Union? Selling and supplying defence technology to China during the Sino Soviet split? :omghaha: Does gambit have any idea where China obtained its defense technology or why an arms embargo was placed on China after Tiananmen square? Your hero in the White House who said "tear down this wall" sold defense technology to China, not the guy with the pot-wine stain on his head.
Yeah...From the US. I guess my eyes must be failing due to old age. China have been flying F-15s and F-16s all this time.
 
You're such a liar. :lol:

I JUST said in the past few posts that I get along really well with Sonyuke, faithfulguy and Okemos even though they are very anti-CCP, because they are still pro-China.

I consider them to be patriotic to their motherland, which is China. I also consider you to be patriotic, but to America.

lol, whatever you say pal.........

I wasn't really looking for any justification from anyone. I still got friends in Hong Kong and when i do go back and see them from time to time, they are the one I talk to, they are the one I listen to.

I don't know you. That's the simplest way to put it. Then why would I care about what you think?? Or I should care a great deal if a perfect stranger come to me and say "God! You're ugly"??
 
lol, whatever you say pal.........

I wasn't really looking for any justification from anyone. I still got friends in Hong Kong and when i do go back and see them from time to time, they are the one I talk to, they are the one I listen to.

I don't know you. That's the simplest way to put it. Then why would I care about what you think?? Or I should care a great deal if a perfect stranger come to me and say "God! You're ugly"??

The Chinese member Sonyuke hates the CCP more than Neo-Nazi's hate the Jews. Literally in every post he is praising the KMT and calling the CCP all sorts of disgusting things and accusing them of things that are so horrific that I would get banned from this forum just for re-posting it.

Yet I consider him a Chinese patriot, because from his posts you can tell that he clearly loves China and the Chinese people. The only difference is that he is a die-hard KMT supporter.

You on the other hand, you don't criticize the CCP very much. In fact I have not personally seen you criticizing the CCP at all. Yet not one single Chinese member here regards you as one of us.
 
Yeah...From the US. I guess my eyes must be failing due to old age. China have been flying F-15s and F-16s all this time.

lol, why the F are you still talking to this guy.

Isn't it clear in his mind because our 9th Infantry Regiment were all but wiped out in some battle hundred years ago, Today Taiwan have more than enough power to overthrown the US control??

lol some people still very hung up on the time we still under command of Colonel Cluster. :lol:

The Chinese member Sonyuke hates the CCP more than Neo-Nazi's hate the Jews. Literally in every post he is praising the KMT and calling the CCP all sorts of disgusting things and accusing them of things that are so horrific that I would get banned from this forum just for re-posting it.

Yet I consider him a Chinese patriot, because from his posts you can tell that he clearly loves China and the Chinese people. The only difference is that he is a die-hard KMT supporter.

You on the other hand, you don't criticize the CCP very much. Yet not one single Chinese member here regards you as one of us.

dude, what are you, still in 8th grade??

I don't really care if any of youse saw me as Chinese, that does not stop me from acting any bit out of character.

So, in order for you lot to call me Chinese then I need to suck up to any one of you, then I rather take the status quo of you keep calling me Vietnamese (although I don't speak a word of Vietnamese) and I carry on doing my business.

Being Chinese do not need you guys approval. Or am I missing something here??

As long as I have the passport and ID card and my return home permit so that I can return to Hong Kong and China anytime time, I don't really care if you call me Martian or Alien.........

Beside I registered in this forum (Pakistan Defence Forum) is to talk about defence and defence tech, I don't really anticipate talking about politic, especially Chinese Politic here in a PAKISTAN defence forum.

If I want to do that, I would probably register in Baido or some place like that. but not here.
 
Jhungary, I have never seen you criticizing the CCP on this forum. Not once.

Whereas Sonyuke and Okemos criticize and attack the CCP in pretty much every post.

Yet the latter two are Chinese patriots. Whereas not even one single Chinese member considers you to be Chinese.

Have you figured out why? Because, it's not about CCP, anti-CCP, or KMT. It's about China.
 
Not lead....but perhaps for the Chinese market. Since the 70's most car designers have been based in the US (such as ALL Japanese makes). This makes sense....you need to design for your market. China is not yet that big....but it will be. Makes sense to know what they want.
 
Jhungary, I have never seen you criticizing the CCP on this forum. Not once.

Whereas Sonyuke and Okemos criticize and attack the CCP in pretty much every post.

Yet the latter two are Chinese patriots. Whereas not even one single Chinese member considers you to be Chinese.

Have you figured out why? Because, it's not about CCP, anti-CCP, or KMT. It's about China.

you sure I never criticize about CCP? And did you ever see I actually criticize Chinese??

According to your fellow member Longyi at post #89 in this very same thread, he can't find any

You want to try your luck and find some??
LOL he's right! I can't find one single anti Chinese post from him.


Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/china-...s-chief-designer-chinese-6.html#ixzz2Z0LuApBp

Actually I did just criticize CCP a few post before with marshmarow, go check what did I wrote.

you sure I never criticize about CCP? And did you ever see I actually criticize Chinese??

According to your fellow member Longyi at post #89 in this very same thread, he can't find any

You want to try your luck and find some??

Actually I did just criticize CCP a few post before with marshmarow, go check what did I wrote.

When you buy stuff, you don't really watch what were you buying, just buying stuff because other tell you to.

Did you actually ever read what did I post. Or you just listen to selected few opinion and brand me whatever you brand me?? Mate, this is not very good customer opinion. :lol:

Again, I don't really care if what your people or people in your circle think, judging from what I hear, your group does not warrant a response from me. Go think whatever you feel like :)
 
dude, I still live in Scania what is the problem if I am in Australia for my education?? And do you have a problem my mother being a Chinese?? (She is an 100% ethnic Chinese from Vietnam) do you have a problem with that?

點解D巴基斯坦老甘鬼鐘意起人底呢??

You know that in traditional Chinese culture descent is traced through the father's side? In Chinese diasporas in Southeast asia you are only Chinese if your father is Chinese. Most of the Chinese diaspora in southeast asia before the 19th century in fact where only Chinese through their father's side. Their mothers were natives. In Taiwan alot of the Hokkien and Hakka population is descended from men from mainland China who married aboriginal Taiwanese women, Their is a saying in Taiwan, "have mainland grandfather no mainland grandmother" 有唐山公無唐山媽

If you go by blood you are not Chinese by ethnicity. Chinese culture is not matrilineal. Alot of people in those Chinese diasporas held no citizenship in China even though they are considered ethnic Chinese because their father's side is Chinese.

Yeah...From the US. I guess my eyes must be failing due to old age. China have been flying F-15s and F-16s all this time.

I guess they must have been importing candy before the arms embargo.
 
I guess they must have been importing candy before the arms embargo.
You missed the point but in your zeal to defend China at any cost, especially at the expense of critical thinking, it is no surprise. Are you telling us that the MIG-15 came from an American company?

Rifts between allies and friends can be mended. Look at the US and Japan, US and Germany, US and China, US and Viet Nam, and many more. So your Sino-Soviet breakup is nothing new. My point was that regardless of relationships, the Soviet Union was China's ONLY source of reasonably 'high tech' source (singular) for national defense. So when the Soviet Union collapsed and we got dibs on so many of the Soviet military hardware to study, China was effectively rendered defenseless.
 
lol, why the F are you still talking to this guy.
Some posts are so egregiously illogical, non-critical, non-analytical, non-everything, that it would be immoral not to comment. But I do admit that it does feel like Sisyphus at times.
 
You know that in traditional Chinese culture descent is traced through the father's side?

Interesting.

This is the exact opposite of Jewish culture, where "Jewishness" is transferred exclusively through the mother (at least in the Orthodox Jewish interpretation).

Both views make sense. Patrilineal (Y-chromosome, at least for boys), and matrilineal (mitochondrial DNA).
 
when the Soviet Union collapsed and we got dibs on so many of the Soviet military hardware to study, China was effectively rendered defenseless.

That's a trite condemnation. Most countries in the world do not manufacture their defence equipment from scratch and have this vulnerability. Until recently, and at the time of the Soviet collapse, China did not have the capability for advanced indigenous military tech, so it is puerile to taunt the Chinese on that score.

In terms of maintaining defence capability, there are only three options:

A- buy foreign (and you have pointed out the pitfalls of that).

B- develop indigenous capability from scratch (will take forever and it's a running race where the other guys are not stopping for you to catch up).

C- develop indigenous capability with a little help (reverse engineering).

China is taking the third, pragmatic, approach.
 

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