Persecution of Ahmadis in Pakistan contradicts the teachings of Islam

[The Sandman]

I personally do not consider Ghulam Ahmed as a Prophet of Allah (or even Mehdi)

My point is : We should not be the ones deciding who is Muslim or who is not ... That authority/judgement lies with Allah alone

That just doesn't make any sense there are a few things that you've to agree with in order to become a Muslim its like me saying that i am a German just because i say so will that make me a German? no right because there are a few things that i have to agree with first. Mr Mirza has contradicted himself on many things and his claims are outrageous and unrealistic too. Allah has told us through Quran who is our last prophet no need to twist words of Quran now.

 

[YeBeWarned]

The new prime minister of Romania is likely to be Female Muslim so why can't we choose a new prime minister a male Hindu? Nothing wrong in it...

Perfect Recipe for Chaos , sorry but this will never work . . having a Hindu PM or President wont be you secular or means you are a open Society .. The Society Itself has to come forward to prove it , something i Admire about US that , in almost 90% of the Attacks on Muslim it was condemn and confronted by Non Muslims , US does not need to have a Muslim President to prove they are Secular or open Society .

 

[SQ8]

So you admit that you have nothing to back up your childish claim ... And No I don't need any links. I know what I am talking about ...


As for the Quranic verse you have mentioned, you are being dishonest now ... Khatam un Nabiyeen is "Seal of the Prophets" not "Last of the Prophets"

Ahmadis do consider Muhammad as the "Seal of the Prophets"

They just have a different interpretation of the term

And they are not the only ones who have interpreted this verse differently


1: Hazrat Mohyiud Din Ibni Arabi (1165 to 1240 AD) wrote in his book Fauhati Makiyya, Vol. 1, p.545

‘From the study and contemplation of the Darud we have arrived at the definite conclusion that there shall, from among the Muslims, certainly be persons whose status, in the matter of prophethood, shall advance to the level of prophets, if Allah pleases. But they shall not be given any book of law’

2: Hazrat Jalalud Din Rumi (1207 to 1273 AD) wrote in Mathnavi Maulana Rum, Chpater 1, p.53

‘Strive hard in the path of virtue in a manner so that you may be blessed with prophethood and you still be a follower’

3: Mujaddid Alf Thānī (1564 to 1624 AD) he is considered reviver of the second millennium. In Maktubat Imam Rabbani Hazrat Mujaddid Alif Thani

“The rising of a prophet after the Khatamar Rusul Hazrat Muhammad, the chosen one, peace and blessings be upon him, from among his how followers and as a heritage, does not in any way run counter to his status as the Khatamar Rusul. O ye reader, do not be among those who doubt”

4: Shah Wali Ullah (1703-1762 AD) says

“There cannot appear an independent prophet after the Holy Prophet, pease and blessings be on him, who is not his follower and his adherent” Al-Khairul Katheer, p. 111

“The meannig of the Holy Prophet being the Khataman Nabiyyeen is that there shall not now appear a person who God may appoint with a Law for mankind, that is to say, there shall now be no prophet who shall come with a new Law” – Tafheemati Ilahiyya


https://defence.pk/threads/ahmedi-c...ing-press-sealed.465268/page-10#ixzz4TtKHPfNa

Clearly you dont know how to read or nitpick like the usual mullahs(be it extremist mullahs or secular mullahs).

I mentioned that the word has its etymoligical roots in "finality" or "end", and was also used during the Prophet's time for the word seal. Try not to copy from the forum within where the thread refers to Literature printed by the same sect under discussion. It makes you look like a quick copy paster and one who is there to try and win the argument by doing google searches rather than really making the effort.

But that is what you have been doing all along.

Also allow Christians to have their own courts and Vedantists to have theirs etc.

Absolutely. We have historical precedent for this within the Life of the Prophet.

 

[TMA]

I personally do not consider Ghulam Ahmed as a Prophet of Allah (or even Mehdi)

My point is : We should not be the ones deciding who is Muslim or who is not ... That authority/judgement lies with Allah alone

Should not Muslims defend (in a non violent way) themselves from those that corrupt their religion: be it ISIS or Qaddianis? (Maybe with ISIS violence can be used?)

To stay "neutral" will mean that one of the basic FUNDAMENTALS will be corrupted.

This is not a matter of Mutashabihat but Muhkamaat.

Like there can be no interpretation of how many Gods there are, there can be no interpretation on the finality of Last Prophet (PBUH).

Now by defence I do not mean preventing them from practicing their religion or having places of worship but that it should be made clear that not accepting the finality of the Arab Prophet (PBUH) is not Islam and that any attempts at causing confusion is deception and corruption.

 

[SQ8]

The Muslim doesn't serve them because it's a Muslim nation. His priority is for the Muslims.

I don't care whose cabinet had what, if it contradicts Islam then I won't roll with it.

That female Muslim is committing a sin. Blunt truth.

How do you know? Can you provide a clear judgement of Allah he has just sent to you regarding that exact woman?

 

[JAGGA-J]

Listen, to all you guys thinking Qadiyanis are Muslim, I'm going to tell you why that's sadly not the case. I welcome anyone who disagrees to try and shift my stance, but I doubt that will happen (it will most likely be the other way around when you read these facts):

1. Ghulam Ahmad (founder of the Qadiyani movement) was known among his followers to be unstable and dependent on drugs. Drugs are forbidden in Islam unless they are used for medical purposes.

2. Ghulam Ahmad began his activities as a caller to Islam so that he could gather followers around him, then he claimed to be the Awaited Mahdi and the Promised Messiah. Then he claimed to be a Prophet and that his prophethood was higher than that of Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him). This clearly shows he is a confirmed liar. Another thing to note is that one of the main things that makes you a Muslim (among other things) is that you believe in no God but Allah and that Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) is his messenger and the final prophet. He just broke that crucial rule.

3. The Qadiyanis believe that Allah fasts, prays, sleeps, wakes up, writes, makes mistakes and has intercourse. They have essentially given him human qualities, a huge sin in Islam and not allowed. In Islam, it's believed that Allah is a far superior being with no human qualities as he is not human. He cannot make mistakes, he's perfect. You might be curious as to why Allah is referred to as a male? Well that's just because calling the creator of reality "it" would sound rather rude don't you think? And referring to Allah as a female can result in things I'd rather not talk about but I'm sure your minds can figure out.

4. The Qadianis believe that Prophethood did not end with Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him), but that it is ongoing, and that Allaah sends a messenger when there is a need, and that Ghulam Ahmad is the best of all the Prophets. Again, that's against the teachings of Islam. Just open a Quran to find out.

5. They believe that Jibreel used to come down to Ghulam Ahmad and that he used to bring revelation to him, and that his inspirations are like the Quran. Yet again, against Islam as Islam states that nothing can match the Quran, and that Islam was complete when Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) revealed it.

6. They called for the abolition of violence and called for blind obedience to the British government because, as they claimed, the British were “those in authority”. This is directly against the teachings of the prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) as he would always encourage to fight against injustice.


There are so many other things I could mention, but unless people want a thread for this I won't include everything I can think of.

Also, many Qadiyanis themselves view every Muslim as a Kaafir unless he becomes a Qadiyani, and everyone who married a non-Qadiyani is also a Kaafir. Their leader Ghulam Ahmad also stated the same thing. So why can't we do the same?

Whenever a Prophet makes a claim to be guided from Allah the exalted, virtually ALL including the closest to Him turn against him. We see this with all Prophets of Allah. Furthermore, Kufar e Mecca would make cause disinformation/ignorant allegations/conjured up lies which don't justify the realities we see with our own eyes.

In the days of Nabi (SAW) his followers were also beaten and killed and torn for reciting Qalima...masjids destroyed violence and extreme hardships imposed till Nabi (SAW) migrated and was followed and Wars imposed. So, I see Ahamdi Muslims as the jammat to follow as things are being done to them as were done to the followers of our holy master Nabi (SAW). However, they continue to expand across the globe and defend Islam based on knowledge in a manner no one else has the capacity to do.

Moreover, they build hospitals, schools, translated Quran in 72 languages, building Masjids at a mind boggling rate across the globe while the so called mulvis play with Qandeel baloch or play taliban taliban and bark kafir kafir. Honestly, one has to be a blind dog not see what the mulvis (so called ulema leftover trash & declared worst on earth by Nabi SAW) have done to the poor ignorant masses that hardly ever read the Quran much less know what the content actually means.

Remember, one rule to follow in terms of false prophet is that Allah the exalted states clearly that He is responsible for managing claimants of false Prophets and He the exalted will annihilate them. So, let Allah do his job and you try to learn something and at-least act like a human much less a Muslim.

Also, just for your information, all Muslims and virtually all other faiths are waiting for a Messiah to guide mankind and that person shall be a Prophet!. The only difference between other Muslims and Ahmadis is that Ahmadis claim Essa (as) was sent for the Jews as stated in Quran. Also Essa (as) died a natural death and the Prophet to come will come under the Sharia, the FINAL Law (QURAN) and the ummah of Nabi (SAW).

 

[Indus Pakistan]

There are not any in my neighborhood.

Hypothetical proposition.

Now there was an issue where the council initially refused saying that there is already a mosque and as the population of Muslims is not that great, another is not needed. The already present mosque was an Ahmaddiya mosque. Obviously it was not going to suffice for the local Muslims. Anyway, the local council were eventually swayed.

This does not mean the council affirmed that the other place of worship was not a Muslim mosque. We have Shia, Wahabi etc and even Kurdish Mosque all catering for differant cohort of population in my area. Existance of non negates the other.

You still failed to answer my question. Ahmadi's are as busy if not more busy in UK then in Pakistan spreading their message -

1. Have they damaged you or the Islamic community in any way as you claim they do?
2. Do you need legal protection from the state against their aggressive preaching of the Ahmadi beliefs?

And I would appreciate if you could answer these two specfic questions and the one at inception of this post. Much appreciation in advance.

 

[M. Sarmad]

The matter is quite straight forward for main stream Muslims.

Argumentum ad populum ?

 

[Hyde]

The Muslim doesn't serve them because it's a Muslim nation. His priority is for the Muslims.

I don't care whose cabinet had what, if it contradicts Islam then I won't roll with it.

That female Muslim is committing a sin. Blunt truth.

Haha that was funny

As far as I remember, there were Hindus/Non-Muslims living in this part of the world before they converted to Islam. So technically they have owned this land for thousands of years. So why not go back to Saudi Arabia and request Arabs to share their kindgom with you as you both are Muslim. I am happy to live with people who are son of the soil and have been living in harmony for centuries. We needed a Muslim nation to practice our religion freely but it doesn't mean we start supressing our minorities who didn't leave after partition for their sheer love of this land.

I would trust them any given day as our Muslim leaders have been disappointment so far.

 

[M. Sarmad]

Clearly you dont know how to read or nitpick like the usual mullahs(be it extremist mullahs or secular mullahs).

I mentioned that the word has its etymoligical roots in "finality" or "end", and was also used during the Prophet's time for the word seal. Try not to copy from the forum within where the thread refers to Literature printed by the same sect under discussion. It makes you look like a quick copy paster and one who is there to try and win the argument by doing google searches rather than really making the effort.

But that is what you have been doing all along.

I did that on purpose .. We have discussed that in detail on other threads ... The threads which always get locked when our respected mods run out of arguments ..

 

[Moonlight]

Why would I defend Mirza Sahib's words or actions ??

Listen you can simply say, we are no one to judge wether they are Muslim or not. But you are defending their wrong concepts.

 

[LA se Karachi]

Yes. She will probably be forced to go against her fellow Muslims in favour of the Kaffir. She has now chosen them over her fellow Muslims. Unless she is ignorant of Islam, she is committing a sin.

What does that mean, exactly? If I, or one of my pious Muslim friends became President, they would be committing a sin by doing so? Is it a sin in your mind to associate yourself with non-Muslims?

Morality cannot simply be defined by being Muslim alone. Both Muslims and non-Muslims can commit sins. No one has the right to declare them a sinner before they actually commit one.

 

[M. Sarmad]

Listen you can simply say, we are no one to judge wether they are Muslim or not. But you are defending their wrong concepts.

I am not defending their concepts. I am just pointing out flaws/faults in our own concepts/way of thinking

 

[Hamza913]

How do you know? Can you provide a clear judgement of Allah he has just sent to you regarding that exact woman?

Unless she is ignorant of Islamic knowledge, yes she is committing a sin. Here's your proof:

https://quran.com/3:28

https://quran.com/5:51

 

[Indus Pakistan]

So why not go back to Saudi Arabia and request Arabs to share their kindgom with you as you both are Muslim.

10/10

I am waiting for reply to this one. Expect some convoluted mental gymnastics.