Pakistan's repayments on CPEC to peak at $5b in 2022: chief economist

[Roybot]

It's Amazing How CPEC Has Made Every Indian Troll An "Expert" In Transport Economics
Transit Fees and Toll Taxes Are Charged On Use of Roads Railway Rivers and Airspace Not Ports.Port Operators Charge Port Charges For Use of It's Facilities




Ah Yes Chinese Goods Will Go To Gwadar and Then Suddenly Teleport To Dubai Completely Bypassing Port Rashid.Is That The Best Logic You Indians Can Come Up With????

Dreams Are Really Sweet Aren't They

Forget about my flags for a minute and debate this with facts.

Already showed you that Pakistan will get a pittance from the port revenue since the Chinese government owned port operator will be taking 90 percent of the revenues for the next 40 years .

Coming to the transit fees and toll charges, how much do you think Pakistan is going to charge for transit?

Suez canal generates roughly 5 Billion dollars a year, Panama Canal generates about 1 Billion a year, Eurotunnel brings in 1 Billion a year. The total toll collected on all of Germany's highway comes up to 5 billion dollars a year!

Is CPEC going to generate more revenue than Suez Canal? Not a chance.

Is the toll from CPEC related freight traffic going to be more than the toll collected from all of Germany's freight traffic? Again not a chance!!!

So how exactly is Pakistan planning to service the CPEC debt?

 

[Logicaldude]

Forget about my flags for a minute and debate this with facts.

Already showed you that Pakistan will get a pittance from the port revenue since the Chinese government owned port operator will be taking 90 percent of the revenues for the next 40 years .

Coming to the transit fees and toll charges, how much do you think Pakistan is going to charge for transit?

Suez canal generates roughly 5 Billion dollars a year, Panama Canal generates about 1 Billion a year, Eurotunnel brings in 1 Billion a year. The total toll collected on all of Germany's highway comes up to 5 billion dollars a year!

Is CPEC going to generate more revenue than Suez Canal? Not a chance.

Is the toll from CPEC related freight traffic going to be more than the toll collected from all of Germany's freight traffic? Again not a chance!!!

So how exactly is Pakistan planning to service the CPEC debt?

How does a farmer service his debt to the generous landlord? How is Sri Lanka servicing their debts due to the equally hyped hambantota port and SEZ?

By selling land and assets. That's why the zamindar gives the generous loans in the first place.

I Have heard Pakistanis making up all kinds of excuses for the lack of transparency. I do not know what world they live in. I even question if they truly care for their country more than they hate India.

 

[Roybot]

I stopped reading after this bullsh!t statement. Prove to me how you got to this number. Also, tell me what other deals are in the pipes that you have included in the number, including additional investments by other countries and expanding flow of trade and traffic. If you can't provide a full analysis, keep your personal opinions to yourself and learn from others, vs. indulging into conversations that are way above your level.

If you weren't so busy serving the CPEC Kool-Aid you could have done a simple google search and found it for yourself. Heck, it has also been posted in this very thread. Let me post it for you once again,

Minister for Ports and Shipping Mir Hasil Khan Bizenjo said today Pakistan has handed over operations of its Gwadar port to a Chinese company for a period of 40 years.

“China Overseas Port Holding Company (COPHC) has 91 per cent share of revenue collection from gross revenue of terminal and marine operations and 85 per cent share from gross revenue of free zone operation,” he added.

http://nation.com.pk/business/20-Ap...d-to-chinese-company-for-40-years-senate-told

 

[Kabira]

Hindutva logic is at work here. Anyone with couple of brain cells left knows $5 bilion figure if true by 2022 it mean China will be taking out profits. Loan is small part of CPEC, around $11 billion over the period of 30 years at 1% interest rate.

Pakistan isn't going to pay back that loan in couple of years

 

[Roybot]

Hindutva logic is at work here. Anyone with couple of brain cells left knows $5 bilion figure if true by 2022 it mean China will be taking out profits. Loan is small part of CPEC, around $11 billion over the period of 30 years at 1% interest rate.

Pakistan isn't going to pay back that loan in couple of years

lmao so the Chief economist of Pakistan is talking about offsetting profits by profits?

Pakistan’s debt and other repayments on China’s “Belt and Road” initiative will peak at around $5 billion in 2022, but will be more than offset by transit fees charged on the new transport corridor, says the Pakistan government’s chief economist.

 

[DJ_Viper]

If you weren't so busy serving the CPEC Kool-Aid you could have done a simple google search and found it for yourself. Heck, it has also been posted in this very thread. Let me post it for you once again,


http://nation.com.pk/business/20-Ap...d-to-chinese-company-for-40-years-senate-told


http://maritime-executive.com/article/pakistan-gives-china-a-40-year-lease-for-gwadar-port

Give me some credible argument....some analysis, some real industry experts putting some numbers together. I believe in numbers, numbers predict everything, they don't lie. Your post, is useless piece of crap till you provide numbers, in terms of how Pakistan will be paying for the CPEC debt for 40 years and won't make a dime. I told you before, you get into it with me, you better have your facts straight or you'll feel like you are getting insulted. I don't have patience for bullsh!t and childish silly arguments. I will however commend you if you wrote a factual analysis backed up by numbers. I am not here to listen to childish drama because you guys have born beef with the Pakistanis.

lmao so the Chief economist of Pakistan is talking about offsetting profits by profits?

Pakistan’s debt and other repayments on China’s “Belt and Road” initiative will peak at around $5 billion in 2022, but will be more than offset by transit fees charged on the new transport corridor, says the Pakistan government’s chief economist.

Take a look at your own post above......"will be more than offset by transit fees", meaning the utilization of the trade route will bring more revenue that would result in the CPEC payments being a small fraction of the money return.

Do me a favor, let's see if you fully understand the CPEC here, and you can show us that you know what you are talking about. Write me a small paragraph and tell me what would happen in Pakistan after the CPEC becomes operational. Let's see if you even remotely get it. Otherwise, you continue to troll and I'll request the mods to ban you.

 

[Kabira]

Pakistan’s debt and other repayments on China’s “Belt and Road” initiative will peak at around $5 .

See that other is profits from telecom, power plants etc which Chinese companies will take out. And that to by 2022 and most importantly it will peak at $5b if true.

 

[Roybot]

Give me some credible argument....some analysis, some real industry experts putting some numbers together. I believe in numbers, numbers predict everything, they don't lie. Your post, is useless piece of crap till you provide numbers, in terms of how Pakistan will be paying for the CPEC debt for 40 years and won't make a dime. I told you before, you get into it with me, you better have your facts straight or you'll feel like you are getting insulted. I don't have patience for bullsh!t and childish silly arguments. I will however commend you if you wrote a factual analysis backed up by numbers. I am not here to listen to childish drama because you guys have born beef with the Pakistanis.

A Statement from Pakistan's minister for ports and shipping, given to the senate is not credible enough for you? It doesn't matter how much traffic Gwadar port and the related infrastructure will see, or how much investment is made in the Gwadar SEZ, the Chinese government will take 90 percent of all the revenue generated for the next 40 years, leaving 10 percent for the Pakistanis. Not just that, Pakistan will have all have to repay the debt along with interest.

So in simple words, China built a 10 billion dollars port on Pakistani land, it will take 90 per cent of all the revenue generated by it for the next 40 years, and to top it all off Pakistan will have to repay that 10 billion dollars + interest back to China.

If this is not the deal of the century then I don't know what is!

Take a look at your own post above......"will be more than offset by transit fees", meaning the utilization of the trade route will bring more revenue that would result in the CPEC payments being a small fraction of the money return.

I am just gonna avoid your ad hominem attacks and focus on the topic.

The chief economist of the government will obviously have to claim that all is ok. He can't go around saying oh we have no idea where the money to repay the debt is going to come from

I have already given the example of German road freight annual revenue as a reference, it sits at 5 Billion dollars. So unless you are telling me the CPEC road freight volume is going to be more than all of Germany's road freight, I can't see where this 5 Billion dollars is going to come from.

And yes go ahead and request the mods to ban me for raising difficult questions!

See that other is profits from telecom, power plants etc which Chinese companies will take out. And that to by 2022 and most importantly it will peak at $5b if true.

Profits from power plants and telecom? goes to the company that operate them not to the Pakistan government. The government only gets the tax collected from these projects.

I hope you know that if a company says that it is going to invest 1 Billion dollars in Pakistan, it doesn't mean 1 Billion dollars in the Pakistan government's coffers! The company that will invest that money will take the profits. All Pakistan government will get is the tax!

 

[Kabira]

Profits from power plants and telecom? goes to the company that operate them not to the Pakistan government. The government only gets the tax collected from these projects.

I hope you know that, if a company says that it is going to invest 1 Billion dollars in Pakistan, it doesn't mean 1 Billion dollars in the Pakistan government's coffers! The company that will invest that money will take the profits. All Pakistan will get is the tax!

And I hope by now you know that $5b isn't actually Pakistani government paying back to China. I repeat loan is small part of CPEC which is going to be payed back in 30 years at 1% interest rate.

 

[Roybot]

And I hope by now you know that $5b isn't actually Pakistani government paying back to China. I repeat loan is small part of CPEC which is going to be payed back in 30 years at 1% interest rate.

I doesn't matter who Pakistan is paying it back to, whether it is to the Chinese government, a Chinese company (most of them are state owned btw) or any other national or international company. Fact is Pakistan will have to repay 5 billion dollars in 2022. And this 5 billion dollar is just the peak repayment in one year

Profit generated goes straight to the pockets of the company, why would Pakistan have to "Repay" the profits.

 

[Kabira]

I doesn't matter who Pakistan is paying it back to, whether it is to the Chinese government, a Chinese company (most of them are state owned btw) or any other national or international company. Fact is Pakistan will have to repay 5 billion dollars in 2022. And this 5 billion dollar is just the peak repayment in one year

Profit generated goes straight to the pockets of the company, why would Pakistan have to "Repay" the profits.

And who said Pakistan (government) will pay back? You are not that stupid so why act like one? When Chinese companies take $ out of Pakistan it doesn't mean state is paying them.

 

[Roybot]

And who said Pakistan (government) will pay back? You are not that stupid so why act like one? When Chinese companies take $ out of Pakistan it doesn't mean state is paying them.

So who has to pay this 5 billion dollars?

Pakistan’s debt and other repayments on China’s “Belt and Road” initiative will peak at around $5 billion in 2022

And what happens if Pakistan doesn't reach the target of 6-8 Billion dollars(talk about ambitious) in toll tax and rental fees by 2020 as being claimed the chief economist?

For comparison, Germany's annual toll revenue is only 5 Billion dollars.

“The kind of toll tax, rental fees that the Pakistani system will gain is roughly $6-$8 billion a year,” Javaid, chief economist at the planning ministry, said in an interview. “By 2020, I expect we will get this much momentum.”

 

[DJ_Viper]

A Statement from Pakistan's minister for ports and shipping, given to the senate is not credible enough for you? It doesn't matter how much traffic Gwadar port and the related infrastructure will see, or how much investment is made in the Gwadar SEZ, the Chinese government will take 90 percent of all the revenue generated for the next 40 years, leaving 10 percent for the Pakistanis. Not just that, Pakistan will have all have to repay the debt along with interest.

So in simple words, China built a 10 billion dollars port on Pakistani land, it will take 90 per cent of all the revenue generated by it for the next 40 years, and to top it all off Pakistan will have to repay that 10 billion dollars + interest back to China.

If this is not the deal of the century then I don't kn

Is that how it works? So what about human population around this route? Ever thought about what will happen around this empty land for over 1000 KM's long highway? If you can't understand it, don't respond as you are just trolling without having the brain capacity to understand the real picture. A port is just a port, it is not what the Pakistan is excited for, or will grow Pakistan leaps and bounds. Its what I mentioned above....what would happen to over a 1000 KM's of empty area around this route. Between US East Coast, from Miami to say Washington DC is about a 1000 or so KM. That area has over a few trillions of traffic, trade, businesses, homes, commercial buildings, small and mid sized businesses supporting the local communities and creating city level economies. That is what would happen across the ENTIRE 1000+ km of this empty area. This route is exactly where the US was in 1960's when they started to build the I95 that connects the entire Eastern Seabord of the US! And now that highway has trilling worth of real estate and businesses and trade taking place from it. Pakistan will get the same, these new cities will be developed with local economies. If there is a new city built every 10 KM's, in theory a 100 more cities can be born out of the 1000 KM area, and a couple of more ports. So that can easily double or tripple up Pakistan's GDP. If you don't want to use you brain for about 5 minutes and understand what a trade oriented highway brings to a nation, I don't have a reason to feed to silly trolls.

 

[Kabira]

So who has to pay this 5 billion dollars?



And what happens if Pakistan doesn't reach the target of 6-8 Billion dollars(talk about ambitious) in toll tax and rental fees by 2020 as being claimed the chief economist?

For comparison, Germany's annual toll revenue is only 5 Billion dollars.

Pakistan state doesn't have to pay back $5b per year from 2022. When citizen pay his electricity bill, part of that will go out of Pakistan to China. Still difficult?

Pakistan will increase tax revenues on basis of increased commercial activity and GDP growth rate thanks to CPEC. This year Pakistan GDP growth rate will be 6%, next year should pass 7%.

 

[Glorino]

Repayment is painful -cannot repay turn to Multilateral organisation like IMF. Remember in UK living there, a West Indian girl unable to pay her monthly rent - the middle aged landlord was screwing her loudly such that I was delayed leaving my house for work. Getting a loan from IMF comes with many strict conditions, China is more flexible-give large part of territory to China - it brings very big smile to Pakistani generals