Pakistan’s PL-15 Missile Equipped JF-17 Block 3 is a Serious Game Changer - How India Can Respond to

[Basel]

Jf 17 is no worries for India...

Half Tejas Mk1a is more then enough to deal with..
Just need to more focus on Astra AA missile with range approx 150-200 km.

We have bigger challenges from China because they have sufficient number of advanced fighter planes..

Similar things were said about Mig-21 Bison and other IAF birds like M2Ks, Mig-29s etc.

But then 27th February 2019 happened and IAF start running to upgrade its capabilities.

 

[dbc]

Chinese air to air missiles are very capable

How do you know? As with all things Chinese, there is very little data in the public domain to support any conclusion.

 

[Khanivore]

R-77 Is more Reliable than Any Chinese AAM Due To Reputation of Vympel NPO Which Making Missiles From 50+ years
Like Raytheon For AIM-120

Vympel NPO's "reputation" did nothing to help the Indian air force on 27-Feb-19. But if it reassures the IAF, who are we to disagree.

 

[litman]

some people were saying that pl 15 cant be fired by jf 17 block 2 as its radar's range is limited as compare to the missile's range so i have a question regarding the use of BVRAAMs.if a country develops a very long range BVR missile with range greater then 200 kms then can that missile be fitted directly onto a modified AWACS air craft?? the AWACS air crafts are larger ,have long ranged AESA radar so if an AWACS air craft is modified to emply a long range BVR missiles then the missiles will getting the initial guidance from a very capable radar system. when BVR missiles can be modified to be used as SAMs then why not on an AWACS?

 

[Blacklight]

some people were saying that pl 15 cant be fired by jf 17 block 2 as its radar's range is limited as compare to the missile's range so i have a question regarding the use of BVRAAMs.if a country develops a very long range BVR missile with range greater then 200 kms then can that missile be fitted directly onto a modified AWACS air craft?? the AWACS air crafts are larger ,have long ranged AESA radar so if an AWACS air craft is modified to emply a long range BVR missiles then the missiles will getting the initial guidance from a very capable radar system. when BVR missiles can be modified to be used as SAMs then why not on an AWACS?

There is a payload limitation with AWACS, it is simply not possible. On the other hand a cargo lifter like a C130 could do to he heavy work, and the AWACS would do the rest. But to protect these assets you would still need escorts.

Since you have opened a very interesting line of thought, here is something which might be of interest to you:
Gremlin Drone's First Flight Turns C-130 Into a Flying Aircraft Carrier

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

If I were an Indian strategist I would have panicked!!! Especially, the way Turkey made Shish Kebap out of the Russian AD systems in Syria and served them with Vodka to the Russians present in the front!!! And, how TuAF successfully used link based BVR, carried and fired by an F16 with RADAR off, guidance from AWACs to hit SUs thanks to the Turkish EW systems!! More are in the pipeline - MEHPOD for individual fighters, HAVASOJ - especially modified EW air assets etc.

If Pak leverages the above it means each JF will have its own attack philosophy and implementation!! Not two attack modes will be same....

 

[airmarshal]

According to Indians, Chini maal doesnt work.

Hence India is SupaPowa2020

Also according to Indian sources, Su-30MKI has no comparison. Its a far superior jet than all the jets PAF has. Ever after Feb 27th 2019 with plenty of evidence Su30 being shot down, their superiority complex and denial has no limits.

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

Also according to Indian sources, Su-30MKI has no comparison. Its a far superior jet than all the jets PAF has. Ever after Feb 27th 2019 with plenty of evidence Su30 being shot down, their superiority complex and denial has no limits.

Bas kya, itna bhi mat pheko ki koi lapate hi na sake..

Similar things were said about Mig-21 Bison and other IAF birds like M2Ks, Mig-29s etc.

But then 27th February 2019 happened and IAF start running to upgrade its capabilities.

It was about missile range only... It has rectified by purchasing newer missile with range 100-120 km.

 

[Bengal71]

According to Indians, Chini maal doesnt work.

Hence India is SupaPowa2020

But it's almost May in 2020 and affected by coronavirus. It will be 2021 soon, then what will happen to them?

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

But Raj believes IAF official claims but doesn't believe an f16 was shot down even though the IAF is adamant it did, wow I am amazed at the logic of the guy.

I never said that I believe on any claim, i belived that no f16 shoot down by IAF, and no Su 30mki by PAF.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

India can respond by picking up their pilot with cup of tea

 

[Tumba]

JF-17 BLK1/2/3 doesn't have any impact on strategic or tactical balance of Air Force superiority India enjoys.

Indian Air Force is retiring a Mig-21 and inducting either a Su-30MKI or Tejas Mk1 or a Rafale in replacement... every single of these fighters are multitude more capable than a Mig-21 so even if there is no one on one replacements still this makes IAF much more capable.
India can source weapon systems from both West and Russia also Indian military industries are becoming more and more capable with passing time.

Against PL-15

India is/will deploy following options with similar or greater capabilities:

Meteor
R-27
Astra Mk2
Astra SFDR

All these missile are around 150 or more in range.

Include Air Defense systems like

Barak-8
S-400

I don't think PL-15 deployed on a light fighter gives Paf any advantage over India even after that Paf is still dependent of few dozens of F-16 BLK50/52s for putting any kind of challenge..

 

[Syed1.]

JF-17 BLK1/2/3 doesn't have any impact on strategic or tactical balance of Air Force superiority India enjoys.

Indian Air Force is retiring a Mig-21 and inducting either a Su-30MKI or Tejas Mk1 or a Rafale in replacement... every single of these fighters are multitude more capable than a Mig-21 so even if there is no one on one replacements still this makes IAF much more capable.
India can source weapon systems from both West and Russia also Indian military industries are becoming more and more capable with passing time.

Against PL-15

India is/will deploy following options with similar or greater capabilities:

Meteor
R-27
Astra Mk2
Astra SFDR

All these missile are around 150 or more in range.

Include Air Defense systems like

Barak-8
S-400

I don't think PL-15 deployed on a light fighter gives Paf any advantage over India even after that Paf is still dependent of few dozens of F-16 BLK50/52s for putting any kind of challenge..

We saw that "air superiority" on 27th February 2019 where your Raptors of the East, SU-30 firmly tucked their tails between their legs and made a run for it. While Abhinandan was jammed to the point of blindness and didn't even know he had entered Pakistani airspace. Your Air Command wet its diaper and shot down its own search and rescue helicopter that was looking for the shot down SU-30.


So much for air superiority.


Please put down that glass of cow urine.

 

[Signalian]

This psyche of a missile as a war winner, an aircraft or tank that can conquer any adversary in the battlefield - this is like idol worshiping. Although an Atom Bomb brought end to WW2, but this is not the case anymore. No one weapon can ascertain the outcome of war - except a human's mind ofcourse. Even a nuclear bomb has a counter to it - if an ABM, a SAM falls short, then the second strike capability through another medium for nuclear strike. Same thing with stealth, there are sensors/antennas combined with strategies that can detect stealth.

It is so ironic, JF-17, an aircraft that was put aside as a Souped up Mig-21, a fighter that was considered a poor man's F-16 being modern but light weight with lesser payload and everyone looked looked towards J-10 as the new mainstay of PAF since JF-17 is just a replacement aircraft for older PAF 3rd gen aircraft. PAF had a different vision about JF-17 and now the adversary has started taking it seriously. JF-17 just cant be written off from the battlefield, it has gained its tenacity by leaps and bounds.

Maybe a decade or two later, a 500 km ranged AAM shows up and by that time, maybe laser defenses are the new technology while towed decoy is a default on every fighter aircraft. Three to four decades later, unmanned Fighter squadron would have been inducted. Every weapon that is put in operation and considered cutting edge - be it a missile, aircraft, tank, ship, sub whatever, will have a counter to it sooner or later.

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

Well no, you are the KLJ-7A's detection range actually means something. Read what i had tagged you in before.

The KLJ-7A can actually make effective use of its detection range, the IRBIS-E cant.

"The N035E radar has some interesting features, for example it is capable of detecting a target at extended ranges (350km) if it's only required to scan a small area (about the size of the HUD)."

You can refer to this PLAAF report that confirms the IRBIS-E is inferior to the current gen of Chinese AESA's.

https://www.reddit.com/r/path%3D%252Fr%252FLessCredibleDefence%252Fcomments%252Fajx4bx%252F

I have responded to this in another comment. Please refer to that for the answer to this.

Actually, you are missing few points
1. Rafale with meteor missile 6/per aircraft as needed. ( if I m not wrong then jf 17 - max 2 p15 missiles/aircraft)

2.Indian will get all rafale before 2024 and Pakistan with get 50, jf 17 (approx) in 2025...

So till 2027, pAF will not able to think to get technological advantage over IAF.

Meanwhile, hal tejas mk1a will be available with Astra block -2 missiles (150-200 km) before 2025.

Su 30 mki will be upgraded to latest technology with 37m missiles (150-300 km)

Hal Tejas Mark 2 will also be available maximum from 2027...with Astra block -2 missiles (150-200 km)