Pakistan's Own BVRAAM under Project Azm.

[Ahmet Pasha]

I meant it in a lighthearted/jovial manner. Sometimes we need someone to remind us where we are lacking. And I do agree with you view that PAF missed many oppurtunities because of their lackluster "afsar" attitude.

Please refrain from making personal comments---and stay within your limits---.

 

[cabatli_53]

why would you waste time to reinvent the wheel and waste resources, there is something called practicality

should Pakistan build its own engine for JF17?
how about ASEA radar?
how about the EW suite?

No and No, Chinese spent decades and even now ASEA is not ready Pakistan can spend the entire 21st century

no there is no sense in this kind of patriotism If thats what you want to call it

should Pakistan fit its own IFR?
how about composites?
how about landing gear?

Yes and Yes, PAF has limited budget and it needs to address the important issue first

there is common sense required here, you do/do not realise how complicated a ultra long range air to air missile is?

the seeker alone would take years of draining our resources and we would be 10% of the way there and even if it mastered it the components would never be a advanced as Chinese or American we dont have the core technology and Chinese could easily stop the integration process if they changed the source codes

lets make our own satellite and our own GPS? how about core nuclear reactors and then go bankrupt?

theres being ambitious and theres having a inflated view of ourselves

certain things will benefit us if we do it ourselves others we will lose

a country like ours have limited resources we cant start dreaming of everything indigenous, rather develop what we can and buy what we cant

COVID pandemic ? Even UK bought ventilators from China and so did US, Pakistan is more developed than UK and US? again level headed thinking is needed here

Being realistic is important factor to find the defficiencies but It is no need to be such pessimist bro. The technologies have natural ties among eachother so once you successfully developed a working prototype, It can be evolved into other systems working with similar principles. For exm. Radars. Develop a solid state X band PESA with foreign TR modules. No need to risk the project with AESA at first attempt. This knowledge will allow engineers to miniaturize it to develop a seeker head for a missile. Configure the software, frequency, and modules to develop a counter battery radar, early warning radar..etc Later, you can develop domestic subsystems step by step. Superiority will come with the level of maturity of engineers and feedbacks of Armed forces personnal. What Pakistan should firstly do is to join into international projects to accumulate the knowledge/information/technologies to apply them for own solutions. That is what countries trying to localize the products, are doing in high tech sector. Later, You can boost the efforts with national R&D processes at higher standarts but First of all, Pakistan needs a reliable and generous partner to work together on big programs. Pakistan did it with Milgem and you will see How the project will evolve into developing national warships thanks to the knowledge gained at Milgem. Same should be done for other sectors as well.

 

[CHI RULES]

problem is we also have an inferiority complex...experts like Shahid Lateef who initaited the project is telling is that JF17 bl3 is far better than f16 blk 52 but we have people here saying no we need f16.
so no matter how good the missile is people will say let's buy American or Chinese.

Sir may be Mr Shahid has more knowledge about gadgets going to be installed on Block 3 which are not known to others. Only time and future shall prove the true colors. However If I am not wrong even two experts in similar field may also have difference of opinion.

 

[Trango Towers]

Sir may be Mr Shahid has more knowledge about gadgets going to be installed on Block 3 which are not known to others. Only time and future shall prove the true colors. However If I am not wrong even two experts in similar field may also have difference of opinion.

absolutely correct.
a lightweight fighter thats highly agile with a good ASEA radar and missiles to match and aggressive Pakistani pilots will be a good fight against any aircraft out there. people here only dis the JF17 because its light weight. but its also cost-effective and bang for buck we can get more aircraft in the air.

 

[damm1t]

Very good development. Nice to hear that bro. Is it developed by Rocketsan ?

No bro it's a TUBİTAK project called Göktuğ.

For MMU or present fleet??

In my very humble and in experienced opinion yes it is awesome to have a BVRAAM program. In parallel we should focus on EW, jamming and figure new ways of introducing new cloak and dager tech and tactics in air warfare. 27th Feb and how Israelis disguised on of their special mission/ELINT airplanes to fool Russo/Syrian air defence shows how beneficial EW can be in air battles.

This is how Turkish drones hunted down Russian AD systems. By the way since we are the manufacturer of misslies and we have the source code of F-16s we can integrate those missiles on any platform without pain. Be it TF-X, Drones, F-35( ! ) and F-16s.

 

[RadarGudumluMuhimmat]

No bro it's a TUBİTAK project called Göktuğ.



This is how Turkish drones hunted down Russian AD systems. By the way since we are the manufacturer of misslies and we have the source code of F-16s we can integrate those missiles on any platform without pain. Be it TF-X, Drones, F-35( ! ) and F-16s.

Important subsystems such as rocket engines and radar are met by roketsan and aselsan, and most likely the data link module is the by meteksan.

 

[KaiserX]

Why do we need to build BVR missiles from scratch? We can set up manufactering units to build PL-15 with TOT

 

[MM_Haider]

It would be nice to have our own missile

Considering positive work done with Anza electronics fire and forget systems
It would be not difficult to develop a BVR Missile which can also be available in abundance

Pakistan has already masted larger Missile Systems , such as Raad


Ar-Rasub (Arabic: الرسَّوب‎) BVR?

To have it completely indigenous we need to develop ICs first .. work on nano technology .. otherwise it won’t work! Period!

 

[aziqbal]

I think people have the right intentions but little knowledge on what they are proposing

those proposing a 5th generation long range AAM do you know how rocket motors work and what experience Pakistan has in this field ? what about guidance system, datalink , seeker and internal and external guidance?

ridiculous to propose things without any knowledge of what you are proposing or the technical challenges

much better to design and build ATGM and MANPADS they would be more beneficial yes we can do that

increasing the input into JF17 Block III like more composites and IFR these are things that will benefit us

some fanboy proposed a indigenous engine for JF17? total fanboy dreams just getting ridiculous, lets be sensible and realistic

 

[araz]

Then why not PAF used them on the occasion of 27/02?

Do they don't have faith on them?

They should use it with AmRAAMs....

at least we can test on them on real action.

2 misslies were launched as orders were given to launch those only. They both hit their mark. Why SD10A was not used and why C5s were used maybe due to the planes that had the locks. So not having used them does not mean they are not integrated or PAF has less confidence on them.
A

 

[Black Bird]

You are right. If the officials are not discussing such projects then we shouldn't discuss about these things. We should talk about those what we have.

Who is this shahid guy?

And why do you consider him so sacred that his words are to be taken too seriously?

I mean, I am not saying that we can't make it or that there is not possibility that we are working on.
But should only belive official sources.
Pakistanis in general have developed this habbit of taking about random stuff and claiming to have more knowledge then the person in charge.
If you would ask a random pakistani, they would tell you the extraordinary capability we have and hidden it to be used later or revealed at the proper time.
Just like we are not drilling oil because foreigners would steal it.
We are getting jf17s during pm trip to USA, and people here have sworn and confirmed. Yet nothing happened. These are just fanboys near these big personalities. They ask random questions and get random one liners. They come here and make a thread about it.
Nothing more.

 

[Rafale+Meteor+Spectra]

Schaeid is not at all a reliable source.

 

[GriffinsRule]

Here is an interesting video on DCS about AIM-120C5s max range under optimal conditions against a large, non-maneuvering target in a head to head engagement ...just under 85nm

 

[Akh1112]

Here is an interesting video on DCS about AIM-120C5s max range under optimal conditions against a large, non-maneuvering target in a head to head engagement ...just under 85nm

Please, please, please do not use DCS as a source of information. While the aircraft may be somewhat realistic (keyword, somewhat) the missile dynamics are far from it, it is not to be used as a means of credible information.

 

[Trango Towers]

Why do we need to build BVR missiles from scratch? We can set up manufactering units to build PL-15 with TOT

Oh dear....why not improve on the pl15 and build your own ??? Why do have to always be a follower when you have the God given right to be a leader?