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Pakistan's former envoy to U.S. caught in web of scandal

You're welcome. Yes, it could very well happen in other countries, but with consequences for everyone involved. And it's not the Officer or by-standers I have problem with, but the 4 men themselves who didn't think twice before beating a teenager half of their age. But I don't see any point in whining since I've chose to live in this country. As for the Army, It doesn't interfere in Provinces of Sindh and Punjab physcially, who dominate the country almost in every aspect of life. And USUALLY, as long as it's not the them who're suffering at the hands of Army or ISI, they could care less of their role in KPK, Balochistan, Kashmir, India and elsewhere. That includes myself too, I've never protested against Army's Role in Balochistan or anywhere, despite I know it's wrong and inhumane.
 
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You're welcome. Yes, it could very well happen in other countries, but with consequences for everyone involved. And it's not the Officer or by-standers I have problem with, but the 4 men themselves who didn't think twice before beating a teenager half of their age. But I don't see any point in whining since I've chose to live in this country. As for the Army, It doesn't interfere in Provinces of Sindh and Punjab physcially, who dominate the country almost in every aspect of life. And USUALLY, as long as it's not the them who're suffering at the hands of Army or ISI, they could care less of their role in KPK, Balochistan, Kashmir, India and elsewhere. That includes myself too, I've never protested against Army's Role in Balochistan or anywhere, despite I know it's wrong and inhumane.

Thanks. Just out of curiosity, did you try to file charges in the police after you were beaten? To complain to any authority?

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Could you provide documented proof proving that the Army refused to provide security to Haqqani?

The remarks of Haqqani and his lawyer clearly suggest it. Otherwise why he lives in PM House?
 
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No. For some reasons, I didn't want parents to know that there even was such an incident, so I let it go.
 
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nirreich Internal Security is handled by Interior Ministry not Pakistan Armed Forces unless we are talking about areas specifically handed to Pakistan Armed Forces such as FATA.What hussainshah is taking about is Pakistan Police which is corrupt but Armed Forces are completely different entity.Pakistan Military is the strongest institution (this strength comes from people's support) in Pakistan which is relatively much less corrupt then other institutions and keeps the country united and ensures that our interests are not sold out by the corrupted rich elite who rule Pakistan.If the civilian leaders were honest the population would not support Armed Forces to act against Civilian Government but the civilian government is so corrupt that Pakistanis actually celebrate a COUP and Pakistan Army actually care about public opinion when Musharraf become unpopular Pakistan Army stopped supporting him and he was ousted by the people of Pakistan.Pretty much 90%+ Pakistani Population support Armed Forces.On the other hand if we had clean Politician serving as PM (Someone like Imran Khan) and Army tried to meddle then Pakistani Population would come out on streets against the Armed Forces.You are foreigner so you don't understand how Pakistani Civilian rulers have raped and plundered the country.Musharraf was much better then Zardari (in fact no comparison) and others.It was only due to his foreign policy that Pakistani People disliked him.These civilian leaders are corrupt beyond your understanding.The Generals are patriotic persons who come from the middle class.Haqqani committed mistakes and now he wants to hide under the facade of democracy.At the end of the day it's all about power.If these fools were providing good services to the nation then Army would not dare talk against them much less touch them.These people please you guys in the same of democracy, secularism etc but they are A-Class a$$holes.You would never want such people to be PM of Israel.Remember Pakistan's democracy is not like America's democracy.These guys have civil servants, judges, police in their pockets so there is no legal way to prosecute them.
 
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nirreich Internal Security is handled by Interior Ministry not Pakistan Armed Forces unless we are talking about areas specifically handed to Pakistan Armed Forces such as FATA.What hussainshah is taking about is Pakistan Police which is corrupt but Armed Forces are completely different entity.Pakistan Military is the strongest institution (this strength comes from people's support) in Pakistan which is relatively much less corrupt then other institutions and keeps the country united and ensures that our interests are not sold out by the corrupted rich elite who rule Pakistan.If the civilian leaders were honest the population would not support Armed Forces to act against Civilian Government but the civilian government is so corrupt that Pakistanis actually celebrate a COUP and Pakistan Army actually care about public opinion when Musharraf become unpopular Pakistan Army stopped supporting him and he was ousted by the people of Pakistan.Pretty much 90%+ Pakistani Population support Armed Forces.On the other hand if we had clean Politician serving as PM (Someone like Imran Khan) and Army tried to meddle then Pakistani Population would come out on streets against the Armed Forces.You are foreigner so you don't understand how Pakistani Civilian rulers have raped and plundered the country.Musharraf was much better then Zardari (in fact no comparison) and others.It was only due to his foreign policy that Pakistani People disliked him.These civilian leaders are corrupt beyond your understanding.The Generals are patriotic persons who come from the middle class.Haqqani committed mistakes and now he wants to hide under the facade of democracy.At the end of the day it's all about power.If these fools were providing good services to the nation then Army would not dare talk against them much less touch them.These people please you guys in the same of democracy, secularism etc but they are A-Class a$$holes.You would never want such people to be PM of Israel.Remember Pakistan's democracy is not like America's democracy.These guys have civil servants, judges, police in their pockets so there is no legal way to prosecute them.

I agree with your description of your civil masters, but disagree with your illustration of the Army has an outsider and not part of the problem. The generals are no less corrupted than the civilians and have all kinds of perks: from property to lands and bank accounts. They control a vast economic empire which its share is about 20% of the Pakistani economy. The defence budget is 20%and most of it allocated to the improved life standards of officers and military cantonments.

There is a reason why the police and MOI or so incompetent and the civil corruption is only part of the explanation: the civilian government was constantly emasculated by the defence establishment, and its incompetent is mainly the result of the agenda of the Army which aspire to have weak governments and incompetent civil service so no one could challenge its dominant position and its control over national affairs.

Haqqani hides in the PM House because the security forces are after him, it is so obvious. Haqqani is one of their strong opponents and finally the ISI and defence establishment found the opportunity to settle the score with him with this "memo-gate" nonsense. Haqqani is hardly a saint, but he does not deserve to be under life threats because he criticises the Army. The clear attempt to hush him is mainly the interest of the defence establishment, and no doubt that his lack of protection is the result. As I mentioned mysteriously anyone criticising the Army suffer from mysterious unfortunate accidents that sometimes cost him his life.
 
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SERIOUSLY, guy? How do you think Democracy has prevailed so far without people's support? You say Politicians petty corruptions have raped and plundered Pakistan, how do you explain atrocities in East-Pakistan and separation, Killings in Balochistan, Violation of Article 6 of the constitution multiple times, Manhandling of The Chief Justice to name a few. As corrupt as a Civilian leader may be, at the end of the day, he's elected by the people of Pakistan. End Of Story.
 
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Sorry to disappoint you, but the Israeli Army do not intentional kill activists who sympathise with Palestinians. Some of my best friends confront the Army and demonstrate against current policy, and still they live quite good with no fear for their lives.

As for Pakistan, my proof is that Haqqani hides in PM House because the security agencies do not care or do not want to protect him, so their approach is equivalent to encouraging his assassination. This is their job!


Let me wake u up from Wet dream, DO U REMEMBER Flotilla incident. Im sure u r living on earth.
 
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Let me wake u up from Wet dream, DO U REMEMBER Flotilla incident. Im sure u r living on earth.

Of course I remember: it was an incident where a bunch of terrorists tried to break a legitimate maritime blockade, attacked with cold blood Israeli security forces, including kidnapping a soldier, shooting and stabbing others, and an attempt to bring down an helicopter. In return Israeli soldiers defended themselves and neutralised the terrorists not before forcing to shoot nine of them in a clear act of self defence.

If the protesters of Bahrain could only enjoy the relaxed and sensitive approach of f Israeli security forces and not KSA one, then much more of them could still be alive.
 
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No sir...such killings only make things worse...Rule of law should be respected by all corners everywhere...If he is indeed a traitor then he should be booked and should be proved guilty in court...Let the law takes it own course....Just imagine what kind of feeling i as an outsider will get about Pakistan...A person who was a diplomat few months ago have to hide in PM's house to save his life...horrific, no??
we damn care about outsider.. first we need internal clean up... first think out ur country dnt try to poke in other countries affairs

---------- Post added at 06:19 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:19 PM ----------

No sir...such killings only make things worse...Rule of law should be respected by all corners everywhere...If he is indeed a traitor then he should be booked and should be proved guilty in court...Let the law takes it own course....Just imagine what kind of feeling i as an outsider will get about Pakistan...A person who was a diplomat few months ago have to hide in PM's house to save his life...horrific, no??
we damn care about outsider.. first we need internal clean up... first think out ur country dnt try to poke in other countries affairs :angry:
 
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we damn care about outsider.. first we need internal clean up... first think out ur country dnt try to poke in other countries affairs:angry:


Well ideally you should report my post in case you think i am crossing the line...However one quick question - what else do you expect people to do on a discussion forum apart from sharing and reading opinions of fellow members???
 
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A man is innocent until it is proven otherwise. But not in Pakistan

CAN YOU PLEASE TELL THIS TO YOUR ARMY
they kill innocents in gaza without any court ....
 
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Of course I remember: it was an incident where a bunch of terrorists tried to break a legitimate maritime blockade, attacked with cold blood Israeli security forces, including kidnapping a soldier, shooting and stabbing others, and an attempt to bring down an helicopter. In return Israeli soldiers defended themselves and neutralised the terrorists not before forcing to shoot nine of them in a clear act of self defence.

If the protesters of Bahrain could only enjoy the relaxed and sensitive approach of f Israeli security forces and not KSA one, then much more of them could still be alive.

You remember the person who leaked your Nuclear secrets and compromised your national security? How your Mossad kidnapped him from London and bought him back to Israel.

The same case is with Ambassador Haqqani. He is called with dignity to face trail and if you know so much, then did you know the this haqqani case is in Supreme court and they will judge hum guilty or not then where does Pakistan Amy or ISI came in them? Are they influencing the Supreme court decision in any way that you are bringing PA and ISI in the discussion.

And third thing, why Army and ISI will kill him when the Case is in Supreme? Logic tell us, these are just political statements to discredit those who accused him.
 
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And Pakistan's glorious security forces cannot protect his life or cannot be trusted, so he hides in the PM House! (This is what you said)

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Husain Haqqani interview: 'If I leave my house, I fear I will be killed'

Husain Haqqani, Pakistan's embattled former ambassador to Washington, fears he will be murdered if he leaves his sanctuary in the official residence of the country's prime minister Yusuf Raza Gilani.

In an exclusive interview with The Daily Telegraph on Tuesday, he said he has been branded a 'traitor' and a 'Washington lackey' by 'powerful quarters' – a reference to the country's powerful ISI intelligence agency – and that he now fears he will be murdered like his friend, the late governor of Punjab, Salman Taseer, who was shot dead by one of his own security guards last year after being branded a 'blasphemer.'

Mr Haqqani was forced to resign last year after a Pakistani-American businessman claimed he had asked him to pass on a memo to the American government calling for their help to oust Islamabad's military leadership.

The businessman, Mansoor Ijaz, said the memo contained an offer, backed by President Asif Zardari, that if Washington helped to oust the current military leadership, a new 'national security' team would disband the Army unit which collaborates with the Taliban and other anti-Western militant groups.

He was recalled from Washington and now faces a Supreme Court commission inquiry amid accusations that he betrayed his country by colluding with the United States to compromise its sovereignty and territorial integrity.

Both President Zardari and Mr Haqqani have denied any involvement in the 'memogate' controversy and Mr Haqqani has vowed to challenge the allegations in evidence to the commission. He told The Daily Telegraph the allegations against him are false and part of a "psychological war" against the government of President Zardari and Prime Minister Yusuf Raza Gilani by "certain powerful quarters."

Analysts said the row is part of a feud between the country’s elected political leadership and a military establishment determined to pursue the matter, regardless of how deep it plunges the country into further crisis. Western diplomats fear it could eventually bring down President Zardari’s elected government.

On Tuesday Mr Haqqani said both the president and prime minister were standing behind him and were determined to stay and challenge the allegations. He was speaking after his lawyer, Pakistan's top human rights lawyer Asma Jahangir, revealed he had taken refuge in the prime minister's residence for fear that the ISI intelligence agency would force him to make a false statement on the affair.

He told The Daily Telegraph he had only left the prime minister's residence on three occasions, each under heavy security escort.

"I'm a guest of the prime minister with whom I have had a long-standing political association. There are clear security concerns given the hysteria generated against me. Staying at the prime minister's house is the safest option.

"My good friend Salman Taseer was killed by a security guard because he heard in the media that the governor had blasphemed. I'm being called a traitor and an American lackey in the media with the clear encouragement of certain powerful quarters even though I've not been charged legally with anything," he said.

He had left the prime minister's home to go to "the Supreme Court once to meet my lawyer with very heavy security, and one day to the dentist, when I had a toothache, and to the Abbottabad Commission (into the American raid which killed Osama bin Laden), with massive security.

"If required I will appear before the inquiry commission with the necessary security. It is not what I would like to do. I'd like to be able to go to a restaurant or visit my family," he added.

Friends of Mr Haqqani said he has been alarmed by repeated suggestions that "his noose is tied" or that he may turn "approver" and give evidence implicating President Zardari in the affair in exchange for immunity.

They said none of the evidence against him – mainly BlackBerry message exchanges with Mansoor Ijaz – prove authorship or knowledge of the alleged memo to oust Pakistan's military leadership.
"The president and prime minister are firmly standing behind me and the government is not going anywhere. This is psychological warfare against the government," he said.

Husain Haqqani interview: 'If I leave my house, I fear I will be killed' - Telegraph

Okay, the first thing, you obviously didnt care to read the whole article word to word and chose to make an oxymoron statement

Now Ambassador Haqqani is being protected by the commandos who protect Prime minister and President. These commandos include civilian as well as military ones. Around 50-60 commandos are assigned to protect Mr.Haqqani. Now instead of making rhetorical statements and false and bias accusations, you should pay more attention on reading word to word article .Thank you.
 
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Thanks. Just out of curiosity, did you try to file charges in the police after you were beaten? To complain to any authority?

---------- Post added at 11:15 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:14 AM ----------



The remarks of Haqqani and his lawyer clearly suggest it. Otherwise why he lives in PM House?

It could be done precisely to make people suspect the army and not press for the memo case
 
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(Reuters) - Pakistan's former envoy to the United States, Husain Haqqani, is no stranger to intrigue. But even he didn't anticipate finding himself effectively imprisoned amid a scandal involving a shady memo, a businessman with unclear motives and allegations of treason.

He is caught up in a tense stand-off between Pakistan's civilian leaders and its generals over a memo that accused the army of plotting a coup after the U.S. raid that killed Osama bin Laden last May.

Now fearing for his life, he has taken refuge in the opulent hilltop home of Prime Minister Yusuf Raza Gilani in Islamabad.

The scandal broke three months ago when businessman Mansoor Ijaz, writing in a column in the Financial Times, said a senior Pakistani diplomat had asked that the memo be delivered to the U.S. Defense Department for help in reining in the military.

Ijaz later identified the diplomat as Haqqani, who was never liked by the military for his strong advocacy of civilian supremacy. No evidence has emerged that the military was plotting a coup and the Pentagon at the time dismissed the memo as not credible.

Haqqani returned to Pakistan in November and resigned as ambassador in a bid to end the crisis. He denies that he had anything to do with the memo and says he is fighting the traditional foes of civilian government in Pakistan.

"Since the 1980s, there are powerful interests within the permanent state apparatus as well as outside who want to control the definition of what it means to be a Pakistani patriot," Haqqani told Reuters Friday at the prime minister's residence.

He avoided naming the powerful Directorate of Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI), but it was clear he considers parts of the military spy agency responsible for his troubles in a scandal that the media has dubbed "memogate."

Pakistan's Supreme Court set up a judicial commission last week to investigate the memo, keeping Haqqani nervous.

He has some allies still in Washington. Senators Mark Kirk, John McCain and Joe Lieberman issued a joint statement on Thursday decrying his treatment.

"We are increasingly troubled by Ambassador Haqqani's treatment since he returned home to Pakistan, including the travel ban imposed on him," the senators said.

"We urge Pakistani authorities to resolve this matter swiftly and consistent with civilian rule of law and to prevent the judicial commission investigating Ambassador Haqqani from becoming a political tool for revenge."

CIVIL-MILITARY FRICTION

"Memogate" encapsulates the two issues that have troubled Pakistan for decades, and which dominate national debate: the relationship between the military and civilian governments and Pakistan's ties with the United States.

Friction between the civilian leadership and the generals has bedeviled the nuclear-armed South Asian country for almost its entire existence, with the military ruling for more than half of its 64-year history after a series of coups.

Another takeover could further tarnish the military's public image, which took a battering after the surprise bin Laden operation by U.S. Navy SEALs that was widely seen as an intelligence failure.

Army chief General Ashfaq Kayani last month dismissed coup rumors as speculation and said the army supported democracy.

Pakistan's relationship with the United States is just as contentious. Anti-Americanism is rampant, and any whiff of collusion with Washington can lead to accusations of treason, which Haqqani has - so far - successfully deflected.

But now, the "j'accuse" brigade in the press have grown louder and more visceral, and Haqqani fears for his life should he step outside the prime minister's well-guarded grounds.

"I'm not a prisoner, I'm a guest. But for all practical purposes, I can't go out, because what if someone shoots me like they did Salman Taseer?" he said.

Taseer, the former Punjab governor, was assassinated a year ago Wednesday by one of his own bodyguards for calling for changes to Pakistan's harsh blasphemy law. His killer, Mumtaz Qadri, was lionized across the country as a hero.

Haqqani's former lawyer doubts justice would prevail in any legal proceedings against him. And merely associating with the man who once enjoyed Pakistan's premier diplomatic post is seen as risky.

"I want to meet my client either in my space, my office, or the court, or somewhere I feel is relatively bug-free," said Asma Jahangir, when she still represented him.

She refused to represent Haqqani before the judicial commission, saying it was an overreach by the court and a victory for the security establishment.

Haqqani, for his part, spends his days reading and emailing friends. He is plowing through a massive biography of Tamerlane the Great and Barbara Tuchman's "March of Folly," her opus to nations' relentless pursuit of policy harmful to their interests.

Perhaps Tuchman's book has something to say to the man who says Pakistan would best be served by civilian control of the military and better relations with the United States.

"It's a double-bind," he said. "Civilian-military, U.S.-Pakistan. I'm on the wrong side of both."

Pakistan's former envoy to U.S. caught in web of scandal | Reuters
 
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